Go Back   986 Forum - for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners > Porsche Boxster & Cayman Forums > Boxster General Discussions

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-05-2016, 11:47 AM   #1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Scituate MA
Posts: 831
Ims replacement life

I noticed the warranty on a LN ims retrofit is 75k or 6 years. Is the 6 years a real estimate of how long one of these will last before deteriorating just from age or is it just to put a time frame on a warranty, so it is not indefinite? I don't mind dropping the 2k for 75k miles but there is no way I will hit that # in 6 years. Also, are they superior to the porsche original or just a replacement?
Thanks

DWBOX2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 12:21 PM   #2
On the slippery slope
 
JayG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: San Diego
Posts: 3,354
Garage
Getting out the popcorn....
__________________
2004 Boxster S 6 speed - DRL relay hack, Polaris AutoTop DIY
2004 996 Targa Tip
Instructor - San Diego region, 2014 Porsche Performance Driving School
2013 C300, 2010 Jetta 2011 Mazda 3, 1998 Windstar - Dog van , 2004 F-150 "Big Red"
JayG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 12:36 PM   #3
98 Arctic silver 986
 
tommy583's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Upstate, NY
Posts: 1,238
Garage
Hmmm. My LN bearing is at about 60K in four years. I hope I don't have to get a new one next year
tommy583 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 12:45 PM   #4
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Scituate MA
Posts: 831
I appreciate any feedback. Just trying to get some educated opinions versus the ads I read.
DWBOX2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 01:03 PM   #5
Custom User Title Here
 
particlewave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: WA
Posts: 6,020
Garage
I thought the service life was 50k miles for at least some of LN's bearings...?
I guess it's different for different bearings.

I have a double row, so it'll stay in there until or if I see signs of wear (metal in the filter). When I get to that point, I will be replacing it with an OEM double row
Have you had a look at your flange? You may have a double row.

Last edited by particlewave; 04-05-2016 at 01:07 PM.
particlewave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 01:19 PM   #6
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: It's a kind of magic.....
Posts: 5,160
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWBOX2000 View Post
I appreciate any feedback. Just trying to get some educated opinions versus the ads I read.
The current LN recommended replacement is 6 years or 75K miles. That said, many of the installed single and dual row LN bearings have exceeded 75K miles with no apparent problems. To date, I have not heard of a correctly installed LN bearing failing at any mileage level from age or wear.

If you are that concerned about possibly having to replace it, install the IMS Solution instead. With no moving parts and a pressurized oil feed, it will outlive your engine and is considered the only permanent retrofit.
__________________
Anything really new is invented only in one’s youth. Later, one becomes more experienced, more famous – and more stupid.” - Albert Einstein

Last edited by JFP in PA; 04-06-2016 at 02:30 PM.
JFP in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 01:46 PM   #7
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Scituate MA
Posts: 831
Thanks, for the info JFP. I had read about the solution but unfortunately it is a bit out of my league. Not complaining, just saying. Either way, sounds like the 6 year number is not a definite. Thanks again.
DWBOX2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 01:48 PM   #8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Scituate MA
Posts: 831
Regarding double or single, I have no idea. It's a 2000 S.
DWBOX2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 01:55 PM   #9
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: It's a kind of magic.....
Posts: 5,160
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWBOX2000 View Post
Regarding double or single, I have no idea. It's a 2000 S.
And you won't know until you pull it apart and look at the flange. 2000-2001 cars can go either way, and the only way to know is to pull it apart.
__________________
Anything really new is invented only in one’s youth. Later, one becomes more experienced, more famous – and more stupid.” - Albert Einstein
JFP in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2016, 01:56 PM   #10
Custom User Title Here
 
particlewave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: WA
Posts: 6,020
Garage
The transition happened in 2000-2001, so you have a 50/50 chance. The only way to know is to look at the flange. I've read that you can do it with a borescope (cheap $5 eBay cable cameras work fine) without removing the tranny, but I've never looked into it. If you have a double, rest easy.
particlewave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 08:58 AM   #11
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: S.California
Posts: 2,011
The life expectancy of any bearing is influenced by how well it was installed. SO if the LN bearing was badly installed ......Hopefully yours was installed correctly.
The history of the LN installs is rather boring -nothing happening - good.
The 'competitotrs with all sorts of variations on the theme may be a much more interesting story?
I mean DOF, roller bearings and other often unspecified replacements.
Gelbster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 12:46 PM   #12
B6T
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Waterloo, Ontario
Posts: 190
The way I looked at it was this... If I have to replace it every 75k, it's not a permanent solution, so I'm going to install an OEM bearing and at least be able to determine if the bearing is on its way out via debris in the filter, and my physically checking the bearing at an interval in-between.

From what I can tell, you can't detect a failing ceramic bearing in the same way because it is obviously not magnetic, and perhaps much worse for the engine and running surfaces if the balls start to deteriorate to a much finer ceramic particle, if not all out fracture immediately and take out the engine in a few revolutions.
B6T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 12:56 PM   #13
Custom User Title Here
 
particlewave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: WA
Posts: 6,020
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by B6T View Post
The way I looked at it was this... If I have to replace it every 75k, it's not a permanent solution, so I'm going to install an OEM bearing and at least be able to determine if the bearing is on its way out via debris in the filter, and my physically checking the bearing at an interval in-between.

From what I can tell, you can't detect a failing ceramic bearing in the same way because it is obviously not magnetic, and perhaps much worse for the engine and running surfaces if the balls start to deteriorate to a much finer ceramic particle, if not all out fracture immediately and take out the engine in a few revolutions.
Also worthy of note is that FACT that LN bearings do fail regularly, but every time someone posts online about it, Jake Raby and a few of his minions immediately attack the poster and blame him, the engine or the installer. Sometimes to the point that the poster removes the post completely. Over the years, I've witnessed this behavior on at least half a dozen occasions. Very shady stuff...

I'll never buy an LN bearing.

Last edited by particlewave; 04-06-2016 at 12:59 PM.
particlewave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 02:02 PM   #14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: CO
Posts: 126
Quote:
Originally Posted by particlewave View Post
Also worthy of note is that FACT that LN bearings do fail regularly, but every time someone posts online about it, Jake Raby and a few of his minions immediately attack the poster and blame him, the engine or the installer. Sometimes to the point that the poster removes the post completely. Over the years, I've witnessed this behavior on at least half a dozen occasions. Very shady stuff...

I'll never buy an LN bearing.
I would, and did.

In fact, most of the failures were from cars where the old bearing had failed and there was debris in the engine that damaged the new bearing.

Not to say there were not bad bearings.
Tcar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 02:11 PM   #15
B6T
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Waterloo, Ontario
Posts: 190
I think the IMS Solution is the best idea, hands down. It's just so expensive, otherwise I would have gone with that and never worried about the IMS again.
B6T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 02:16 PM   #16
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: S.California
Posts: 2,011
I had a new LN bearing fail.But it had debris from a recent sloppy IMS replacement job done by the P.O. What do I mean by sloppy ? The old IMS failed and spread debris into the oilways. It would have failed the LN pre-qualification tests. But the P.O. went ahead anyway.
He should have replaced the engine with a good used one or had his engine entirely rebuilt correctly. Instead , I got to rebuild it and deal with collateral damage.
But I would not say this was an LN Bearing failure. I never even mentioned it to Jake when discussing other subjects. Fortunately I knew the whole story about the bearing and the engine so I did not mistakenly blame the innocent parties.
Also remember LN do not manufacture the deep groove ball IMS bearing , they researched,tested and then specified it.
Gelbster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 02:50 PM   #17
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 52
If you see metal particles in the oil its too late to change the bearing.
__________________
Lon Tusler
1999 996, Track Only #996
Everything Jake could upgrade, and more!
ltusler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 03:15 PM   #18
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: LB, Germany
Posts: 1,340
There are also other solutions available. For example this one from Germany. Maybe interesting for guys inside Europe.

Single row (ceramic):FVD Onlineshop - FVD10590103 - Reparatursatz Zwischenwelle "M96.Einzel Lager" CERAMIC -

Double row: FVD Onlineshop - FVD10590104 - Reparatursatz Zwischenwelle "M96.Doppel Lager" -

Toolkit: FVD Onlineshop - FVD10590109 - Werkzeug für Zwischenwellen-Lager (ZW) Reparatur -

They recommend to change it every 100.000 Km or with every clutch.

Regards, Markus

Last edited by Smallblock454; 04-06-2016 at 03:24 PM.
Smallblock454 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 03:19 PM   #19
Custom User Title Here
 
particlewave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: WA
Posts: 6,020
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by ltusler View Post
If you see metal particles in the oil its too late to change the bearing.
If that were the case, then why would LN sell the IMS Guardian? By your statement, it is completely worthless marketing hype garbage. Not even close to true, but I see that you drank heavily of the JR brand kool-aid, so no point in further discussion.

Last edited by particlewave; 04-07-2016 at 10:41 PM.
particlewave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2016, 03:23 PM   #20
B6T
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Waterloo, Ontario
Posts: 190
I feel confident with the choice I made. The 119k mile bearing I pulled from my engine was as tight as the replacement I installed so that's proof I need that the bearing design and my specific engine and vehicle usage will lead to another 119k on a plain 6204.

The ultimate solution is to eliminate the bearing altogether. As I said, Raby's IMS solution/plain bearing design is the best option for the M96. The only remaining problem is that you still have the rest of the M96 to deal with...

B6T is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:15 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page