Swapping engines

[JFP in PA]

Remove them, that way you know they are fully released; and be sure to mark where they came from because they are not all the same and you will need to replace their seals as well.

[elgyqc]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

... be sure to mark where they came from because they are not all the same and you will need to replace their seals as well.

Or remember that the number of circles on the head of the adjuster (tensioner) is the same as the guide on the block right beside the hole where the adjuster goes.

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by elgyqc

Or remember that the number of circles on the head of the adjuster (tensioner) is the same as the guide on the block right beside the hole where the adjuster goes.

Not everyone notices that, judging from the number of ones we find switched..............

[LoneWolfGal]

The clutch, pressure plate, flywheel, etc. on the old engine are original, with155,293 miles on them. I might have to replace the whole works, which would cost around a thousand bucks for a quality aftermarket setup. Yikes!. Installing the new engine is like yanking a piece of yarn on a sweater. Well, in for a penny, in for a pound...

[piper6909]

Originally Posted by LoneWolfGal

The clutch, pressure plate, flywheel, etc. on the old engine are original, with155,293 miles on them. I might have to replace the whole works, which would cost around a thousand bucks for a quality aftermarket setup. Yikes!. Installing the new engine is like yanking a piece of yarn on a sweater. Well, in for a penny, in for a pound...

Original clutch and pressure plate? Then I'm guessing the imsb is original too. 155K miles. Not too bad.

[JFP in PA]

If that cover on the lift is a compliant mat (rubber, etc.) you should be fine; if it isn't, I would get a heavy-duty rubber mat to set it on.

[LoneWolfGal]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

If that cover on the lift is a compliant mat (rubber, etc.) you should be fine; if it isn't, I would get a heavy-duty rubber mat to set it on.

Thanks, JFP. That diamond plate rubber is pretty compliant and heavy duty.

I have another question for you. It's my understanding that, with a 5-chain engine, only the bank 1 exhaust cam needs to be locked, that with the crank locked at TDC and the one exhaust cam locked, all the chains are immobile. I read that 3-chain engines do require the intake cam to also be locked. However, some folks would have you believe that, even on a 5-chain engine, the intake cam also needs to be locked, as well as both cams on bank 2, contrary to my understanding. Is that another case of the blind trying to lead?

[JFP in PA]

I would prefer to call it being "belt and suspenders" about it. Because the five chain engines have both cam tied together by the small chain, installing a single smaller locking tool on bank #1, the right bank (looking at the flywheel), all the chains are held during the retrofit proceedure. Some prefer to lock both banks, but that is not required.

[LoneWolfGal]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

I would prefer to call it being "belt and suspenders" about it. Because the five chain engines have both cam tied together by the small chain, installing a single smaller locking tool on bank #1, the right bank (looking at the flywheel), all the chains are held during the retrofit proceedure. Some prefer to lock both banks, but that is not required.

D'OH! I meant bank 1's exhaust cam, not bank 2's. I'm going to correct that right now so that future readers won't be confused (or think I'm a nitwit).

[Gilles]

Originally Posted by LoneWolfGal

Right, I meant bank 1's exhaust cam, not bank 2's. I'm going to correct that right now so that future readers won't be confused (or think I'm a nitwit).

I am not sure what is a nitwit..

But, the cam locking tool is inserted into both, the intake and exhaust cam slots, then bolted into the block (just to keep the tool from falling off).

BTY, you are taking lots of pictures, right? We will enjoy being part of your journey

[LoneWolfGal]

Originally Posted by Gilles

I am not sure what is a nitwit..

But, the cam locking tool is inserted into both, the intake and exhaust cam slots, then bolted into the block (just to keep the tool from falling off).

BTY, you are taking lots of pictures, right? We will enjoy being part of your journey

Hmmm, I understood the double-cam lock was for 3-chain engines. In any case, it's considerably different from the single-cam lock (which also bolts to the block), so I don't think they're interchangeable (see photo). I'm now setting up the workspace with the engine positioned on the lift table in such a way as to provide access to the IMS bearing and rear main, as well as both cam covers (for when I replace those pesky Variocam wear pads, a.k.a. timing chain tensioner shoe pads).

You can count on lots of photos, in addition to descriptions, explanations, complaining, philosophizing, and bloviation. Otherwise, where's the fun of it?

[elgyqc]

Perhaps there is something I don't get but as I understand it you have to lock the cams, at least, in the opposite head to the one you are working on. Personally I lock both.
You are right, on the 5 chain engines you only lock one cam on each side with the shorter tool.

[pilot4fn]

Originally Posted by elgyqc

Perhaps there is something I don't get but as I understand it you have to lock the cams, at least, in the opposite head to the one you are working on. Personally I lock both.
You are right, on the 5 chain engines you only lock one cam on each side with the shorter tool.

Isn't the reason JFP mention for only driver side bank (2) cam to be locked on 5-chain engine because:
to change the IMSB you take only two chain tensioners out - 1 tensioner for the IMS - cam and 1 tensioner for the IMS - crank.
Risk to have the chain to skip a teeth is when there is no tension on the chain.
On the passenger side bank (1), the tensioner will remain in place under tension and the chain should not have a chance to skip there while you work on IMSB.

[LoneWolfGal]

Ready for action. As you can see, I have all the tools I'll need.

[LoneWolfGal]

Originally Posted by pilot4fn

Isn't the reason JFP mention for only driver side bank (2) cam to be locked on 5-chain engine because:
to change the IMSB you take only two chain tensioners out - 1 tensioner for the IMS - cam and 1 tensioner for the IMS - crank.
Risk to have the chain to skip a teeth is when there is no tension on the chain.
On the passenger side bank (1), the tensioner will remain in place under tension and the chain should not have a chance to skip there while you work on IMSB.

Actually, every knowledgeable source, including JFP, Jake Raby, and LN, recommends locking the exhaust cam on bank 1, the passenger side, on a 5-chain engine. Regarding tensioners, it's my understanding there are three, two timing chain tensioners and one IMS chain tensioner. LN recommends removing all three:

https://lnengineering.com/files/2023-IMSS-instructions-rev-03-24.pdf

JFP, care to weigh in?

[LoneWolfGal]

Originally Posted by elgyqc

Perhaps there is something I don't get but as I understand it you have to lock the cams, at least, in the opposite head to the one you are working on. Personally I lock both.
You are right, on the 5 chain engines you only lock one cam on each side with the shorter tool.

LN's IMS toolkit includes only one shorter, single-cam locking tool, which I plan to use to lock bank 1's exhaust cam, since locking only one cam (in addition to locking the crank at TDC) immobilizes all five chains. If I wished to also lock bank 2's cam as belt and suspenders I would need to procure another single-cam locking tool.

[JFP in PA]

I agree, but make sure you have new sealing washers for the hydraulic tensioners and make note of where they came from as they are not all the same.

[LoneWolfGal]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

I agree, but make sure you have new sealing washers for the hydraulic tensioners and make note of where they came from as they are not all the same.

Noted, thanks.

[pilot4fn]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

I agree, but make sure you have new sealing washers for the hydraulic tensioners and make note of where they came from as they are not all the same.

I agree that more we elminate the risk of messing up the cam timing the better.

Anyhow, what I mentioned below is same as the Pelican Parts advices on their technical article regarding removing the two tensioners (I remebered wrong the locking of both vs. only one exhaust cams - both is the right answer):
"With the camshaft timing properly marked and the intermediate shaft secured, it's time to remove the two tensioners that pull on the flywheel-end sprockets of the intermediate shaft. The first one to remove is the tensioner for cylinders 1-3, which is located to the right of the flywheel area and is shown in Figure 77. Next, remove the tensioner that tightens the chain that connects the intermediate shaft to the crankshaft, located to the left of the flywheel area (see Figure 78). Be sure to have an oil catch pan ready when you remove these two tensioners, as oil will spill out. Next, remove the center nut from the bearing. "

Link here to the same article:
https://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/Boxster_Tech/14-ENGINE-Intermediate_Shaft_Bearing/14-ENGINE-Intermediate_Shaft_Bearing.htm

Interesting is that this above is seen as not a good practice

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by pilot4fn

I agree that more we elminate the risk of messing up the cam timing the better.

Anyhow, what I mentioned below is same as the Pelican Parts advices on their technical article regarding removing the two tensioners (I remebered wrong the locking of both vs. only one exhaust cams - both is the right answer):
"With the camshaft timing properly marked and the intermediate shaft secured, it's time to remove the two tensioners that pull on the flywheel-end sprockets of the intermediate shaft. The first one to remove is the tensioner for cylinders 1-3, which is located to the right of the flywheel area and is shown in Figure 77. Next, remove the tensioner that tightens the chain that connects the intermediate shaft to the crankshaft, located to the left of the flywheel area (see Figure 78). Be sure to have an oil catch pan ready when you remove these two tensioners, as oil will spill out. Next, remove the center nut from the bearing. "

Link here to the same article:
https://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/Boxster_Tech/14-ENGINE-Intermediate_Shaft_Bearing/14-ENGINE-Intermediate_Shaft_Bearing.htm



Interesting is that this above is seen as not a good practice

You need to be aware that when IMS retrofits all began, Pelican published "their" procedure designed to save the DIY market money, but the end result was a disaster, with far too many retrofits that went bad due to their "special procedures", some of which required engine disassembly to repair. Jake Raby developed a proven method which is the only one LN Engineering recommends to this day. We have used that exact procedure on innumerable retrofits, and never had a problem. Stick with the LN procedure and ignore Pelican.