do caymens have ims issue?

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by recycledsixtie

I believe the Cayman has the IMS bearing inclusive of up to 2008 just like the Boxster. 2009 and newer Cayman and Boxsters do not have IMS bearings. Others will have their opinions on this. Basically the Cayman is a Boxster with a roof and most of the internal mechanical components are the same.

I am waiting a few years until the 2009 Cayman is in my price range for that very reason.

one caveat on these engines, the 987.2 Cayman is missing some important upgrades that were made to the 3.8 Carrera (and 3.6 by default) engine blocks. No love for the mid-engines.
So you might want to be looking at LOW mileage 987.2 Caymans and Boxsters. Pick your 987.1 vs. 987.2 poison. Me, I like the one with lowest cost to address/upgrade.

Porsche is always coming up with new ways to screw anyone not buying GT3 which is not to say the GT3 doesn't have some pricey issues looming as well.

[jsceash]

Short answer is yes look at Planet 9 you'll find the same paranoia.

[husker boxster]

OK guys, lets get our stories straight.

The 987.1 (2005-2008 Boxster & 2006-2008 Cayman) have an IMS bearing.

In mid-yr 2005, Porsche began using a redesigned IMSB. A 2005 Boxster may have either design depending on the build date. I believe the change over to the new design was approx Mar 2005. The old design is easy to replace, the new design requires the engine halves to be split in order to replace the IMSB.

In 2006, Porsche introduced the M97 engine in the 987 line (the 986 has an M96 engine). The M97 had the new IMSB design introduced in mid-2005. That design stayed in production until the 987.2 was introduced in MY 2009. The 987.2 does not have an IMS or IMSB.

The new design IMSB has a much lower failure rate than the IMSB used from 2000-mid 2005. As usual, there are no solid numbers to go off of, but the consensus is the new design fails at a 1% rate vs the old at 10%.

That's why the IMS lawsuit only includes Boxsters to mid-2005. The new design does not fail enough to be included. Caymans were not part of the lawsuit because they all have the M97 engine.

So if you sweat over a 1% chance of something failing, then get a 987.2. You'll probably have a better chance of a waterpump failure in a 987.1 Cayman than an IMSB.

The only angst on P-9 is from early 2005 Boxster owners who didn't change out their IMSB to Jake's design before theirs shot craps. Or someone whipping up the hysteria who doesn't know the whole story.

Buy a Cayman and enjoy it. I own two 987 Ss and I sleep well at night.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by husker boxster

The new design IMSB has a much lower failure rate than the IMSB used from 2000-mid 2005. As usual, there are no solid numbers to go off of, but the consensus is the new design fails at a 1% rate vs the old at 10%.

That's why the IMS lawsuit only includes Boxsters to mid-2005. The new design does not fail enough to be included. Caymans were not part of the lawsuit because they all have the M97 engine.

So if you sweat over a 1% chance of something failing, then get a 987.2.

Yes but once out of warranty, there's no cost-effective way to replace the new IMSB short of splitting the engine apart yourself. And no 1% bearing lasts forever, even if you remove one of the seals to allow for more oil flow. And this is not just any old bearing like those in your wheels...
general mechanical engineering principles would suggest that a service-able bearing should be replaced at a regular interval. I'm baffled as to what Porsche's "plan B" was here for out-of warranty cars. the Willy Wonka ever-lasting engine bearing? If you get rid of cars every year or two, unlikely to be issue.

Whereas with the old IMBS bearing, it's a very straightforward extraction everytime you change the clutch. Or, if you go with the LNE solution to replace the old bearing type, you eliminate the whole bearing issue just like the 987.2.

In other words, if you intend to own a 987.1 Cayman, Boxster or Carrera with the new m97 bearing long-term, you've got a problem with no solution ahead of you. Best to save up for the 987.2 Cayman/Carrera/Boxster or score a better deal on a 987.1 Boxster/Carrera which has already had the IMBS addressed (the sure bet way you know if it has a serviceable bearing or not). Don't know where that leaves the 987.1 Cayman since I gather the last of the old style IMSB's were gone by late 2005.

[trimer]

Do Porsche dealers replace the OEM factory given IMS with a new OEM IMS in the early single row models or do they tell you to drive the car as is? Just curious, I have never seen anything on it. I am not sure a P dealer does preventative maintenance like that do they?

if so, for the cars up to 2005 single row - is it as easy as the LN Engineering replacement with an OEM bearing...meaning pull out old and stick in new or does the Porsche OEM version still have to split the case for single row?

Clear as mud?

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by trimer

Do Porsche dealers replace the OEM factory given IMS with a new OEM IMS in the early single row models or do they tell you to drive the car as is? Just curious, I have never seen anything on it. I am not sure a P dealer does preventative maintenance like that do they?

if so, for the cars up to 2005 single row - is it as easy as the LN Engineering replacement with an OEM bearing...meaning pull out old and stick in new or does the Porsche OEM version still have to split the case for single row?

Clear as mud?

Porsche dealers do/did not do anything; if the bearing failed, the engine was replaced, either under warranty if you had one, or at the owner's expense. Porsche also never admitted that it was possible to change out the IMS bearing without taking the engine apart.

From 1998 to 2004, it was possible to replace the bearings (single or double row); starting in 2005, the "final solution" IMS bearing cannot be changed out without totally rebuilding the engine. LN has an upgraded shaft with a ceramic tripled row for the 2005 and on cars, but very few were ever done because of the cost of the rebuild.

[husker boxster]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

And no 1% bearing lasts forever, even if you remove one of the seals to allow for more oil flow. And this is not just any old bearing like those in your wheels...
general mechanical engineering principles would suggest that a service-able bearing should be replaced at a regular interval.

Good points. I asked Jake a while back what it would cost to replace the M97 IMSB. He said approx $4K. That's about the difference in current price between an 08 and 09 CS.


Trimer - As Jeff said, Porsche used to replace the blown engine with a new one. However, the new engine contained the same flawed IMSB as the previous one, so the crap shoot started all over again. Many Porsche dealers are now authorized to do the LN replacement.

[pothole]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

one caveat on these engines, the 987.2 Cayman is missing some important upgrades that were made to the 3.8 Carrera (and 3.6 by default) engine blocks. No love for the mid-engines.

Sorry, what? The 2.9 engine isn't DFI, but all the 9A1-based engines (so all 987.2 and 997.s wet sump engines) have no IMS, have closed deck bores and revised cooling.

What exactly is it you think the 'mid-engine' models are missing?