Tony Stewart hits rival driver, kills him in Sprint car race..

[Perfectlap]

Assumptions? We're not even past the stage of answering the big questions.
While its premature to condemn him as sharing in the guilt its also unfair to the deceased
To claim his death was entirely his own fault the way this Sheriff has.
Stewart's video will be analyzed and we'll see why he hit the gas so close to the disabled car and why he was that close in the first place. It may exonerate him or it could be the end of him. But if this were anyone one us behind the wheel many would absolutely find themselves facing charges of reckless endangerment. All it takes is one prosecutor who isn't convinced of your claim that you did everything possible to avoid a fatality. That video raises more questions than it answers.

[thstone]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

While its premature to condemn him as sharing in the guilt its also unfair to the deceased. To claim his death was entirely his own fault the way this Sheriff has.

Presumably, the Sherriff has the most information. He was able to review the videotape, interview the witnesses, and interview Tony Stewart himself, all under the rules of a police investigation.

And again, presumably, the police investigation was conducted without bias.

Thus, the Sherriff's conclusions are (at this point) the best and fairest evaluation of the evidence available.

Of course, this investigation was limited to whether a crime was committed, not liability or fault. The latter will have to be decided by lawyers and courts as in the Paul Walker case.

[JayG]

Originally Posted by thstone

Of course, this investigation was limited to whether a crime was committed, not liability or fault. The latter will have to be decided by lawyers and courts as in the Paul Walker case.

and of course to no ones complete satisfaction

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by thstone

Presumably, the Sherriff has the most information. He was able to review the videotape, interview the witnesses, and interview Tony Stewart himself, all under the rules of a police investigation.

And again, presumably, the police investigation was conducted without bias.

Thus, the Sherriff's conclusions are (at this point) the best and fairest evaluation of the evidence available.

Of course, this investigation was limited to whether a crime was committed, not liability or fault. The latter will have to be decided by lawyers and courts as in the Paul Walker case.

Yes but it was too early for the Sheriff to announce a conclusion in the first place. The video that they have was reviewed and didn't move him, which is different than all the video that is possibly out there. All statements have not been taken, all the equipment in question has not been analyzed by experts in the field. And to make such a premature statement publicly where potential jurors may be watching is really a dumb idea.

This is the point where someone in his capacity would simply say "I will not speculate as this is an on-going investigation." It's been done a thousand times.
I can't think of another instance in fact where a Sheriff or Police Chief came out the day after, well before all the evidence was in. State's have limited resources and these inquiries take time.

[Perfectlap]

^but then how were cars able stay to the inside? And why wasn't Stewart one of them?

Either you're making every effort to stay from the disabled car, or you aren't.

[Giller]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

^but then how were cars able stay to the inside? And why wasn't Stewart one of them?

Either you're making every effort to stay from the disabled car, or you aren't.

From everything I've seen and read, TS is a hothead and full of himself. I really think he went high on the track simply to gloat over his crashed 'colleague' but did not realize that that same colleague had gotten out of the car and was on the track. KW should NOT have been on the track - he certainly put himself in a very dangerous situation, but TS should NOT have been running higher on the track and jeopardizing safety. There's lots of blame to go around - both KW and TS share a big chunk of it.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Giller

From everything I've seen and read, TS is a hothead and full of himself. I really think he went high on the track simply to gloat over his crashed 'colleague' but did not realize that that same colleague had gotten out of the car and was on the track. KW should NOT have been on the track - he certainly put himself in a very dangerous situation, but TS should NOT have been running higher on the track and jeopardizing safety. There's lots of blame to go around - both KW and TS share a big chunk of it.

I wholeheartedly agree. If the kid stays in his car he lives. But again he's a kid, not a 43 year-old veteran NASCAR driver. Which of us at the age of 20 weren't taking huge risks? Under ~25 you're brain doesn't yet have that full frontal lobe development that is key in running from danger instead of towards it.

The $64k question is a simple one. Did TS see the kid on the track when he had to choose between going to the inside like the other cars that managed this?
If he saw the kid, and went high he's criminally negligent. And really the only thing that can somewhat answer that question is his onboard video.

[Timco]

Originally Posted by Giller

From everything I've seen and read, TS is a hothead and full of himself. I really think he went high on the track simply to gloat over his crashed 'colleague' but did not realize that that same colleague had gotten out of the car and was on the track. KW should NOT have been on the track - he certainly put himself in a very dangerous situation, but TS should NOT have been running higher on the track and jeopardizing safety. There's lots of blame to go around - both KW and TS share a big chunk of it.

Well said. Seems in racing you're watching the car in front, not scanning the whole picture like we do driving on the road through intersections with pedestrians.

SURPRISE!! SOMEONE IS ON THE TRACK!!!

May have been a high pass to gloat not even knowing KW was out of his car.

[jsceash]

Updates show that many of the dirt tracks are implementing rules that prohibit the driver from leaving the car after an accident until emergency crew arrive. With fine and suspensions to follow anyone who does not comply. Nascar itself is expected to put a rule in place as early as today during their post race meeting.

Seems a shame that the rules get adjusted after something tragic happens and not before.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Timco

Well said. Seems in racing you're watching the car in front, not scanning the whole picture like we do driving on the road through intersections with pedestrians.

But they were under caution and no longer racing. You're supposed to be scanning for track workers removing the disabled video. that's why this tragedy really isn't a racing incident. Also, if Stewart has on-board video (there's talk it was deleted after the race), then it would show what was in TS' field of view. It would also presumably show if TS moved his steering to move away or toward the disabled car. If the deceased is clearly visible in the footage it will be very damaging.

[Timco]

How fast do you suppose they were moving under caution?

[stephen wilson]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

But they were under caution and no longer racing. You're supposed to be scanning for track workers removing the disabled video. that's why this tragedy really isn't a racing incident.

Have you ever raced competitively wheel-to-wheel ?

A track under caution, is still a HOT TRACK, and therefore a "racing incident".

Sprint cars have very quirkey handling, tons of H.P. , and a hair trigger throttle. In several forums, from people who race them, it was proposed that he goosed it while flicking the steering to try and kick the rear tires away from the victim.

[JayG]

Originally Posted by jsceash

Updates show that many of the dirt tracks are implementing rules that prohibit the driver from leaving the car after an accident until emergency crew arrive. With fine and suspensions to follow anyone who does not comply. Nascar itself is expected to put a rule in place as early as today during their post race meeting.

Seems a shame that the rules get adjusted after something tragic happens and not before.

20-20 hindsight

[Pdwight]

I think everything that can be said has been said about this tragedy

[Timco]

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Timco

If you watch the full video of that incident you see that after TS throws his helmet the NASCAR official gently pats him on the back. Apparently Tony wears the pants. .

And for the record Stewart is far from being my least favorite driver in that series.
I actually used to listen to his Sirius radio show. Put it this way if I won a contest to have five drivers over for a barbecue he'd be #1. And #2 would be whatever driver he currently likes the least.

[ianacole]

Sprint Car racers give their take on tragedy and defend Tony Stewart | News | Motorsport.com

[runjmc2]

Originally Posted by ianacole

Sprint Car racers give their take on tragedy and defend Tony Stewart | News | Motorsport.com

The following posted comment on the above link is consistent with what I saw, makes sense, and is from an experienced source:

"I am not a Tony Stewart fan or hater. I spent more than 9 years as a dirt track speedway official so my observations and comments are formulated from more of a black and white viewpoint rather than as an untrained fan. I saw lots of circumstances like this over the years as an official. Thankfully none of them ended up in tragedy, especially the time a sprint driver hit me, on purpose, while on the track with my line up board. I always adhered to a strict policy of white pants, red shirt even when the track did not require it.

I can tell you to start with that if you watch the beginning of the video close, you will see that Tony's sprint car never touched Kevin's. He made a clean pass. Kevin slightly overreacted to being pinched and did not lift soon enough. The terrible dry track conditions allowed his car to slide up into the wall causing the wreck and caution. These guys can see out of their cars good enough to see across the track out the front. I can not prove this, but a lot of car drivers lift their helmet shields during a caution. Whether he did or not, Tony was far enough away and making a left hand corner that he coulod see the events unfolding out the front of his car. It's a pretty safe bet that he saw Kevin exit his car up in front of him.

There is an aspect of this situation that I am not hearing anyone talking about. If Tony knew he made a clean pass on Kevin yet Kevin still hit the wall, seeing Kevin exit his car the way he did would give Tony a feeling of being falsely accused. I have seen many occasions where a racer expresses his feelings with his throttle pedal. If he yells, no one can hear him, but race car engines are loud and blipping the throttle gets attention. If Tony was feeling falsely accused for the caution, then it would not be out of the ordinary for a racer in his position express his emotion with a blip of his throttle and maybe even to shoot some dirt toward Kevin's location. Where we come into the big conflict here the question of whether or not Tony saw Kevin walking on the track. It appears that Kevin first mistook the white and blue 45 car for Tony's and stepped in front of that car to get the driver's attention. Realizing his mistake, he jumped back slightly and refocused on the next car coming down the track which was Tony's. Clearly, the driver of the 45 could see Kevin and his statement to that fact when relayed to the investigator will not work in Tony's favor. You can see that driver react with his steering wheel, not his throttle, to avoid hitting Kevin. Tony could have done the same. I have watched a lot of drivers with throttle steer setups steer around things with their steering wheel. Tony could have done that. He could have also passed by the scene much lower on the track, down by the tires and at a slower pace.

Kevin grabbed Tony's wing if you watch the video real close. I would expect that Tony's heat of the moment reaction was to "Get Kevin Off My Car" and blipped the throttle not realizing that Kevin at that very moment was getting sucked under Tony's tire. I believe it is a safe assumption that Tony never in any way intended to hurt Kevin, however, Tony's track position, speed and history of displays of anger will not play well in to his case. He still may face charges. God be with you, Tony and Kevin's family, friends and fans. "

[Giller]

“Tony Stewart was the best damn driver by far on the track that night. Why he had to go up as high as he did and hog my son, there’s no reason for it.”

“Apparently, Tony Stewart was the only one driving out there who didn’t see him,” Ward told the newspaper.

“The one person that knows what happened that night is possibly facing 10 years in prison. Is he going to say what he done?”

The above quotes were all made by Kevin Ward SR - so they are coming from a very emotional person who is definitely angry at TS. But he does make some very good points.

Again though, I go back to my original statement - there is lots of blame to go around. No one is without guilt here - TS, KW jr, NASCAR, the track itself.....

And believe it or not - we aren't going to solve anything by arguing about it here.

[Perfectlap]

This guy (apparently a dirt track expert, that none of us here are as some have stated) is reading my mind... line by line.

Originally Posted by runjmc2

The following posted comment on the above link is consistent with what I saw, makes sense, and is from an experienced source:

"I am not a Tony Stewart fan or hater. I spent more than 9 years as a dirt track speedway official so my observations and comments are formulated from more of a black and white viewpoint rather than as an untrained fan. I saw lots of circumstances like this over the years as an official. Thankfully none of them ended up in tragedy, especially the time a sprint driver hit me, on purpose, while on the track with my line up board. I always adhered to a strict policy of white pants, red shirt even when the track did not require it.

I can tell you to start with that if you watch the beginning of the video close, you will see that Tony's sprint car never touched Kevin's. He made a clean pass. Kevin slightly overreacted to being pinched and did not lift soon enough. The terrible dry track conditions allowed his car to slide up into the wall causing the wreck and caution. These guys can see out of their cars good enough to see across the track out the front. I can not prove this, but a lot of car drivers lift their helmet shields during a caution. Whether he did or not, Tony was far enough away and making a left hand corner that he coulod see the events unfolding out the front of his car. It's a pretty safe bet that he saw Kevin exit his car up in front of him.

There is an aspect of this situation that I am not hearing anyone talking about. If Tony knew he made a clean pass on Kevin yet Kevin still hit the wall, seeing Kevin exit his car the way he did would give Tony a feeling of being falsely accused. I have seen many occasions where a racer expresses his feelings with his throttle pedal. If he yells, no one can hear him, but race car engines are loud and blipping the throttle gets attention. If Tony was feeling falsely accused for the caution, then it would not be out of the ordinary for a racer in his position express his emotion with a blip of his throttle and maybe even to shoot some dirt toward Kevin's location. Where we come into the big conflict here the question of whether or not Tony saw Kevin walking on the track. It appears that Kevin first mistook the white and blue 45 car for Tony's and stepped in front of that car to get the driver's attention. Realizing his mistake, he jumped back slightly and refocused on the next car coming down the track which was Tony's. Clearly, the driver of the 45 could see Kevin and his statement to that fact when relayed to the investigator will not work in Tony's favor. You can see that driver react with his steering wheel, not his throttle, to avoid hitting Kevin. Tony could have done the same. I have watched a lot of drivers with throttle steer setups steer around things with their steering wheel. Tony could have done that. He could have also passed by the scene much lower on the track, down by the tires and at a slower pace.

Kevin grabbed Tony's wing if you watch the video real close. I would expect that Tony's heat of the moment reaction was to "Get Kevin Off My Car" and blipped the throttle not realizing that Kevin at that very moment was getting sucked under Tony's tire. I believe it is a safe assumption that Tony never in any way intended to hurt Kevin, however, Tony's track position, speed and history of displays of anger will not play well in to his case. He still may face charges. God be with you, Tony and Kevin's family, friends and fans. "