Header options advice needed

[Cunningr]

Originally Posted by edc

Look at the catalogues for what you call ROW. These are standards parts in Europe. On 986 we only have the rear cats. Early cars only had one set of lambda sensors and later cars and both before and after.

So for the ROW cars is the cat delete pipe same as the US cars?

[986bsdriver]

Originally Posted by The Radium King

worst case, register it in the nwt - i just put plates on a full race car from 1968 up here - no inspection, nothing (no horn, no, turn signals, full cage ...).

That’s pretty savage. Insurance is likely cheaper then qc as well

[NewArt]

Originally Posted by The Radium King

now that your tech knows how to push a tune onto a car, it is quick work to get a row version of your current flash (5 minutes). if allowed by law, of course (not sure what's up in pq). worst case, register it in the nwt - i just put plates on a full race car from 1968 up here - no inspection, nothing (no horn, no, turn signals, full cage ...).

I’m no longer using that Porsche anniversary tune. I had an EVOMSit custom tune done. Seems more punchy but it’s not been dynoed yet. Since I’m getting cat CELs, I figured I might wait until I do the exhaust. That way I can take the dyno results to the tuner so that he can tweak it a bit.

[edc]

Originally Posted by Cunningr

So for the ROW cars is the cat delete pipe same as the US cars?

Don't know. You'd have to get some proper measurements or see them or a manifold side by side to see where the flange is in relation to the mounting face to head. You can see in one of the pics in this thread that that silver manifold looks basically the same as an OE Europe one.

[Cunningr]

Originally Posted by edc

Don't know. You'd have to get some proper measurements or see them or a manifold side by side to see where the flange is in relation to the mounting face to head. You can see in one of the pics in this thread that that silver manifold looks basically the same as an OE Europe one.

Yeah i tried looking under a little this afternoon but wasnt wearing cloths for crawling under neath. Maybe check it out, tomorrow. I forget i have a euro spec car, never occurred the emmisions would be different. Makes sense though.

[BYprodriver]

Originally Posted by Dave80GTSi

Assuming that yours is a USA-spec car, suffice to say here that getting a ROW tune opens up a very large number of potential exhaust options for you. Any one of which will be leagues above the restrictive OEM cats within the stock manifolds.

I am only about a month away now from wrapping up a top-to-bottom review and rework of my exhaust system. I'll end up with what I personally feel to be the "right" system for me and my usage of the car.

My intent is to start a new "What I Did" thread here once completed. But here's a sneak preview picture.

Thanks - DM

Looks good the Danks sport converters are nice.

[NewArt]

So my tentative plan is: Chinese no-cat headers, welding in 200 cell cats into my existing TopSpeed pipes, stock muffler. What I need to know is: preferred choices in these elements, placement of the O2 sensors.
Thanks for all this brilliant input, the fog is lifting!

[edc]

Originally Posted by NewArt

So my tentative plan is: Chinese no-cat headers, welding in 200 cell cats into my existing TopSpeed pipes, stock muffler. What I need to know is: preferred choices in these elements, placement of the O2 sensors.
Thanks for all this brilliant input, the fog is lifting!

If you are going for this it's basically exactly the same as a Euro exhaust system. The lambdas are in water you call the test pipe either side of the cat. One has a longer wire than the other.

Look at a picture of a Euro cat. It will have the holes for the lambdas.

[NewArt]

So I’m looking on eBay at headers: well that’s confusing, I can pay just over $100 or I can pay just over $1300. I assume that the cheapo ones ar Chinese and the platinum plated ones were carved out of a single piece of metal in the US of A. Which to choose, which to choose?
Next, the cats. I can buy 2 inch cats which can be welded into my existing TopSpeed bypass tubes (remember that video?) along with two O2 sensor bungs. That’s the cheap way. Or, I could get those pretty circuit werks pipes complete with bungs and cats for a bit more. That’s the easy way. Such a dilemma! How should I squander the rent money?

[Cunningr]

Originally Posted by NewArt

So I’m looking on eBay at headers: well that’s confusing, I can pay just over $100 or I can pay just over $1300. I assume that the cheapo ones ar Chinese and the platinum plated ones were carved out of a single piece of metal in the US of A. Which to choose, which to choose?
Next, the cats. I can buy 2 inch cats which can be welded into my existing TopSpeed bypass tubes (remember that video?) along with two O2 sensor bungs. That’s the cheap way. Or, I could get those pretty circuit werks pipes complete with bungs and cats for a bit more. That’s the easy way. Such a dilemma! How should I squander the rent money?

Yeah crazy. I was looking at fvd long tubes there like $700 range. Are you using cats for emissions?

[NewArt]

Yeah. My wife thinks I’m a dinosaur. She wants a Tesla. My life would be worthless if I ran with no cats!

[Cunningr]

Originally Posted by NewArt

Yeah. My wife thinks I’m a dinosaur. She wants a Tesla. My life would be worthless if I ran with no cats!

Haha. Dont get me wrong I am pro clean planet, and for daily driver a Tesla would be nice. However, for the 5K a year I put on my weekend relaxtion car power power power and handling!!!

I ask cause I am collecting my parts for 5he fall, bought the test pipes not realizing my euro spec only has the rear cats. So thinking i want to go headers, no cats, into the fvd sound exhaust. Was curious if at least 200. Cell cats are needed.

[Dave80GTSi]

Originally Posted by NewArt

So I’m looking on eBay at headers: well that’s confusing, I can pay just over $100 or I can pay just over $1300. I assume that the cheapo ones ar Chinese and the platinum plated ones were carved out of a single piece of metal in the US of A. Which to choose, which to choose?
Next, the cats. I can buy 2 inch cats which can be welded into my existing TopSpeed bypass tubes (remember that video?) along with two O2 sensor bungs. That’s the cheap way. Or, I could get those pretty circuit werks pipes complete with bungs and cats for a bit more. That’s the easy way. Such a dilemma! How should I squander the rent money?

In a few weeks I will be offering my ceramic coated hollowed OEM manifolds and rear sensor mini-cats for sale, cheap, if you are not in a huge hurry to act today.

Pictures show before, during, and after.

Since these are OEM cores, they are guaranteed to fit properly!

[Cunningr]

Originally Posted by Dave80GTSi

In a few weeks I will be offering my ceramic coated hollowed OEM manifolds and rear sensor mini-cats for sale, cheap, if you are not in a huge hurry to act today.

Pictures show before, during, and after.

Since these are OEM cores, they are guaranteed to fit properly!

Those look nice and dont want to kill any sales oos for you, but long tube headers flow better than the stock headers, the design plays an important role. At least that was my take away with the threwd discussing headers.

[Dave80GTSi]

Originally Posted by Cunningr

Those look nice and dont want to kill any sales oos for you, but long tube headers flow better than the stock headers, the design plays an important role.

I certainly acknowledge the general philosophical point.

However, I would put forth the counter-perspective that, for a street driven car, any potential "real world" flow-related performance differences between these and a set of equal-length headers are largely moot for most drivers.

The "stealth" stock-appearing nature of these manifolds, combined with their guaranteed-to-fit-correctly OEM construction, made them a clear winner for a street car in my book.

Nevertheless, just putting these out there as another easy, cheap, and no-fuss option for your consideration, if an unrestricted exhaust system is your final intent.

Thanks - DM

[edc]

Originally Posted by Dave80GTSi

I certainly acknowledge the general philosophical point.

However, I would put forth the counter-perspective that, for a street driven car, any potential "real world" flow-related performance differences between these and a set of equal-length headers are largely moot for most drivers.

The "stealth" stock-appearing nature of these manifolds, combined with their guaranteed-to-fit-correctly OEM construction, made them a clear winner for a street car in my book.

Nevertheless, just putting these out there as another easy, cheap, and no-fuss option for your consideration, if an unrestricted exhaust system is your final intent.

Thanks - DM

Thats a fair view but extending that view why mod the exhaust at all? Manifolds and sports cats don't give a huge amount of extra power in any case.

[edc]

Here's some 200 Cell cats
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F 152780648285

Here's the cheapy manifolds too
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F 150708724589

All in for £400.

[Dave80GTSi]

Originally Posted by edc

Thats a fair view but extending that view why mod the exhaust at all? Manifolds and sports cats don't give a huge amount of extra power in any case.

Well, without intending to get into a prolonged side-discussion on this thread out of respect to the original poster's intent, I'll just throw this info out there as my final word.

After fitting these hollowed manifolds in lieu of the stock catalytic versions (and changing –nothing- else), and then driving the car for roughly 1000 miles, I was pleased to discover that:

1) The engine subjectively revved “quicker”. Especially notable while accelerating in the lower gears;

2) The engine sounded better. Not necessarily louder, but with a neat subtle (but notable) ‘burble’ when backing off of the accelerator;

3) The engine ran cooler. The needle on my dash water temperature gauge consistently rested just to the left of the ‘8’ in the ‘180’ number, again with no other changes made, and;

4) According to my dash on-board computer, I picked up 1-1/2 more miles to the gallon (!!!) in fuel economy.

[Cunningr]

Originally Posted by Dave80GTSi

Well, without intending to get into a prolonged side-discussion on this thread out of respect to the original poster's intent, I'll just throw this info out there as my final word.

After fitting these hollowed manifolds in lieu of the stock catalytic versions (and changing –nothing- else), and then driving the car for roughly 1000 miles, I was pleased to discover that:

1) The engine subjectively revved “quicker”. Especially notable while accelerating in the lower gears;

2) The engine sounded better. Not necessarily louder, but with a neat subtle (but notable) ‘burble’ when backing off of the accelerator;

3) The engine ran cooler. The needle on my dash water temperature gauge consistently rested just to the left of the ‘8’ in the ‘180’ number, again with no other changes made, and;

4) According to my dash on-board computer, I picked up 1-1/2 more miles to the gallon (!!!) in fuel economy.

Which makes sense, you made the engine breathe better. But Art does track his car and for myself mine is euro spec so I only have secondary. But no difference between a street or track car, headers will make either perform better. Using that on the street may be a different issue. But hands down headers will privide the best performance, because of the design. I would bet fvd headers will have no fitment issues, fvd has been making headers for all porsches for many years.

Just saying just because you buy headers doesnt mean they wont fit, that is prinarily dependent on manufacturer. Fabspeed, fvd, and NHP, seem to specialize here.

[edc]

I've bought 2 sets of the eBay version linked for 3 of my Boxsters and not had a problem with fitting. If anything the thicker chunkier more "quality" ones will interfere more with the under tray, diagonal brace and power steering fluid pipe.