BoxsterLS376 introduction - LS3 conversion :)

[Smallblock454]

Thanks for the info, John.

Well, i have to admit that i have no idea how to solve that in an easy way.

Regards, Markus

[JRL]

Hey JJ did Steve have a good solution for your axle problems.

Did you get the video links and pictures I sent you?

[BoxsterLS376]

Originally Posted by JRL

Hey JJ did Steve have a good solution for your axle problems.

Did you get the video links and pictures I sent you?

Hey Randy,

Yes I did, very cool!

I spoke with Steve and while I'm sure what he does will improve the situation, I'm not sure i'll be 100% happy with it. Basically supplying factory axles which he would then be "race prepping" the outer CV joint. That is all he wants to do which is basically changing to a chromoly cage and put in "good" axle grease. Not sure that is going to solve my problems, but rather buy a bit more time.

A big part of my concern is the wear on the outer CV housing as this is causing me to wear out the axles in about 3,000 miles or less. Steve basically said I could expect to get 3x more life out of them which is roughly 9,000 miles, then I have to find a new set of factory axles, rinse and repeat.

I am going to talk to fabrication shop near by and throw some ideas at them to see if I can come up with a better solution. By better I mean longer lasting, stronger and easily replaceable or able to be rebuilt by me rather then having to send them back off to Colorado or wherever.

I am also going to talk with them about producing V6/V8 conversion parts. I've been looking around lately and am thinking that the newer 3.6L V6 from the 2012+ Camaro could be a good replacement for bad 986 motors. They make 323 HP, are pretty compact so hopefully the conversion could be done without any cutting of the existing structure and from what I can see used motors are fairly cheap and plentiful. Just be a matter of the full integration with wiring etc. which means you likely need a throttle pedal etc. and I don't think Chevy makes a plug and play type setup for the V6 motors like they do the V8s. I'll start another thread on that once I gather a bit more info.

Thanks
J

[Ben006]

A v6 swap would definitely be a good idea!
Lighter, smaller, sounds good (to me at least), plenty of power, and probably cheaper to get!
And you'll get the Cv axle more aligned since the engine will be shorter!

[BoxsterLS376]

Originally Posted by Ben006

A v6 swap would definitely be a good idea!
Lighter, smaller, sounds good (to me at least), plenty of power, and probably cheaper to get!
And you'll get the Cv axle more aligned since the engine will be shorter!

Thanks for the feedback Ben,

Hopefully the axles wouldn't be an issue! It does look like an interesting opportunity as it "should" be an easier install etc. Right now Chevy does not seem to be offering a "crate" version but used ones seems to be available for around $2K~

Plus you could still get crazy if you wanted as it looks like the mounting for the V6/V8 would be very similar so if you wanted to upgrade later that could be an option... Of course I found a company out there who is making a twin turbo kit for the Chevy V6 and making 575HP so that could be an option too!

I'm definitely spinning the wheels on this one so any other feedback would be appreciated.

Thanks!
J

[BoxsterLS376]

Well I went over and talked with my engineering/CNC guy and looks like my initial "economic" thoughts are pretty much out the window I'm about to give up on this, I don't know if there is going to be any inexpensive way to completely solve this.

Does anyone know what size the outer CV joint are on later model Boxsters/Caymans? Mine is about 104mm and I need to be able to fit a 108mm in it.
Would later model rear suspensions/wheel carriers stuff bolt up to an earlier car?

Does anyone have a low mileage set of factory S axles laying around? Mine are shot but may be able to get some 60K~ axles, if anyone can do better then that get in touch.

[JEhunter]

John - I did a little research on the GM V6 (Camaro) motor after our call today.

2012-2015 Camaro V6. 'LFX' 3.6L aluminum motor/aluminum heads DOHC. It makes 323 HP @ 7200 rpm and 278 Lb-ft @ 4800 rpm. I couldn't find the weight on the motor but my guess is that it's lighter than the stock Boxster 3.2L.

I'll see if I can find some dimensions on the V8 so we can compare them to the LS. This could be pretty sweet build

I found the weight. GM claims 345 Lbs and Porsche show the boxster motor weight at 399 lbs. So, the LFX looks to be about 54 pounds less...

[BoxsterLS376]

I agree, I think it would be a great replacement option! Finally got a call back from the V8 Miata guys and they are pretty tied up with other projects until later this year. I was told they have already come up with an adapter plate setup which is there own custom doing and not a Kennedy Engineering piece, although that is about all I got from them. I've got a message in to their Engineer who is up in Tennessee so hopefully he will call me back.

I also put a message out to Kennedy Engineering but no word back yet. My fabricator could definitely come up with a good mounting system but an adapter plate and clutch setup may be asking a bit much.

Next step I think is to figure out some dimensions as I'm pretty sure there will be some height clearance issues. See how bad we are off and figure out options to correct it. Might be as easy as modifying the engine cover or may take a redesign of the intake manifold.

Between the adapter plate and clearance I think those are the biggest issues. A few other variables to work out with regards to the fuel system etc. but nothing major I think.

I think it can be done. Let's figure it out
J

[BoxsterLS376]

Looks like Kennedy Engineering has an adapter plate setup and clutch available, but you need a special tool to modify the transmission apparently which they have available to rent so it is do-able.

I'll try and stop by my fabricator guy and see what it may take to come up with a mounting system for it...

[JEhunter]

John, I noticed in another post that you talked about doing the LFX swap in a non 'S' boxster. I like that idea because there are so many more non 'S' cars out there and the prices are getting super cheap. Other than the 6 speed tranny, why would the 'S' car be better for the LFX? In my opinion, you're going to upgrade the brakes anyway and then a suspension upgrade is probably a close second in any car...

[JRL]

Originally Posted by JEhunter

John, I noticed in another post that you talked about doing the LFX swap in a non 'S' boxster. I like that idea because there are so many more non 'S' cars out there and the prices are getting super cheap. Other than the 6 speed tranny, why would the 'S' car be better for the LFX? In my opinion, you're going to upgrade the brakes anyway and then a suspension upgrade is probably a close second in any car...

You would also need to upgrade the cooling but I see where you are coming from. Renegade actually used a non-S car for their prototype.

[BoxsterLS376]

At this point I don't think i'll be pursuing any more Boxster projects, i'm already in the hole to deep on this one. Unfortunately I don't have an endless bag of money to try new things, and personally I have no real interest in a "V6" boxster, just thought it would be a good option for people to keep these cars going.

V8 car is going to be put onto Ebay soon to hopefully find someone who will enjoy it as much as I have. Hopefully they will have the time and money to finish off the gearbox/drivetrain then the car will be 100% awesomeness.

While i've had my fair share of cars I know i'm not the most experienced out there, but I've put almost 5000 miles on the V8 car and must say, it is the best car I have ever owned.

I appreciate everyone following along on my crazy little adventure. Hopefully I've been able to help some of you out along the way, either with your projects, or your decision to take it on at all This is the end of the road for this project... I'm tapped out.


J

[shockandawe]

Thanks John for everything I learned a lot from your build. I was gonna do the same swap to, but since you had some troubles and the cost I decided sell boxster. I have now purchased 996 which is cheaper to do , has less problems and can handle the power.Again your post gave me a road map on how the swap is done. good luck.

[BoxsterLS376]

Originally Posted by shockandawe

Thanks John for everything I learned a lot from your build. I was gonna do the same swap to, but since you had some troubles and the cost I decided sell boxster. I have now purchased 996 which is cheaper to do , has less problems and can handle the power.Again your post gave me a road map on how the swap is done. good luck.

You are quite welcome. Unfortunately this is the exact reason I have lost interest in pursuing further modifications/kits for the Boxster. Reality is that spending that much money on a Boxster just does not make much financial sense for most people as they are not/do not hold their value like a 911 and never will.

Even though IMHO the Boxster/Cayman is a much better platform, now that Porsche has started to wise up and offer some engines with a reasonable amount of power in them the V8 swaps make less and less sense. Although there is no replacing that V8 sound, which reminds me I need to take off those stupid mufflers, the car is so much more fun to drive when it is loud as hell

I imagine a 911 swap would be easier, hopefully I can sell the V8 Boxster and get to figuring out the next project soon. Not sure if i'll do another swap or just try and build a fast fun car with a 996TT, or a Cayman set up for 1/2 mile drag racing? Who knows~

[Smallblock454]

Hello John,

if you will start another project and document it i would appreciate if i could follow it. Always liked this thread and the 986 V8 and even the V6 idea.

Hope you'll find a new owner for the V8 986 rocket soon.

Regards from Germany
Markus

[JRL]

JJ I think you hit the nail squarely on the head - the Boxster swap is too costly. I was seriously looking to have you do a swap until I started adding up the numbers - shocking

I bought bought a 2013 Boxster S instead. A one owner PDK car with 4340 miles and 16 months warranty remaining. I bought the car for not much more than what the V8 conversion would have cost.

I have talked to several other folks that convert tired Porsche's into V8 monsters - the 911 platform is the ticket and to a lesser extent the 914. None of them use Renegade they do their own stuff.

Many thanks for sharing this build with us - it was enjoyable and sadly an eye opener. Let me know what your next project is.

[FauxDiablo]

Originally Posted by Qmulus

Well, that is an Audi V8 along with an automatic, not a Chevy LSx. Audi V8s are pretty short, and will bolt up to the Boxster transmission with the right flywheel, so you may not have the same issues with the firewall that you do with the Chevy LSx.

Integration of the Audi engine with the Porsche electronics is actually pretty easy. Likely even easier than the Chevy, even with the GM Performance engine harness and ECU. I just so happen the proper engine ECU for V8 with manual transmission and no immobilizer sitting on my desk as I type this. You just have to make sure to get the right engine. You would want the 40 valve 4.2 from an '02-'03 A6, S6, A8 or S8 with the Bosch ME 7.1.1 ECU. The S cars will have a bit more hp. Those engines are also pretty light and I would bet you could use the AC compressor and power steering pump as is on the Audi engine, with just some adaptation needed on the lines. Those engines are getting cheap ($2k complete, sometimes less) with everything.

The down side is that the Chevy engine will be easier to make a lot of hp with. With the Audi V8, you will get maybe 350hp, and not much more no matter what you do. Both engines are reliable, but the Chevy would be cheaper to keep with parts available anywhere. I would say that the 40 valve V8 is probably one of the best engines Audi ever made, but if things do go south, you are looking at Porsche-like prices to fix it. The Audi engine will be a bit higher rev'ing and may match the stock Boxster gearing a bit better than the LSx. Hmmm, another interesting option.

FWIW...Audi V8 starter is on the passenger side, under the motor mount. Stock Boxster starter is on top of the stock motor, which means the starter opening for the Audi engine needs to be on the side, where it is not on a Boxster...gonna have to use an Audi transmission with that v8 Ccnversion...and aside from O1E manual trans, you might as well use the Audi automatic.

[Qmulus]

Originally Posted by FauxDiablo

FWIW...Audi V8 starter is on the passenger side, under the motor mount. Stock Boxster starter is on top of the stock motor, which means the starter opening for the Audi engine needs to be on the side, where it is not on a Boxster...gonna have to use an Audi transmission with that v8 Ccnversion...and aside from O1E manual trans, you might as well use the Audi automatic.

After looking into it more, I think that there more issues. I think you could modify the bell housing on the 6 speed to work with the Audi starter or just use the VW/Audi/Boxster five speed. Personally, I would never do an automatic.

The height of the Audi V8 for one would pose a problem, or more precisely the distance from the crank to the top of the engine. Although total engine height is very close, the M96 has the crankshaft much higher vs. the Audi engine. This MIGHT be a good thing if it would be possible to lower the transmission on the Boxster a few inches. While the Audi V8 is short, it makes up for it by being pretty tall and wide. The width at the bottom is not an issue with a Boxster, but the top end may be.

There just doesn't seem to be very many good engine swap options for Boxsters with the M96 that is fairly short lengthwise, short in height and very wide.

While I don't know much about them, I wonder if a tweaked Subaru 3.6 (EZ36D) would be a viable option <ducking> The design of that engine is much more like the later Porsche engines with a single front mounted timing chain, closed deck block, 4 valve/cylinder, variable intake and exhaust timing, mounts in the right place, etc. I bet it would even sound right. You can find them for $2k or less. That might make an awesome lemons Boxster...

[Escy]

A Cayman S box bolts up to an Audi V8 with the starter in the right place. That's what i'm using on my Audi 2.7T build.

[Smallblock454]

So Audi has built only one V8 engine ever and Porsche has only built one gear box in the Cayman S ever.

And these both fit together.

Hm.

Regards, Markus