Yes, Another IMS Bearing Thread but hopefully with updated info....

[nuvolari]

So like everyone, I've read countless threads and sites about the IMSB and yet still feel a bit lost when it comes to making a choice on which one to buy. Of course, the IMS Solution is the only one I feel 100% confident in using and if my car were different (don't ask), I'd chose this one without fail. But it's just so ridiculously priced. And judging from how few people seem to go with the Solution, I'm not alone in my thinking.

So, with that choice out, we're now down in the trenches of luck, preference, price and earth's rotation. I do have some questions but I would also like to hear which IMSB you guys went with and what your experience has been, good or bad. As our cars get older and higher mileage, I have to think that the statistics on what actually works or doesn't will provide new info as most of the threads I have read are quite old.

Ok, now some questions and statements:

1) My car has a dual row bearing and I am not willing to give that up for any of the single bearing choices, whether they are ceramic or not. Many suppliers sell a single row bearing that uses a spacer so that they can sell the same bearing for both single row and dual row cars. I just think that's a bad idea.

2) DOF- There are a few direct oil feeds out there. I don't think the version where you puncture the oil pump drive end of the IMS is the best way to go. Not sure that it's bad as I haven't read any horror stories but I just don't like the idea of it all.
The versions which run off the Bank 1 oil pressure has some reports of lowering oil pressure but again, I haven't seen any direct problems with this or if it actually does lower pressure. I have heard that Flat 6 tested this method and decided against it before going with the oil filter hookup but again, not sure the exact results of their testing as they like to live in cryptic land.
Anyway, not even completely sure if DOF is better, equal or worse than no DOF so who knows?

3) After struggling and changing my preference on specific IMSB's, I've recently come around to just using an OEM NSK bearing and removing the one of the oil seals. Once again, there is conflicting info on how much oil gets into the bearing and how much it needs, everything from 2/3's covered to strictly mist when running. Even experts have mentioned conflicting info in their videos about how much oil the bearing receives while running and whether to remove the seal or not. I would think by now we would have some statistical evidence on what the best method might be???

4) The roller bearing looks promising but the whole thrust issue doesn't seem sorted yet. Or I should say that the empirical data isn't out there yet. There are different roller bearings with slightly different ways of dealing with the thrust and there are differing opinions but who really knows?

5) Ceramic - Not too impressed with the ceramic options due to reported failures and other things I've read about these bearings. I guess the problems come from it being a hybrid ceramic bearing and damage to the metal races. Why isn't there full ceramic bearing? (Then the sellers could charge $1500 for it! Yes, a stab at the sellers for the crazy prices of some of these parts!)

So this is a start. I would love to hear from all, especially those who have seen many different cars, JFP comes to mind of course. Anything to avoid or anything to insist on? Or are they all basically overkill for which the simplest solution will work in 99% of the cases (92% on a single row car?)

Many thanks in advance, especially for reading another IMSB thread.

[Alan Mackew]

I have a 2003 model,so was single row, fitted on solution and rms simply for peace of mind. I think I will get a better price when I sell, off setting the cost to a degree.

[PaulE]

I've owned a 2003 S from new. Didn't know about the IMSB when I bought it, subesequently learned of it and at around 42,000 miles decided to proactively replace and "upgrade" the OEM unit with the LN Single Row Pro, a dual row ceramic unit that fits i place of the OEM single row unit. The LN Single Row Pro failed at 77,500 miles. I had my original engine rebuilt and went with the LN IMS Solution. The IMS Solution is a permanent replacement. A lot of the others, like the LN ceramic bearings, are supposed to be replaced periodically. If you're not doing the work yourself, or don't want to do the job more than once, I think it's cost effective to go with the IMS Solution and be done with it!

[elgyqc]

You may have read my thread, at least you are asking all the same questions as me.
My IMS bearing replacement thread.
Another thread that I found more informative and less confrontational than most is this one.
sick of ims bearing
The proof is in the pudding though, I hope I will have the engine with the replaced the IMSB installed in a car in less than a month.

[nuvolari]

Originally Posted by elgyqc

You may have read my thread, at least you are asking all the same questions as me.
My IMS bearing replacement thread.
Another thread that I found more informative and less confrontational than most is this one.
sick of ims bearing
The proof is in the pudding though, I hope I will have the engine with the replaced the IMSB installed in a car in less than a month.

Yes, I've read most of your threads on the IMSB and related info and you are the one who inspired my latest interest in the NSK bearing so thank you for all the info, it is appreciated! How long did delivery from France take? It's very strange that it's so difficult to locate that bearing in the US, if at all. And I had the Porsche part number for their IMSB but now I can't find it and it's nowhere to be found online. Does anyone have the Porsche part number for when they actually sold the bearing? Do they still sell it? I know they didn't at first but did release one in later years.
My car presently has the NSK made in Japan bearing but I'm not sure if or when it was replaced. I think the Japanese bearings are not original but not positive. And my car has 160k miles so it's probably not original. The bearing seems in good condition but there was a lot of old dirty oil inside the IMS when I pushed in the center bolt.

Oh, that reminds me: if I go with the NSK option, I'd really like to replace the center bolt, preferably with one a bit stronger but I can not find anywhere that I can buy this bolt, whether OEM or aftermarket. Does anyone know where to find this?
Grant, have you located this or are you reusing your old bolt?
And it's good to know that the NSK bearing has the proper slot for the retaining ring exactly like the OEM version. Grant is the only one to post this info. I had thought that the groove was probably a Porsche specific modification and would not be on a generic bearing so it's good to know that a $60 bearing is all you need for perfect fitment.

Also, Grant, was there another part number on the box? The part number you listed doesn't seem to fit their normal identifying numbers and the searches in the States (and even on NSK's website) never show any availability so I thought maybe there was another number.

Thanks for the help & info....

[elgyqc]

Originally Posted by nuvolari

Yes, I've read most of your threads on the IMSB and related info and you are the one who inspired my latest interest in the NSK bearing so thank you for all the info, it is appreciated! How long did delivery from France take? It's very strange that it's so difficult to locate that bearing in the US, if at all. And I had the Porsche part number for their IMSB but now I can't find it and it's nowhere to be found online. Does anyone have the Porsche part number for when they actually sold the bearing? Do they still sell it? I know they didn't at first but did release one in later years.
My car presently has the NSK made in Japan bearing but I'm not sure if or when it was replaced. I think the Japanese bearings are not original but not positive. And my car has 160k miles so it's probably not original. The bearing seems in good condition but there was a lot of old dirty oil inside the IMS when I pushed in the center bolt.

Oh, that reminds me: if I go with the NSK option, I'd really like to replace the center bolt, preferably with one a bit stronger but I can not find anywhere that I can buy this bolt, whether OEM or aftermarket. Does anyone know where to find this?
Grant, have you located this or are you reusing your old bolt?
And it's good to know that the NSK bearing has the proper slot for the retaining ring exactly like the OEM version. Grant is the only one to post this info. I had thought that the groove was probably a Porsche specific modification and would not be on a generic bearing so it's good to know that a $60 bearing is all you need for perfect fitment.

Also, Grant, was there another part number on the box? The part number you listed doesn't seem to fit their normal identifying numbers and the searches in the States (and even on NSK's website) never show any availability so I thought maybe there was another number.

Thanks for the help & info....

1 I can't remember how long the delivery took, but it was not more than a week or two.
2 The bearing in my car would seem to be the original and it is exactly the same as the replacement. I would suggest that NSK was the original supplier to Porsche. I have never seen a Porsche part number for the bearing, but if there was/is one it would probably be for the NSK part, like they do for many other suppliers.
3 I used the original bolt. The only sources I found for an updated bolt are the bearing replacement kits. Buy the Pelican kit and just use the bolt, and if you want, buy the new flange from Porsche. I asked in the forum if someone had a bolt after uninstalling a pelican kit, one guy got back to me but then it seems he couldn't find it.
4 The only part number was the one in my post. It is even on the bearing seals (perhaps in abbreviated form).

Thanks for the appreciation of my contribution. I went this route accepting that I was taking a chance, but any replacement has the possibility of going wrong. Good luck with your project... but don't call me if your engine blows up!

[Homeoboxter]

Originally Posted by nuvolari

My car presently has the NSK made in Japan bearing but I'm not sure if or when it was replaced. I think the Japanese bearings are not original but not positive. And my car has 160k miles so it's probably not original.

The factory bearing is an NSK, so probably your bearing has never been replaced.

[nuvolari]

Originally Posted by elgyqc

1 I can't remember how long the delivery took, but it was not more than a week or two.
2 The bearing in my car would seem to be the original and it is exactly the same as the replacement. I would suggest that NSK was the original supplier to Porsche. I have never seen a Porsche part number for the bearing, but if there was/is one it would probably be for the NSK part, like they do for many other suppliers.
3 I used the original bolt. The only sources I found for an updated bolt are the bearing replacement kits. Buy the Pelican kit and just use the bolt, and if you want, buy the new flange from Porsche. I asked in the forum if someone had a bolt after uninstalling a pelican kit, one guy got back to me but then it seems he couldn't find it.
4 The only part number was the one in my post. It is even on the bearing seals (perhaps in abbreviated form).

Thanks for the appreciation of my contribution. I went this route accepting that I was taking a chance, but any replacement has the possibility of going wrong. Good luck with your project... but don't call me if your engine blows up!

Originally Posted by Homeoboxter

The factory bearing is an NSK, so probably your bearing has never been replaced.

Thanks for the info and help, guys.

Still undecided on which route to go regarding the IMSB but the time is rapidly approaching as I get ready to travel back to Nashville where the car is located. I'll post info about the IMSB once back there and I get it out. I was having trouble using the pilot bearing remover that many people have used but I suspect they were removing the single row bearing without the hidden lock ring. I'll fashion up a bearing puller once I get there, pull the bearing and see the condition. The old bearing didn't have any obvious damage or problems other than the gush of old, dirty oil that came out of the center opening from the IMS. Hard to believe that it's lasted 160k miles but maybe Porsche weren't so out to lunch when designing the M96.

I am leaning towards the new NSK bearing although with all the support items needed, it may not be the deal that it first seems as I may also need the Pelican bearing kit (for the center bolt) and possibly a new Porsche flange. With all that added, I'm up around $500 which gets me into EPS roller bearing range.

More research and thinking still needed, I'm afraid....

[nuvolari]

So there is a roller bearing which hasn't received much exposure although it's been around awhile, possibly being the first roller bearing. The seller claims it has unique and superior control of thrust which near as I can tell is the only aspect of the roller bearing that causes any concern. Also, the price is slightly lower than others.
So the question is, does anyone have any information or experience with this bearing? I believe the seller claims zero failures although I'm not sure how long ago that claim was made.

Anyway, please have a look and let me know what you guys know and think about this bearing.

https://www.por-ims.com/home

[Homeoboxter]

I`ve never heard of this. It`s probably not bad, I don`t see how the thrust control is achieved though. It`s similar to what I have used in my car, just I added an additional ball bearing for thrust control. I would still go with the factory NSK bearing though, that has the best reputation of all. And in your car it already lasted 160k miles and there`s no indication that it will fail soon. Why do you want to replace the flange and the center bolt btw?

Originally Posted by nuvolari

So there is a roller bearing which hasn't received much exposure although it's been around awhile, possibly being the first roller bearing. The seller claims it has unique and superior control of thrust which near as I can tell is the only aspect of the roller bearing that causes any concern. Also, the price is slightly lower than others.
So the question is, does anyone have any information or experience with this bearing? I believe the seller claims zero failures although I'm not sure how long ago that claim was made.

Anyway, please have a look and let me know what you guys know and think about this bearing.

https://www.por-ims.com/home

[nuvolari]

Originally Posted by Homeoboxter

I`ve never heard of this. It`s probably not bad, I don`t see how the thrust control is achieved though. It`s similar to what I have used in my car, just I added an additional ball bearing for thrust control. I would still go with the factory NSK bearing though, that has the best reputation of all. And in your car it already lasted 160k miles and there`s no indication that it will fail soon. Why do you want to replace the flange and the center bolt btw?

Well I’ve heard how the center bolts are a weak spot and I’m having trouble getting my bearing out using an internal puller. So I might need to pull it using the center bolt and that has been known to break when using it to pull the bearing.
As for the flange, mine has some pitting on the surface that goes inside the bearing. I know that’s not spinning and merely holds the center race of the bearing but still it’d be nice to replace.
So you’re using two bearings in your car? I was actually thinking of doing that or trying to find a dual row bearing with one row of roller bearing and the other with ball or conical to support the thrust. Of course, with one look at bearing catalogs, I gave up on that! Those catalogs are not pleasant or easy to navigate for the layman!
Do you have a thread on your installation? I’ve read many of your threads and seen your helpful comments on other threads but I haven’t seen anything about a two bearing setup.
Anxious to see the details….

[Homeoboxter]

Originally Posted by nuvolari

Well I’ve heard how the center bolts are a weak spot and I’m having trouble getting my bearing out using an internal puller. So I might need to pull it using the center bolt and that has been known to break when using it to pull the bearing.
As for the flange, mine has some pitting on the surface that goes inside the bearing. I know that’s not spinning and merely holds the center race of the bearing but still it’d be nice to replace.
So you’re using two bearings in your car? I was actually thinking of doing that or trying to find a dual row bearing with one row of roller bearing and the other with ball or conical to support the thrust. Of course, with one look at bearing catalogs, I gave up on that! Those catalogs are not pleasant or easy to navigate for the layman!
Do you have a thread on your installation? I’ve read many of your threads and seen your helpful comments on other threads but I haven’t seen anything about a two bearing setup.
Anxious to see the details….

It`s a weak spot when you use it for pulling the bearing or when you overtighten the nut on it. Otherwise the load on the center bolt is very low in the 2 row application. There`s lengthy thread is in the show&tell section.

[elgyqc]

Originally Posted by nuvolari

So there is a roller bearing which hasn't received much exposure although it's been around awhile, possibly being the first roller bearing. The seller claims it has unique and superior control of thrust which near as I can tell is the only aspect of the roller bearing that causes any concern. Also, the price is slightly lower than others.
So the question is, does anyone have any information or experience with this bearing? I believe the seller claims zero failures although I'm not sure how long ago that claim was made.

Anyway, please have a look and let me know what you guys know and think about this bearing.

https://www.por-ims.com/home

First time I've heard of this bearing also. Their technical documentation is impressive. I'm not sure that I agree the lack of lubrication plays no role in failures... given that the last 2 IMSBs that I looked at were almost dry. I would consider this bearing, but, for me, replacing the original bearing with a new NSK (with the outer seal removed) is still best when cost is taken into consideration.