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Old 02-12-2018, 08:47 PM   #1
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Joy! Tiptronic emergency / end run

Ok.
Car back from coolant fix, less than 80miles later I move to my next problem.
I went for a drive out and slowly, the transmission started playing up.
It would slip on 2nd and 3rd in both drive and manual (tiptronic) occasionally clunking into gear.
On long straights, no problem.
When I got into town it stalled at traffic lights. At this point I realised I was heading to my next expensive problem.
I turned round to head home as delicately as I could.
Unfortunately, I live at the top of a very large steep hill. As I was coming to the top of it, the gears were slipping a lot more and eventually I got a (i think) "Tiptronic Emergency or End Run" on the dash.
The car stuck in gear with "4" flashing on the dial.
I got over the hill and parked up, the car stalled again and when started wouldn't release from gear.
I disconnected the battery to reset the system and at least now the car doesn't stall in reverse or drive but unfortunately, when I try reverse or drive, it engages but grinds when i find the biting point to move. Naturally, I don't force it to go and i just put it back in park and turn off!
From reading posts, I guess a change of tranmission oil and filter is now my first choice but on a scale of 1 (being good) 10 (being bad) how much trouble am I in?
4 months I've had this car, less than 800 miles driven and I've spent over 1500 in fixes so far.
Gutted isn't good enough!!
Hope someone can help

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Old 02-13-2018, 02:21 AM   #2
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You need to scan for codes.
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Old 02-18-2018, 09:29 PM   #3
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Thanks JFP
Arranging to borrow a colleagues OBDII scanner.

Hopefully will be good enough to tell me whats wrong and then I'll post again.
If not, is the Autel Autolink the one to go for?
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Old 02-20-2018, 01:16 AM   #4
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I ran an OBDII test and the car came up with no faults.
Other interogations of the system came up ok (manufacturer - Porsche, VIN number etc) so I assume the OBDII and Torque software is talking to the car ok?

Funny though...
I've been in the UK for 10days and the car hasn't moved from the spot at the top of the street where it came to rest after it's transmission "mishap".
I tried to unlock with the phob but it wouldn't work. I unlocked with the key and the problem i've been having with the window not dropping the 1/4 inch to get in had gone! (another thread on this!)
Yay! Although when I locked up again later, the 2 beeps and driver side not dropping started happening again! no yay! I'll come back to this one after I get the thing moving again!

Little bit of good news
When I started the car to test OBDII, I tried gear... it engaged and started to bite in both reverse and first!
I thought I'd risk moving it onto the drive. It drove in first (i went slow) then I backed up ready to go over my pretty steep curb and reverse into the driveway.
It just got there. By the time I'd got over the lip, it was just reving and not engaging (lost drive reverse and first again) and sounding not right again but at least I was in the property.
I put in neutral and pushed into where I wanted it after that. It's inside and safe so a bit of a weight off my mind and on a flat surface ready for me to work on it

The good things I take from it are:-
At least the transmission had not locked fully or broken and even though it engaged for a mere few meters, at least it did!
Also, when in neutral it is disengaged so again allowing me to push, it's not locked.
Engine turns over fine

I've got on order an oil pump ready for a transmission oil change and I'm ordering a good supply of trans oil and a filter later. 4 axle jacks and an oil tray ready to go and a digital temperature checker!

With no errors displayed, is this the best first course of action?
Hope someone can again advise.
Mike
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Old 02-20-2018, 04:08 PM   #5
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Just an FYI and a very minor one at that...after 7 days, one must unlock the car manually. Once done, the fob works againl
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Old 02-20-2018, 05:04 PM   #6
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And we will all assume that you have already seen the bit about the auto tranny here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94Rj9Gsz-RQ
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Old 02-20-2018, 05:46 PM   #7
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Old 02-20-2018, 05:57 PM   #8
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Does the code scanner that you used read codes from the transmission control unit? Often the inexpensive scanners will only read the basic codes from the engine computer and the TCU is a completely separate module.

My hunch is that you have a stuck or failing solenoid. My 'hunch' is as useful as someone telling you its the IMS. Unless you can do a proper scan, you may be wasting money with fluid.
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Old 02-20-2018, 09:38 PM   #9
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Just throwing in my 2 cents here (as another Tiptronic owner)... (not an expert though)...

First, if you are planning to change the fluid and filter, be sure to follow the procedure from the 101 Boxster Projects book (the procedure is also available as an article on the Pelican website - you just have to find it).

Be SURE to use ONLY Pentosin ATF-1 fluid. It's the original factory fluid, and if you use anything else, you might be asking for trouble. For a standard fluid dump, filter change, and refill, you'll need around 5 liters of fluid. When I changed mine I bought the 5 liter size from Amazon. Currently listed as $69.21 USD. (see attached picture)...

You'll need a few extra tools to do the job... a fluid pump (to refill the transmission) and an infrared thermometer to tell when it's at exactly the right temperature. Plus some hex and Torx bits you might not already have. The tools you need are spelled out in the Pelican article.



Your remote will stop working after about 5 days and you will have to use your key to enter the car. The car does this to conserve battery power.

Also, most generic code readers will only talk to the engine computer. It usually takes a Porsche specific tool (like a Durametric or Porsche factory scan tool) to communicate with the other computers in your car (like the transmission, ABS system, A/C system, IP, etc). Hooking up a generic scan tool (or an app like Torque) is not going to talk to the transmission, and that's what I think JFP was talking about when he said you need to read the codes. You need to read the transmission fault codes. The reason you aren't seeing any fault codes is because what you have is only capable of talking to the engine computer.
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Last edited by BirdDog; 02-20-2018 at 09:46 PM.
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Old 02-21-2018, 06:23 AM   #10
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Thanks for the replies guys.
Input is REALLY appreciated.

Wow, things you learn. 5 days before you have to open the car with the key!

Fault code reader.
Totally get where you're all coming from.
The app I was using (Torque) is peanuts so going to need something more.
What is the cheapest (I wish money was no object) one that would do the job?
I've been doing homework and there seems to be a debate re Durametric and Autel?
anyone know if this one would do?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Autel-Maxidiag-Elite-MD802-4-System-Auto-Diagnostic-Tool-OBD2-Fault-Code-Reader/322740819503?hash=item4b24da162f:g:EB8AAOSwqYhZu3n b

The downside is I cannot now drive my car to a garage to get codes read.
I could try and find someone to come out with a laptop but considering I'm on a small island - Cyprus, it does have a Porsche dealer but I can't imagine many (if any) Porsche independents and I certainly am not taking it back to the garage that "fixed" my coolant leak seeing as within 40 miles I went from a PERFECT transmission to a dead one. I'm 30mile inbetween two cities, so it's likely to cost... but may have no choice

Replacing transmission fluid
I'm in no illusion everything will go as easy as it did for Edd China as my luck is nowhere near that good this year... but I do hope
The episode is a good guide. As is the newly delivered 101 Porsche projects book.
Do I hold off starting this until I have the codes?
I'm set with an oil pump thanks to Amazon, I obviously don't have an hydrollic lift but my boss is a seasoned DIY mechanic and has said he will help and get me up with 4 Axel Jacks and hopefully oversee the difficult work!
Will take the advice on the Pentosin. I also have a digital laser temp reader.
Even if it does not fix my problem, it probably needs doing and if anything needs working on, if the oil is good then hopefully it can be saved and used again.

As said, much appreciated. I'm just about sleeping again without staying awake seeing ££££$$$!!

Last edited by mikeyg; 02-21-2018 at 06:43 AM.
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Old 02-21-2018, 11:16 AM   #11
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+1 to everything BirdDog posted.

I have the Autel MD802 and it will work well. I also have a Chinese Clone of the Durametric that I used a few times, then put away.
The Autel is easy to use, works on a broad variety of vehicles and does not require a separate computer.
A genuine Durametric is a very useful tool in the right hands. It's Porsche specific and can do a lot more than the Autel MD802, but takes a lot more knowledge and skill to use effectively.

There is certainly no harm in doing a proper drain and flush of the fluid. Just the time and expense of doing it over again if you have to go further into the transmission for the repair.

Quote:
...not taking it back to the garage that "fixed" my coolant leak seeing as within 40 miles I went from a PERFECT transmission to a dead one.
I have heard that over-heated transmission fluid will cause problems. Do you know what repair was done by the garage? Do you know if the transmission cooling system is intact and operating correctly?
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Old 02-21-2018, 11:39 AM   #12
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IME, changing the fluid will not solve this issue unless the only issue was low fluid.
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Old 02-21-2018, 03:37 PM   #13
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I have a Duremetric enthusiast cable and love it. Lets me read the status of every system in my Boxster, allows me to reset some codes (like airbag), enable some minor things (like OBC) and allows me to look at camshaft deviations, O2 outputs, etc. But I'd understand if the almost $300 USD price would scare a lot of people away. Also requires a computer. I used a Motion Computing J3500 Windows tablet computer with mine but any laptop will do (I've even used an old Dell Mini 10 netbook with it).

Autel - I don't have one so I can't comment other than to say that if it can read tranny codes, it could save you a bunch of money over a Durametric.

I have Torque Pro on my phone, and it's great for what it does (and you can't beat the price!) But as far as I know it only reads engine codes.

My generic code reader is an OTC that also allows me to read ABS codes on most cars/trucks. Really helped me isolate an ABS problem I had on my GM car. But I haven't tried it on the Boxster.

When you are refilling the tranny, the car has to be level, so it will be up in the air with all 4 wheels off the ground. I always say you can't have too many jackstands/jacks under it. Besides jackstands on each corner, it wouldn't hurt to put an extra jack or two under there as backup...

I'm with Paul - unless you have a low fluid level, changing the fluid probably won't fix your problem. Then again, I have heard of them slipping if the fluid is burned/too old. Or maybe the filter is clogged... Either way, it can't hurt to change the fluid and filter, and it will eliminate that as a possible cause.

But like JFP said, you really need to read the codes...
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Old 02-22-2018, 02:00 AM   #14
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Ordered the Autel 802 so hopefully it'll be a swift delivery out here via forces BFPO!
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Old 03-07-2018, 05:50 AM   #15
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Hi guys.
Right, my Autel link arrived today so connected up and had a look.
From the transmission / Tiptronic section of the diags I got these listed:-

82 Pressure Regulator 3
0 - Please refer to service manual
24 - Please refer to service manual
6 - please refer to service manual

I don't have a service manual. Is it online anywhere that someone can point me in the direction of or...
Could one of you kind people let me know what it means?

Many thanks
Mike
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Old 03-07-2018, 08:47 AM   #16
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The only one of the codes that I found in the Tiptronic diagnosis section of the service manual was 82 (Porsche DTC 82, OBD II P1823), "Pressure regulator 3, Open circuit/short circuit to ground, short to B+."

I don't know anything about this stuff, but if it's going to cost thousands for a shop to fix anyway, I wouldn't fear digging in and seeing if I could make it better...

After noting the codes, I would clear the codes, try driving (no farther than I would want to push the car) and see what happens.

For the Pressure Regulator faults 80, 81, 82, and 83, the manual says:

"1. Check the pressure regulator with wiring. To do this connect an ohmmeter to the control module connector and measure the resistance:"
-Pressure regulator 3 is measured from pin 52 and pin 29. "Nominal value: 5 ... 10 Ohms."
***Page 37-3 of the Bentley Manual shows the numbering of the pins.
(Other pressure regulators: pressure regulator 1 is pin 52 - pin 5, 2 is pin 52 - pin 1, 4 is pin 52 to pin 4.)

"2. Check the wiring from the control module connector pins 1, 4, 5, and 29 to the 16 pole connector pins 3, 11, 2, and 7 for continuity, short to ground and short to B+."
***For pressure regulator 3, that's just pin 29 on the control module connector to pin 7 on the 16 pin connector.

3. [...the last step is to pull the whole valve body out of the transmission and check the resistance at the pressure regulator itself, 5 ... 10 Ohms.]

What is not mentioned is that a faulty TCU may be the problem.

Here is a link to download the parts manual directly from the manufacturer, ZF:
https://www.zf.com/global/media/zf_media/document/int_print_catalogs_documents/usa_4/5hp19flporsche.pdf
Lots of good diagrams and info including the fluid service procedure.

If you want to really get into the transmission, there are some great YouTube videos by Jeff Richardson rebuilding the BMW version of the transmission (very similar to ours).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9foaj6Q-gE
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Old 07-01-2018, 10:12 AM   #17
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Update...
After being away a long time i finally got my car back today.
The mechanic dropped the Atf and he said instead of 9 litres or so of nice fluid he got about a litre of what he described looked like a Frappe from a coffee shop!
The cooler was knackered and needed replacing(1st one took 3 weeks to get to Cyprus and was the wrong one! 3 weeks later right one arrived!), solinoid, new atf filter and gasket and an absolute shed load of fluid (he did several flushes with cheaper fluid before final flush and refilling with the expensive proper stuff) had the car back up and running for €1300.
He said i was lucky (although i told him luck and that car shouldnt really be in the same sentence!) That with that little fluid, it didnt do more serious damage to the gearbox.
Glad to have it back.

Now onto the alarm/lock not resetting properly and making the driver door window not drop the quarter inch when opening every now and again!
No doubt I'll start a new thread on that in a few days!

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