Go Back   986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners > Porsche Boxster & Cayman Forums > Boxster General Discussions

Post Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-13-2014, 08:41 PM   #101
I am my own mechanic....
 
Timco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 3,433
Slow motion video allegedly shows KW reach out and grab TS's car..



https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=ex01w-xXcfY

__________________
'04 Boxster S 50 Jahre 550 Spyder Anniversary Special Edition, 851 of 1953, 6-sp, IMS/RMS, GT Metallic silver, cocoa brown leather SOLD to member Broken Linkage.
'08 VW Touareg T-3 wife's car
'13 F150 Super Crew long bed 4x4 w/ Ego Boost
Timco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2014, 09:18 PM   #102
Registered User
 
jb92563's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 1,665
Its a tragic event, but getting out of the car and heading into traffic is a fatal mistake, if not TS someone else might have clipped him.

Race car driving is dangerous, everyone takes the risk knowing it could cost you your life.

That kid was not mature or experienced enough and let his emotions govern his actions and he paid the ultimate price.

Accidents happen in racing.

However, we can count on the conservatives out there to take this opportunity to try banning sprint racing altogether.
__________________
"It broke because it wants to be Upgraded "
2012 Porsche Performance Driving School - SanDiego region
2001 Boxster S, Top Speed muffler, (Fred's) Mini Morimotto Projectors, Tarret UDP,
Short Shifter, Touch Screen Dual Din Radio, 03 4 Bow glass Top (DD & Auto-X since May 17,2012)

Last edited by jb92563; 08-13-2014 at 09:26 PM.
jb92563 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2014, 09:42 PM   #103
I am my own mechanic....
 
Timco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 3,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by jb92563 View Post
Its a tragic event, but getting out of the car and heading into traffic is a fatal mistake, if not TS someone else might have clipped him.

Race car driving is dangerous, everyone takes the risk knowing it could cost you your life.

That kid was not mature or experienced enough and let his emotions govern his actions and he paid the ultimate price.

Accidents happen in racing.

However, we can count on the conservatives out there to take this opportunity to try banning sprint racing altogether.
Can we leave politics out of this? It seems the left are the ones wanting to pass a new law to solve every issue from luggage fees to CA banning firearms that have never been used in a crime.
__________________
'04 Boxster S 50 Jahre 550 Spyder Anniversary Special Edition, 851 of 1953, 6-sp, IMS/RMS, GT Metallic silver, cocoa brown leather SOLD to member Broken Linkage.
'08 VW Touareg T-3 wife's car
'13 F150 Super Crew long bed 4x4 w/ Ego Boost
Timco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 03:58 AM   #104
Registered User
 
BIGJake111's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Greenville, S.C.
Posts: 2,670
Garage
Tony Stewart hits rival driver, kills him in Sprint car race..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Timco View Post
Can we leave politics out of this? It seems the left are the ones wanting to pass a new law to solve every issue from luggage fees to CA banning firearms that have never been used in a crime.

"Can we leave politics out," proceeds to post counterpoint about other side of the spectrum 😛. While I agree with you, be weary of the instigation here.
BIGJake111 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 04:09 AM   #105
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The City
Posts: 1,084
Garage
Quote:
And believe it or not - we aren't going to solve anything by arguing about it here.
Just because a discussion has no bearing on the actual event does not mean it is a merit-less discussion. This is a community forum, the merit is engaged conversation between people of similar interests. Humans are social creatures, talking about hot topic events, ideas or any other multitude of discourse natural and inherently 'worth it'.

Last edited by Lobo1186; 08-14-2014 at 04:16 AM. Reason: better
Lobo1186 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 04:26 AM   #106
I am my own mechanic....
 
Timco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 3,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGJake111 View Post
"Can we leave politics out," proceeds to post counterpoint about other side of the spectrum 😛. While I agree with you, be weary of the instigation here.
Well, to be fair, he did have it backwards. I just threw out two easy examples....

Agreed though.
__________________
'04 Boxster S 50 Jahre 550 Spyder Anniversary Special Edition, 851 of 1953, 6-sp, IMS/RMS, GT Metallic silver, cocoa brown leather SOLD to member Broken Linkage.
'08 VW Touareg T-3 wife's car
'13 F150 Super Crew long bed 4x4 w/ Ego Boost
Timco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 06:48 AM   #107
Registered User
 
Giller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Listowel, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lobo1186 View Post
Just because a discussion has no bearing on the actual event does not mean it is a merit-less discussion. This is a community forum, the merit is engaged conversation between people of similar interests. Humans are social creatures, talking about hot topic events, ideas or any other multitude of discourse natural and inherently 'worth it'.
First, I never said it wasn't worth it, please do not put words in my mouth. I simply stated we aren't going to solve it - and therefore, people should relax a bit and try not to take things too personally.
__________________
2011 Boxster 987.2 Arctic silver / Black leather, PDK with Sports Chrono Package Plus
Giller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 07:27 AM   #108
Registered User
 
jb92563's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 1,665
Im ambidexterous so my political terminology has likely been wrong as I'm not quite sure who's who anymore, but I think we all know who I'm talking about.

Its those folks who like making us do things for our own good, and want to ban things that are noisy, dangerous and fun.

Point well taken though, its the lefties!
__________________
"It broke because it wants to be Upgraded "
2012 Porsche Performance Driving School - SanDiego region
2001 Boxster S, Top Speed muffler, (Fred's) Mini Morimotto Projectors, Tarret UDP,
Short Shifter, Touch Screen Dual Din Radio, 03 4 Bow glass Top (DD & Auto-X since May 17,2012)
jb92563 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 07:57 AM   #109
Registered User
 
Porsche Chick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 560
I'm not sure I could come to a complete stop if someone deliberately walked into the front of my car.

Regardless of my political leanings . . .
__________________
2009 Porsche Boxster - Guards Red/Tan
Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary… that’s what gets you. – Jeremy Clarkson
Porsche Chick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 10:43 AM   #110
Registered User
 
Perfectlap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 8,709
Quote:
Originally Posted by Porsche Chick View Post
I'm not sure I could come to a complete stop if someone deliberately walked into the front of my car.
I liken it more to driving through a road construction crew. You decide to through faster than the other cars in front of you, as well as driving closer to the the cones. One of the construction crew is on foot past the cones and the three cars in front of you manage to avoid him since they're keeping distance and going slow enough to allow for more reaction time. One driver going fast and close, nearly hits the worker, but he gets away with it, just barely. Then comes your turn and you're not as lucky -- since you're still too close and going too fast, there's no margin of error and you both collide and the worker dies.

The real question now: as you were driving through the road construction zone, did you see that a worker was out in front of the cone as you were approaching? Important question because highway surveillance shows you turning towards the cone rather than away from it...
__________________
GT3 Recaro Seats - Boxster Red
GT3 Aero / Carrera 18" 5 spoke / Potenza RE-11
Fabspeed Headers & Noise Maker
BORN: March 2000 - FINLAND
IMS#1 REPLACED: April 2010 - NEW JERSEY -- LNE DUAL ROW

Last edited by Perfectlap; 08-14-2014 at 12:38 PM.
Perfectlap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 10:48 AM   #111
Registered User
 
Perfectlap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 8,709
This guy (apparently a dirt track expert, that none of us here are as some have stated) is reading my mind... line by line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by runjmc2 View Post
The following posted comment on the above link is consistent with what I saw, makes sense, and is from an experienced source:

"I am not a Tony Stewart fan or hater. I spent more than 9 years as a dirt track speedway official so my observations and comments are formulated from more of a black and white viewpoint rather than as an untrained fan. I saw lots of circumstances like this over the years as an official. Thankfully none of them ended up in tragedy, especially the time a sprint driver hit me, on purpose, while on the track with my line up board. I always adhered to a strict policy of white pants, red shirt even when the track did not require it.

I can tell you to start with that if you watch the beginning of the video close, you will see that Tony's sprint car never touched Kevin's. He made a clean pass. Kevin slightly overreacted to being pinched and did not lift soon enough. The terrible dry track conditions allowed his car to slide up into the wall causing the wreck and caution. These guys can see out of their cars good enough to see across the track out the front. I can not prove this, but a lot of car drivers lift their helmet shields during a caution. Whether he did or not, Tony was far enough away and making a left hand corner that he coulod see the events unfolding out the front of his car. It's a pretty safe bet that he saw Kevin exit his car up in front of him.

There is an aspect of this situation that I am not hearing anyone talking about. If Tony knew he made a clean pass on Kevin yet Kevin still hit the wall, seeing Kevin exit his car the way he did would give Tony a feeling of being falsely accused. I have seen many occasions where a racer expresses his feelings with his throttle pedal. If he yells, no one can hear him, but race car engines are loud and blipping the throttle gets attention. If Tony was feeling falsely accused for the caution, then it would not be out of the ordinary for a racer in his position express his emotion with a blip of his throttle and maybe even to shoot some dirt toward Kevin's location. Where we come into the big conflict here the question of whether or not Tony saw Kevin walking on the track. It appears that Kevin first mistook the white and blue 45 car for Tony's and stepped in front of that car to get the driver's attention. Realizing his mistake, he jumped back slightly and refocused on the next car coming down the track which was Tony's. Clearly, the driver of the 45 could see Kevin and his statement to that fact when relayed to the investigator will not work in Tony's favor. You can see that driver react with his steering wheel, not his throttle, to avoid hitting Kevin. Tony could have done the same. I have watched a lot of drivers with throttle steer setups steer around things with their steering wheel. Tony could have done that. He could have also passed by the scene much lower on the track, down by the tires and at a slower pace.

Kevin grabbed Tony's wing if you watch the video real close. I would expect that Tony's heat of the moment reaction was to "Get Kevin Off My Car" and blipped the throttle not realizing that Kevin at that very moment was getting sucked under Tony's tire. I believe it is a safe assumption that Tony never in any way intended to hurt Kevin, however, Tony's track position, speed and history of displays of anger will not play well in to his case. He still may face charges. God be with you, Tony and Kevin's family, friends and fans. "
__________________
GT3 Recaro Seats - Boxster Red
GT3 Aero / Carrera 18" 5 spoke / Potenza RE-11
Fabspeed Headers & Noise Maker
BORN: March 2000 - FINLAND
IMS#1 REPLACED: April 2010 - NEW JERSEY -- LNE DUAL ROW

Last edited by Perfectlap; 08-14-2014 at 11:03 AM.
Perfectlap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 11:24 AM   #112
Registered User
 
Porsche Chick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 560
PL- I don't think the driver killed him deliberately, if that helps any. I think both were playing a stupid game of chicken, and the car won. As it will.

The thing that keeps coming to mind for me is: What part of "don't walk into traffic" did the kid not get? This is a basic concept that 3 year olds are taught.

I've seen a similar thing at my kids' bus stop. There are kids that like to run into the road, mostly to hear their moms scream at them about it. Issue is, the stop is immediately after a blind corner. Then a car comes around the corner and everyone is incensed that the car didn't slow for the kids (which the driver couldn't see 10 seconds ago). No one was hit, but the police were called, speed traps were set up, etc. No one was cited, because the drivers weren't going too fast. And the kids continued to play in the road. This went on for literally years. What part of "keep your kids out of the road" do the mothers not understand?

I think it's tragic, but frankly, if you walk into traffic, you get . . . traffic.
__________________
2009 Porsche Boxster - Guards Red/Tan
Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary… that’s what gets you. – Jeremy Clarkson
Porsche Chick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 12:34 PM   #113
Registered User
 
Perfectlap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 8,709
Quote:
Originally Posted by Porsche Chick View Post

The thing that keeps coming to mind for me is: What part of "don't walk into traffic" did the kid not get? This is a basic concept that 3 year olds are taught.
The part that involves the science of brain imaging:

Brain maturation doesn’t end in adolescence, though. Imaging studies show the brain is still maturing well into the mid-20s, especially in regions responsible for regulating emotions, controlling impulses, and balancing risk and reward. Psychologists draw a distinction between “cold” cognition (when we are thinking about something that doesn’t have much emotional content, such as how to solve an algebra problem) and “hot” cognition (when we are thinking about something that can make us feel exuberant or excited, angry or depressed, such as whether to go joyriding with friends or throw a punch at someone who insulted a girlfriend). The systems of the brain responsible for cold cognition are mature by age 16. But the systems that control hot cognition aren’t — they are still developing well into the 20s.
__________________
GT3 Recaro Seats - Boxster Red
GT3 Aero / Carrera 18" 5 spoke / Potenza RE-11
Fabspeed Headers & Noise Maker
BORN: March 2000 - FINLAND
IMS#1 REPLACED: April 2010 - NEW JERSEY -- LNE DUAL ROW

Last edited by Perfectlap; 08-14-2014 at 12:36 PM.
Perfectlap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 01:23 PM   #114
Registered User
 
RedTele58's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perfectlap View Post
they are still developing well into the 20s[/I].
That's why we put up with Jake!
__________________
I think I have a Porsche problem...
RedTele58 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 01:58 PM   #115
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The City
Posts: 1,084
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giller View Post
First, I never said it wasn't worth it, please do not put words in my mouth. I simply stated we aren't going to solve it - and therefore, people should relax a bit and try not to take things too personally.
Classic 'you said I said' situation. I only was quoting you with my direct quote in the forum quote bubble. The 'worth it' is merely a quote of a common idiom. So I did not intend to make the proverbial 'worth it' direct quote from you. I apologize for the mix up.
Lobo1186 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 03:58 PM   #116
Registered User
 
Giller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Listowel, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lobo1186 View Post
Classic 'you said I said' situation. I only was quoting you with my direct quote in the forum quote bubble. The 'worth it' is merely a quote of a common idiom. So I did not intend to make the proverbial 'worth it' direct quote from you. I apologize for the mix up.
No worries. Discussion is great, debate is great, unfortunately, when emotions kick in, we've seen threads easily go off the rails.
__________________
2011 Boxster 987.2 Arctic silver / Black leather, PDK with Sports Chrono Package Plus
Giller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 05:17 PM   #117
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: virginia
Posts: 402
The one thing I've noticed about this forum is the almost lack of arguing and insulting of others. It's nice that there is a place on the net where most people are civil. That's what keeps me coming back to 986 forum. Thanks guys !!! :dance:
gmboxster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 06:10 PM   #118
I am my own mechanic....
 
Timco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 3,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmboxster View Post
The one thing I've noticed about this forum is the almost lack of arguing and insulting of others. It's nice that there is a place on the net where most people are civil. That's what keeps me coming back to 986 forum. Thanks guys !!! :dance:
It's almost like the entire forum is from Canada.....

So sorry, no, my bad....

Please forgive me...



__________________
'04 Boxster S 50 Jahre 550 Spyder Anniversary Special Edition, 851 of 1953, 6-sp, IMS/RMS, GT Metallic silver, cocoa brown leather SOLD to member Broken Linkage.
'08 VW Touareg T-3 wife's car
'13 F150 Super Crew long bed 4x4 w/ Ego Boost
Timco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 06:17 PM   #119
Damn Yankee
 
TeamOxford's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Dallas
Posts: 1,117
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmboxster View Post
The one thing I've noticed about this forum is the almost lack of arguing and insulting of others. It's nice that there is a place on the net where most people are civil. That's what keeps me coming back to 986 forum.
Agreed. Just don't make me post another "Group Hug" pic, OK?

Just sayin'.......

TO
TeamOxford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2014, 06:32 PM   #120
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Midwest
Posts: 1,746
Quote:
Originally Posted by runjmc2 View Post
The following posted comment on the above link is consistent with what I saw, makes sense, and is from an experienced source:

"I am not a Tony Stewart fan or hater. I spent more than 9 years as a dirt track speedway official so my observations and comments are formulated from more of a black and white viewpoint rather than as an untrained fan. I saw lots of circumstances like this over the years as an official. Thankfully none of them ended up in tragedy, especially the time a sprint driver hit me, on purpose, while on the track with my line up board. I always adhered to a strict policy of white pants, red shirt even when the track did not require it.

I can tell you to start with that if you watch the beginning of the video close, you will see that Tony's sprint car never touched Kevin's. He made a clean pass. Kevin slightly overreacted to being pinched and did not lift soon enough. The terrible dry track conditions allowed his car to slide up into the wall causing the wreck and caution. These guys can see out of their cars good enough to see across the track out the front. I can not prove this, but a lot of car drivers lift their helmet shields during a caution. Whether he did or not, Tony was far enough away and making a left hand corner that he coulod see the events unfolding out the front of his car. It's a pretty safe bet that he saw Kevin exit his car up in front of him.

There is an aspect of this situation that I am not hearing anyone talking about. If Tony knew he made a clean pass on Kevin yet Kevin still hit the wall, seeing Kevin exit his car the way he did would give Tony a feeling of being falsely accused. I have seen many occasions where a racer expresses his feelings with his throttle pedal. If he yells, no one can hear him, but race car engines are loud and blipping the throttle gets attention. If Tony was feeling falsely accused for the caution, then it would not be out of the ordinary for a racer in his position express his emotion with a blip of his throttle and maybe even to shoot some dirt toward Kevin's location. Where we come into the big conflict here the question of whether or not Tony saw Kevin walking on the track. It appears that Kevin first mistook the white and blue 45 car for Tony's and stepped in front of that car to get the driver's attention. Realizing his mistake, he jumped back slightly and refocused on the next car coming down the track which was Tony's. Clearly, the driver of the 45 could see Kevin and his statement to that fact when relayed to the investigator will not work in Tony's favor. You can see that driver react with his steering wheel, not his throttle, to avoid hitting Kevin. Tony could have done the same. I have watched a lot of drivers with throttle steer setups steer around things with their steering wheel. Tony could have done that. He could have also passed by the scene much lower on the track, down by the tires and at a slower pace.

Kevin grabbed Tony's wing if you watch the video real close. I would expect that Tony's heat of the moment reaction was to "Get Kevin Off My Car" and blipped the throttle not realizing that Kevin at that very moment was getting sucked under Tony's tire. I believe it is a safe assumption that Tony never in any way intended to hurt Kevin, however, Tony's track position, speed and history of displays of anger will not play well in to his case. He still may face charges. God be with you, Tony and Kevin's family, friends and fans. "

I've taken my boys to the local sprint track a few times over the years, from what I've seen the above is likely the most plausible description of what really happened. Tony Stewart is without question an incredible driver, that being said he has proven himself repeatedly to be an impetuous child without any ability to keep emotions in-check. No way he meant to harm Kevin intentionally, he simply F'ed up and hit him while meaning to scare / humiliate him with a throttle blip trying to spray / scare him.

coreseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Post Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:24 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page