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Old 06-08-2014, 05:39 AM   #1
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Porsche dealership service definitely has two levels..

There's the white-gloved 911 and Cayenne service, and there's the 986 service.

The 911 service is obviously no trace kind of work. No spills, scratches, perfect job.

The 986 service is bleed brakes with wheels on, get fluid all over inner barrel of wheel which leaves a massive residue only brake cleaner will dissolve, which gets on the outer re-painted rim, leave bleeder valves wet with fluid, leave two new scratches, and call it done as long as the cheap-ass 986 owner doesn't complain since he never looks under there anyway....and as long as the brakes now work as they should before Joey Boxster over here played with the brakes outside his trailer, job done.

Obviously a phone call Monday. Since I installed new rear pads, I had the rears off anyway and washed them. Took forever, was a huge mess.

I have never seen such sloppy work, and expected Porsche standards.

***Re-posted this because last one was hijacked and locked. Seems like a legit topic, hope others will join back in.

I simply plan to ask why I got such sloppy service when obviously a new 911 would not get that treatment. I hate to think there's a 911 team and a 'all other beater Porsches' team, or that new guys get to touch 986 and less. As I see it, if I am paying their shop cost, I expect a Pinto wagon to get the same clean work and attention to detail.

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Old 06-08-2014, 05:58 AM   #2
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This is a good topic and worthy of discussion.

I find that dealers are a fickle group and that its not so much what car I bring in (911, Boxster, and 944), but I get more of the "you don't rely on us (dealer) for all of your work so forget you" treatment.

Also you'd be surprised at how crappy dealer service is for everyone. My friend who runs an indy shop gets people every day who bring in cars (991's, Panamera, Cayenne, etc) under warranty asking if he can repair them under warranty (he can't) because the dealer (1 mile away) does such poor work.
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Old 06-08-2014, 06:06 AM   #3
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Circle porsche are pretty good , but they know I work on my own cars since I've been going there for parts for my cars for a while .
The parts guys and service guys are good , the sales people not so good ....
I know this wouldn't happen at circle as they clean the whole car every time it goes in .
Most times it takes them longer to clean my car than it does to do the work on it
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Old 06-08-2014, 06:54 AM   #4
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Hendrick Porsche here in Charlotte is good in my experience. They will spend time with you and get it right....even after I snuffed at 7 or 8 Boxsters I looked at there and eventually bought from a private seller- they still treated me really well when I went in for service.
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Old 06-08-2014, 07:14 AM   #5
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It really does suck that a dealer (or anyone that services your car) would be so sloppy to drip (or worse) brake fluid all over the wheels. Any mechanic should know that brake fluid will eat paint.

The service quality you get should have nothing to do with what car is being serviced.

One question, whey did they not take the wheels off to bleed the system? I have not done mine yet, but I would think that it would be much easier to bleed the system with the wheels off.

You definitely need to have a conversation with the service manager. any damage they need to take care of. Maybe they will give you a GT3 loner while they fix your wheels. Hopefully you took some pictures before you cleaned them yourself otherwise it could be a he said, she said situation.
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Old 06-08-2014, 08:17 AM   #6
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Another thing I just thought of ....
Did you not get the email from porsche cars North America asking you to complete the survey ?
Every time I have work done I get the email .
I once made the mistake of filling it in wrong as they didn't clean the car as I was in a rush and told them not to bother ....
I got emails and phone calls and had to explain what had really happened .
It appeared to be taken VERY seriously !!!

I might add that everybody at circle loves the 986 and more than one have left their office to photo it ...


Must be the pink wheels

Last edited by Ian c; 06-08-2014 at 08:19 AM.
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Old 06-08-2014, 12:06 PM   #7
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I guess for me the most disheartening thing about this experience is that I had hoped to take my car in to the dealer to get it worked on mostly so I could be the guy taking his porsche to the dealer for service. Free excuse to browse the new merchant and not get the snobby looks for driving up in a focus. Otherwise no reason to pay too much for something my indy will do for half the cost and will explain to me how he did it and recommend services for me to diy. Lets see a porsche march do that...
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Old 06-08-2014, 01:48 PM   #8
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Since I installed new rear pads, I had the rears off anyway and washed them. Took forever, was a huge mess.
Did the new pads and rotors all the around fix the noise for you?
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Old 06-08-2014, 03:37 PM   #9
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I guess for me the most disheartening thing about this experience is that I had hoped to take my car in to the dealer to get it worked on mostly so I could be the guy taking his porsche to the dealer for service.
Strange ...
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Old 06-08-2014, 05:08 PM   #10
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Sounds like it wasnt the model but the age of the car.

Are you aware that many of us refer to the dealer as the stealership?
As in they steal away with more of your money than any independent Porsche specialist?
I only go to the dealer service as a last resort or to ask them to give me a top to bottom diagnostic of anything that could need fixing. When the service rep comes out to present the findings he doesn't even try to sell me on doing any of it because he know their estimate will easily exceed everyone else by a WIDE margin. When I had this done at 60K miles their estimate was more than the market value of the car after 10 years.
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Old 06-08-2014, 05:39 PM   #11
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Sounds like it wasnt the model but the age of the car.

Are you aware that many of us refer to the dealer as the stealership?
As in they steal away with more of your money than any independent Porsche specialist?
I only go to the dealer service as a last resort or to ask them to give me a top to bottom diagnostic of anything that could need fixing. When the service rep comes out to present the findings he doesn't even try to sell me on doing any of it because he know their estimate will easily exceed everyone else by a WIDE margin. When I had this done at 60K miles their estimate was more than the market value of the car after 10 years.

Good Luck on securing any favorable rates / repairs from those guys, I'd be in a hurry to move you on your way also.

Timco,

Each dealership is different and I would imagine they are as good or as bad as the Service Rep or whoever you are personally dealing with, to paint with such a broad brush is pretty unfair.

Luckily I have only had to visit the dealership once and it was to obtain a 4 digit security code to program an additional remote fob, I was not purchasing anything and the Service Manager was more than happy to help. As a result I'd gladly utilize them if needed in the future.

Are you going to pay more at the dealership than an Indy? Heck Yeah!! Look around at their over head, they are there to make a profit (albeit a likely a higher margin than an Indy) and there isn't anything wrong with that. If their general business model includes unfair / inflated billing or shoddy workmanship word will spread and the market will eventually dictate their demise or force them to change their ways.

In the meantime, if your complaint is legitimate and able to be supported / documented call the BBB , PCNA and your state AG and file a complaint, a resolution would likely be accelerated by these actions.
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Old 06-08-2014, 06:22 PM   #12
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It really does suck that a dealer (or anyone that services your car) would be so sloppy to drip (or worse) brake fluid all over the wheels. Any mechanic should know that brake fluid will eat paint.

The service quality you get should have nothing to do with what car is being serviced.

One question, whey did they not take the wheels off to bleed the system? I have not done mine yet, but I would think that it would be much easier to bleed the system with the wheels off.

You definitely need to have a conversation with the service manager. any damage they need to take care of. Maybe they will give you a GT3 loner while they fix your wheels. Hopefully you took some pictures before you cleaned them yourself otherwise it could be a he said, she said situation.
I cleaned the back, not the front. No pics, was really pissed. Just wanted it cleaned up and done. Fronts still have an oil slick and a wipe of that area. Valves are still wet with fluid.

That will be my first question tomorrow. If it takes 3 minutes to remove a wheel, why not just remove them???
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Old 06-08-2014, 06:24 PM   #13
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Another thing I just thought of ....
Did you not get the email from porsche cars North America asking you to complete the survey ?
Every time I have work done I get the email .
I once made the mistake of filling it in wrong as they didn't clean the car as I was in a rush and told them not to bother ....
I got emails and phone calls and had to explain what had really happened .
It appeared to be taken VERY seriously !!!

I might add that everybody at circle loves the 986 and more than one have left their office to photo it ...


Must be the pink wheels
Circle is 3 blocks from where I stayed when I flew out to buy it. They diagnosed the bearing but I did not get a PPI. No email yet. I will check spam.
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Old 06-08-2014, 06:26 PM   #14
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Did the new pads and rotors all the around fix the noise for you?
YES!!!

OEM rotors, new Hawk ceramic pads. Zero noise. After a week, the factory pattern in the rotors is barely starting to wear smooth. Very little wear, zero dust, zero noise. They came with a dampening bracket stuck to each pad.
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Old 06-08-2014, 06:31 PM   #15
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YES!!!

OEM rotors, new Hawk ceramic pads. Zero noise. After a week, the factory pattern in the rotors is barely starting to wear smooth. Very little wear, zero dust, zero noise. They came with a dampening bracket stuck to each pad.
Yay! 12345678910
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Old 06-08-2014, 06:40 PM   #16
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Good Luck on securing any favorable rates / repairs from those guys, I'd be in a hurry to move you on your way also.

Timco,

Each dealership is different and I would imagine they are as good or as bad as the Service Rep or whoever you are personally dealing with, to paint with such a broad brush is pretty unfair.

Luckily I have only had to visit the dealership once and it was to obtain a 4 digit security code to program an additional remote fob, I was not purchasing anything and the Service Manager was more than happy to help. As a result I'd gladly utilize them if needed in the future.

Are you going to pay more at the dealership than an Indy? Heck Yeah!! Look around at their over head, they are there to make a profit (albeit a likely a higher margin than an Indy) and there isn't anything wrong with that. If their general business model includes unfair / inflated billing or shoddy workmanship word will spread and the market will eventually dictate their demise or force them to change their ways.

In the meantime, if your complaint is legitimate and able to be supported / documented call the BBB , PCNA and your state AG and file a complaint, a resolution would likely be accelerated by these actions.
It's really not that kind of issue. They were sloppy, but I certainly don't mean to drag their name through the mud over it. The service manager or rep was a great guy. I got free shuttle to & from my shop in a Cayenne hybrid, great vehicle. Treated great.

The thing is, I had just washed it. I had just bled it, left zero residue. I got a quote of $200 to flush & bleed. why shop that? Seemed very reasonable to know dealership was doing this and since it's Porsche, no worries..... it won't be scratched or guessed on. It will be treated like a luxury car and respected. Then they just charged $139. Even better!

My comment tomorrow will be that I really need to apply for a job there, because I can make whoever did the work on my car look really bad based on how I work on my cars. It was totally lazy and disrespectful. No one will convince me a newer 911 or Panamera would come out of the service bay with brake fluid all over the barrels.

I totally agree, there's way more reasonable pricing out there, and obviously better service to be had, but I do most of my own work anyway. I just don't have a durametric or a PC to run it on at the moment.

Not painting with a broad brush at all....I took it to Strong Porsche and asked to have the brakes flushed & bled. That was my experience.
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Old 06-09-2014, 05:22 AM   #17
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It's really not that kind of issue. They were sloppy, but I certainly don't mean to drag their name through the mud over it. The service manager or rep was a great guy. I got free shuttle to & from my shop in a Cayenne hybrid, great vehicle. Treated great.

The thing is, I had just washed it. I had just bled it, left zero residue. I got a quote of $200 to flush & bleed. why shop that? Seemed very reasonable to know dealership was doing this and since it's Porsche, no worries..... it won't be scratched or guessed on. It will be treated like a luxury car and respected. Then they just charged $139. Even better!

My comment tomorrow will be that I really need to apply for a job there, because I can make whoever did the work on my car look really bad based on how I work on my cars. It was totally lazy and disrespectful. No one will convince me a newer 911 or Panamera would come out of the service bay with brake fluid all over the barrels.

I totally agree, there's way more reasonable pricing out there, and obviously better service to be had, but I do most of my own work anyway. I just don't have a durametric or a PC to run it on at the moment.

Not painting with a broad brush at all....I took it to Strong Porsche and asked to have the brakes flushed & bled. That was my experience.

Not quite following you on the bleeding thing. A Motive Power bleeder will run $52.40 on Amazon and after the car is up and wheels removed you are looking at a 15 minute job to flush / fill with new fluid. I used one on my Boxster S a couple of times without using a Durametric, maybe I missed something but all seemed fine and to work well after my flushes.

On your experience at the dealership, make sure they know and the problem will likely be addressed with the specific tech. I'd be surprised if they didn't do something to try to keep you happy enough to keep coming to them, if not they would be severely lacking in customer handling skills which does occasionally happen.
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Old 06-09-2014, 06:09 AM   #18
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Not quite following you on the bleeding thing. A Motive Power bleeder will run $52.40 on Amazon and after the car is up and wheels removed you are looking at a 15 minute job to flush / fill with new fluid. I used one on my Boxster S a couple of times without using a Durametric, maybe I missed something but all seemed fine and to work well after my flushes.

On your experience at the dealership, make sure they know and the problem will likely be addressed with the specific tech. I'd be surprised if they didn't do something to try to keep you happy enough to keep coming to them, if not they would be severely lacking in customer handling skills which does occasionally happen.
On the bleeding, I was told repeatedly on here to get the motive power bleeder. My local auto shops didn't have that on the shelf so I bought a vac type that sucks uses the compressor. I thought I was watching the res very close but obviously got air in there since the pedal went soft then I only got the rears back after re-bleed. Figured it was time to have it done once right, now I own the motive bleeder. Great tool. Totally my inability to wait for the right tool I was advised to get.
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Old 06-09-2014, 06:22 AM   #19
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Hendrick Porsche here in Charlotte is good in my experience. They will spend time with you and get it right....even after I snuffed at 7 or 8 Boxsters I looked at there and eventually bought from a private seller- they still treated me really well when I went in for service.
That is my experience with the dealer here in Ottawa as well. Got new cars from them in the past but since I started doing my 'no-new-car-ever' policy I go there to get parts every once in a while and to bring my little one to see the new Porsches. Also to chat with the sales guy I know that is a great person in general.

To be fair with the dealers we need to remember they employ way more people than our indies, have way nicer facilities and so on. There is a cost to that. The dealer here for example has a beautiful waiting area, fancy espresso machines all over, really pretty receptionists and so on. My indy, a great guy by the way, has NONE of these. These do not come for free. That is why my Indy charges $85 an hour versus more than $110 at the dealer. No comparison between his monthly running costs and the dealer. Not even close.

If all you care is a deal, always go to an Indy. If you like the whole 'experience', browsing the Porsche merchandise, having an espresso, etc while you wait, and maybe even having a Cayenne as a loaner (like always happened with me when my cars were being serviced) well find a good dealer and stick to it.

That said, your car should have been well serviced and treated, no matter it is an older 986. A Porsche is a Porsche. That is at least the mentality the dealer over here has. Keep that in mind. Not all dealers are the same.

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Old 06-09-2014, 11:36 AM   #20
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The Pealership in Shanghai have very (very) high cleanness standards. Tools, garage, docs, computers, all is surgically cleaned regularly. I know, I have the privilege to know someone there that allows me to visually assist the mechanic when my car is on their lift. Floors are impeccable and cleaned every 15min on average. Spotless clean and professional.

Thinking of it that might be the main factor why one left his messy and blobby brake job in this customer's wheel.... instead of onto his nice white/red floor area

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