Ims options-BEWARE WHAT YOU PUT ON YOUR MOTOR

[ppbon]

Originally Posted by amondc

This engine had clean oil and regular maintenance. While it may have been a problem in your case it was not in this one.

I would be careful doing engine flushes on these motors, there are too many oil passages etc that can be clogged up. If the engine is that bad it needs to be taken apart cleaned and inspected. There is no "mechanic in a bottle".

... the DOF did not cause those issues.
There could have been a blockage in one of the oil galleys or there could have been an airlock bubble in the system.
The amount of oil drawn by the DOF is only 400 mL/min at max pressure (75 psi).
If idling <20psi) , the DOF will only be using less than 100 ml/min.
If the DOF was the issue, we would have tons of complaints from all of the installed units in every type of M96 and M97 engine.
Happy Porscheing,
Pedro

[amondc]

Originally Posted by ppbon

... the DOF did not cause those issues.
There could have been a blockage in one of the oil galleys or there could have been an airlock bubble in the system.
The amount of oil drawn by the DOF is only 400 mL/min at max pressure (75 psi).
If idling <20psi) , the DOF will only be using less than 100 ml/min.
If the DOF was the issue, we would have tons of complaints from all of the installed units in every type of M96 and M97 engine.
Happy Porscheing,
Pedro

Anything is possible. All I can speak to is what I found on this particular car.

[Jake Raby]

Originally Posted by amondc

Anything is possible. All I can speak to is what I found on this particular car.

Reconnect the unit and see what happens. If the symptoms recur then you can look to find the underlying condition.

[amondc]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

Reconnect the unit and see what happens. If the symptoms recur then you can look to find the underlying condition.

I did hook the line back up and the noise comes back after a few mins and the cam timing goes haywire. Everything is now removed waiting on new parts to arrive.

[Jake Raby]

Maybe you could take a short video of the cam timing and engine running with and without the unit attached? I'd like to see if what you are seeing is in line with what I have seen.

[seningen]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

Maybe you could take a short video of the cam timing and engine running with and without the unit attached? I'd like to see if what you are seeing is in line with what ice seen.

Would be interesting to see if there is a drop in oil pressure overall, or if it was just local.

Unlike Jake -- I don't donate engines to science -- just my own stupidity on track :-)

Disclosure: I've been an IMS customer since before LN had the IMSR, his 3 row system (IMS replacement?) was in my daily driver and my install picture used to be (may still be) on the LN website.

Between my mechanic buddy and I, we've done at least 25 IMS retrofits since then.

I have never seen an IMS Solution, but based on my experience with the IMSR and and 3 row bearing replacement, I wouldn't think twice about installing one.

Every M96 that I have ever owned or touched, save 1 (and that one is imminent) has an LN IMS replacement or retrofit.

So please accept my bias, but its a happy bias.

Mike

[amondc]

I would have been happy to do the video but car is apart and The IMS Solution has been ordered. Was hoping to have it back together today but will have to wait till monday.

Jake:would you like the DOF for testing to see why it doesn't work? I'm sure the customer would be interested in knowing the answer too.

Chris

[Jager]

Originally Posted by amondc

Anything is possible. All I can speak to is what I found on this particular car.

Is the oil pressure in spec?

[just_me]

Originally Posted by amondc

Anything is possible. All I can speak to is what I found on this particular car.

I am an engineer, electrical, admittedly, but the approach is the same. I have no business connection with PedrosGarage, TuneRS etc. I do know some of the individuals and therefore know some history of the testing and results, which is why i know this is not normal at all. In fact i wish i had two DOFs rather than the two (otherwise) excellent bearings i do have.

This quoted statement is very true. The OP can only speak to the car he saw. With the facts given, there is little one ca say about the DOF.

let's look at the issue. He is claiming that the DOF draws sufficient oil to lower the oil pressure/flow. He leaves unsaid the implied mechanism of starving the Variocam.

What we do know is that:

1. on many, many cars with DOF there is no problem - so a healthy engine can certainly suffer the small DOF losses (think of it a parallel resistance in the load)
2. Porsche must design with a variety of flow rates in mind, from idle to 7k rpm. Oil pump volume will vary greatly. It cannot be terribly sensitive to a small load change
3. the draw is 100ml< draw < 400ml - vastly below the available oil flow

We also know that many things affect available oil flow: pump condition, oil passage condition (blockages, sludge etc.) debris.

This can be modeled as the fluid dynamics version of an impedance match. If you have a hgih impedance (low flow) source, a moderate load will cause a drop in voltage (pressure, and, by extension, flow) in both the parasitic flow (DOF) and the main flow (heads/variocam). This in fact could have been measured if the mechanic wanted to understand the cause. Maybe it shoudl be.

The cause - to me - is very likely a motor that is already flowing poorly. The why is hard to say, but sludge or blocking debris would be high on my list to investigate.

Oddly, the DOF may have been an early warning system for a much more serious problem - automotive arterial sclerosis.

We don;t know, but speculation should be used productively and this seems to be not only jumping to conclusions, but very likely the wrong one.

Just_Me