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Old 01-20-2006, 12:22 AM   #1
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Issue with my 987 neighbor

A new guy just moved into my apartment complex and he has a jet black 987. At first I was excited, thinking "great another porsche guy, plus I get to see a 987 every day now!". I went to go peek in his window a few minutes ago, and behold it was an automatic.

Now call me old fashion, but I believe the only way it is acceptable to have an automatic in a Boxster is if you are married and it was the only way your wife would let you get the car. Outside of that it just rubs me the wrong way.

I mean to me that's like having a wicked hot girlfriend that lives on the other side of the world. Sure... she's your girlfriend, and sure... she's hot. But, she is on the other side of the world so who cares? It's just a waste of good resources.


Seriously, what the hell?

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Old 01-20-2006, 12:31 AM   #2
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Just look at it this way...Your Boxster is faster then his(stick your tongue out).
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Old 01-20-2006, 12:41 AM   #3
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What's wrong by having an automatic? and who cares if its Tiptro or manual? It's still a boxster. Either type can still do corners like no gravity.

What's the connection between having an automatic with marriage and wife? I'm curious...are you saying that women can't drive stick?
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Old 01-20-2006, 01:45 AM   #4
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It just makes me sad that people in my generation (let's say 30 and under), in large, either don't know how to drive a stick or don't like to. Men and Women. And for goodness sake, a single guy that has a Porsche and buys it as an automatic?!?

My only connection to marriage is I can understand 'comprimise' in marriage, and I respect that.

My Opinion:
Manual = More interested with the driving expeirience
Automatic = More interested with comfort
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Old 01-20-2006, 05:31 AM   #5
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I've asked this before and I'll ask it again:

What's the connection with someone else's car and your happiness?


What if someone posted:

It just rubs me the wrong way to see these guys buying Porsches but only buying Boxsters. I mean.. everyone knows that the only reason you buy a Boxster is if you can't afford a 911. Not to mention it's a chick car. It rubs me the wrong way to see all of those Boxsters with my beloved Porsche badge on them. They should just save up and buy a 911 like a real man. Waste of resources otherwise.

My opinion:
911: interested in the real driving experience
Boxster: girl car.

---

Moreover.. you seem to think that someone interested in comfort doesn't deserve a Boxster. Whatever gave you that ridiculous notion?

To sum up: get over it. Unless you're going to give the guy $50,000 to buy the car that you want him to buy.. keep your opinions to yourself.

PS. I drive a stick.. 987.. but a non-S. Is that a waste of resources too?
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Old 01-20-2006, 07:26 AM   #6
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Are you writing the check for this guy's car each month?

If not, you don't get a vote.

Then again, he doesn't get a vote on YOUR car either!

Move on, life is way too short!

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Old 01-20-2006, 07:38 AM   #7
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If it's his daily drive and he has to sit in that series of long skinny parking lots you people call "freeways", I can see why he went with the Tip.
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Old 01-20-2006, 07:41 AM   #8
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paddles and tips are the handywork of the devil and have ruined motorsports.

The 928 Came in a slushbox and is very much a Porsche. All drivers are different, some enjoy the inventions of satan.
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Old 01-20-2006, 07:47 AM   #9
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As an aside.. I personally don't like the Tip.. but the objection is about the UI more than anything else. After driving one for a week I found that I kept hitting the shift buttons inadvertantly with my thumbs while turning. (I'm a 9 and 3 driver). I rather liked the feel of the car with the Tip but due to my fat thumbs and the fact that I *really* enjoy driving a standard I went with the standard.
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Old 01-20-2006, 08:13 AM   #10
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Hi,

My experience has been that people's vocal opposition to the Tiptronic S is inversely proportional to their experience with one. Even if you have driven one, it has several Adaptive Modes, if you just get in one and go, you'll never know how good it is unless it's adapted to your style. Add to this, that some feel emasculated by someone else driving a Tip S...??

If this is the case, I suggest you see a Doctor, because the plain truth is that your D*ck isn't shrinking because of what I drive, better seek the cause elsewhere.

I bought my Boxster used with a Tiptronic for several reasons:

First, I own 3 other Enthusiast Cars all of which are Manuals. My Daily Driver is a Manual. I haven't owned or regularly driven an Automatic for over 25 years - I was thrashing my way around the Track and the Twisties when many of you were still trying to negotiate your Big Wheels around the Patio Furniture. After that length of time, Rowing becomes a Monotonous Chore, not the thrilling Phallic Extension it once was - until you've reached this point, you will have no idea what I'm talking about, but you will...

Secondly, I got an Absolutely Pristine example for under $5k the going rate, mostly because it was a Tip S. I didn't need another Toy, but this deal was simply too good to pass up and I have always been intrigued by the Boxster - 17k mi., 18" Turbo Twists, Full Leather, Sport Exhaust, Das Shild (F/R), CD Player, Full Windstop, Halon Extinguisher w/ BK Mount, New Pirelli P-Zeros, Full Bra incl. Mirrors, Silverstone Cover, Guards Red/ Savannah Beige (My personal Favorite), 2 yr. Extended Warranty without a single Scratch or Blemish, Total and excellent Service Records, Glowing PPI, and all for $17k. back in March of '05.

Third, I love my Wife. Since Marrying, she has always been totally supportive of my Hobby. She's come along to countless Auto-X, Track, and Show days and has sat quietly on the sidelines and I wanted to get her involved. After 8 years of owning my Lotus Esprit, I finally was able to urge her to drive it. I pulled over in the Parking Lane, swapped seats. She put the Car in gear, drove 100', pulled over and said "That was nice..." She can drive a stick, but simply doesn't like it. Buying a Tip S has allowed her to take the Car and she really gets her foot in it. It is 'Our' Car, and that makes me Happy.

50% of ALL Boxster production is Tip S. They experience fewer RMS failures, require less Maintenance and give away EXTREMELY little, if you actually know how to drive one. I Auto-X mine regularly and am in the Top 5% at least in the Standings. Don't confuse Skillful Driving with being able to consistently find the Gate.. you'll miss most of the experience if you do.

I Auto-X and Track regularly, yet even with all this, it's hard to put 150 mi./yr. on the Car in that Mode. I just don't see paying the premium in Purchase Price and Maintenance costs of owning a Manual to derive such a small advantage. But then, my Phallic Confidence isn't reliant on it either.

As stated, get over yourself and stop telling everyone else what to drive...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

Last edited by MNBoxster; 01-20-2006 at 08:32 AM.
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Old 01-20-2006, 08:34 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MNBoxster
I was thrashing my way around the Track and the Twisties when many of you were still trying to negotiate your Big Wheels around the Patio Furniture.
Ouch! Why not write, "I've been track driving since 1960 (or whatever year you started) and let the reader figure out they were still in diapers?
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Old 01-20-2006, 08:53 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by MNBoxster
Hi,

My experience has been that people's vocal opposition to the Tiptronic S is inversely proportional to their experience with one. Even if you have driven one, it has several Adaptive Modes, if you just get in one and go, you'll never know how good it is unless it's adapted to your style. Add to this, that some feel emasculated by someone else driving a Tip S...??

If this is the case, I suggest you see a Doctor, because the plain truth is that your D*ck isn't shrinking because of what I drive, better seek the cause elsewhere.

I bought my Boxster used with a Tiptronic for several reasons:

First, I own 3 other Enthusiast Cars all of which are Manuals. My Daily Driver is a Manual. I haven't owned or regularly driven an Automatic for over 25 years - I was thrashing my way around the Track and the Twisties when many of you were still trying to negotiate your Big Wheels around the Patio Furniture.

After that length of time, Rowing becomes a Monotonous Chore, not the thrilling Phallic Extension it once was - until you've reached this point, you will have no idea what I'm talking about, but you will...

Secondly, I got an Absolutely Pristine example for under $5k the going rate, mostly because it was a Tip S. I didn't need another Toy, but this deal was simply too good to pass up and I have always been intrigued by the Boxster - 17k mi., 18" Turbo Twists, Full Leather, Sport Exhaust, Das Shild (F/R), CD Player, Full Windstop, Halon Extinguisher w/ BK Mount, New Pirelli P-Zeros, Full Bra incl. Mirrors, Silverstone Cover, Guards Red/ Savannah Beige (My personal Favorite), 2 yr. Extended Warranty without a single Scratch or Blemish, Total and excellent Service Records, Glowing PPI, and all for $17k. back in March of '05.

Third, I love my Wife. Since Marrying, she has always been totally supportive of my Hobby. She's come along to countless Auto-X, Track, and Show days and has sat quietly on the sidelines and I wanted to get her involved. After 8 years of owning my Lotus Esprit, I finally was able to urge her to drive it. I pulled over in the Parking Lane, swapped seats. She put the Car in gear, drove 100', pulled over and said "That was nice..." She can drive a stick, but simply doesn't like it. Buying a Tip S has allowed her to take the Car and she really gets her foot in it. It is 'Our' Car, and that makes me Happy.

50% of ALL Boxster production is Tip S. They experience fewer RMS failures, require less Maintenance and give away EXTREMELY little, if you actually know how to drive one. I Auto-X mine regularly and am in the Top 5% at least in the Standings. Don't confuse Skillful Driving with being able to consistently find the Gate.. you'll miss most of the experience if you do.

I Auto-X and Track regularly, yet even with all this, it's hard to put 150 mi./yr. on the Car in that Mode. I just don't see paying the premium in Purchase Price and Maintenance costs of owning a Manual to derive such a small advantage. But then, my Phallic Confidence isn't reliant on it either.

As stated, get over yourself and stop telling everyone else what to drive...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99



Hey Jim, you have had a very busy week here!

Just a couple comments and 2 questions:

First, I never had a Big Wheel. I always wanted one, but my parents just could not afford to buy me one when I was a little kid. Come to think about it, we did not have a patio or patio furniture either!

Does a manuel trans really cost more in maintenance?

And why are there less RMS failures with the Tip?

Thanks for helping me learn more here on the forum.
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Old 01-20-2006, 08:59 AM   #13
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Ouch! Why not write, "I've been track driving since 1960 (or whatever year you started) and let the reader figure out they were still in diapers?
Hi,

It's called Descriptive Writing - that's what I do, I'm an Author and fully avail myself of Artistic License. Before anyone asks, I won't post a Bibliography here, that part of my life I keep separate. Although I do have a Novel soon to be released and hope you will all buy it (on it's own merits, not because I appear here), because I have a very special 4-wheel purchase in mind if my Royalties hit the Mark.

Anyway, despite the verbage, clearly my meaning was conveyed and that's what's important in written communication...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99
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Old 01-20-2006, 09:06 AM   #14
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Hi,

It's called Descriptive Writing - that's what I do, I'm an Author and fully avail myself of Artistic License. Before anyone asks, I won't post a Bibliography here, that part of my life I keep separate. Although I do have a Novel soon to be released and hope you will all buy it (on it's own merits, not because I appear here), because I have a very special 4-wheel purchase in mind if my Royalties hit the Mark.

Anyway, despite the verbage, clearly my meaning was conveyed and that's what's important in written communication...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

Jim, there is an awesome novelist in the Twin Cities. Vince Flynn. Are you familiar with is work?
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Old 01-20-2006, 09:09 AM   #15
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I thought I should post here so that we have the best writer on teh forum directly below teh worst writer on the forum. That damned email spell check has me making our beloved president look like a regular Ernest Hemmingway. Good writing is a dying art (just like properly driving a 5 speed maunual).
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Old 01-20-2006, 09:26 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by bmussatti
Hey Jim, you have had a very busy week here!

Just a couple comments and 2 questions:

First, I never had a Big Wheel. I always wanted one, but my parents just could not afford to buy me one when I was a little kid. Come to think about it, we did not have a patio or patio furniture either!

Does a manuel trans really cost more in maintenance?

And why are there less RMS failures with the Tip?

Thanks for helping me learn more here on the forum.
Hi,

I'm sorry you were Big Wheel Deprived - so was I - not from circumstance, but because I pre-date them...

Anyway, the Tip S is cheaper to maintain because there is no Clutch, Flywheel, Pressure Plate, T/O Bearing, Master Cylinder, Slave Cylinder or Pilot Bearing to replace. The first scheduled maintenance on the Tip S is at 60k mi. and this is just a Fluid and Filter change - couple Hundred Bucks.

The Tip S experiences fewer RMS Failures because it has no direct Mechanical connection to the Engine. It uses a Torque Converter which is attached to the Flywheel. This is essentially a Viscous or Fluid Coupling, which spins pressurising and moving the Transmission Fluid inside it. This Fluid, now spinning and placed under pressure, spins an Internal Impeller which is connected to the Primary Shaft in the Tranny, transmitting the engine Torque/HP to the rest of the Drivetrain and ultimately the Rear Wheels.

In accord with Newton's 3rd Law of Motion, every action has an equal and opposite reaction. In the case of a Manual Transmission, this means that whatever Force (Energy) the Crank is imparting to the Clutch through the Flywheel, this same force is being exerted back to the Crank. This causes it to stress, move, and exert lateral force on the RMS leading to faster, perhaps premature wear.

But, with the Tip S, it is the compressibility of the Transmission Fluid which absorbs most of this opposing Force (Energy), which it then dissipates as Heat. This is why most Autos, incl. the Tip S, have Transmission Coolers. Consequently there is less Force being fed back to the Crank.

Also, because there is this dissapation of the Force through Heat, there is less Impact, Shudder, etc. through the rest of the Driveline and I suspect that this increases the Service Life of other components such as the CV Joints, etc. as well... Hope this helps...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

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Old 01-20-2006, 09:35 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MNBoxster
First, I own 3 other Enthusiast Cars all of which are Manuals. My Daily Driver is a Manual. I haven't owned or regularly driven an Automatic for over 25 years - I was thrashing my way around the Track and the Twisties when many of you were still trying to negotiate your Big Wheels around the Patio Furniture. After that length of time, Rowing becomes a Monotonous Chore, not the thrilling Phallic Extension it once was - until you've reached this point, you will have no idea what I'm talking about, but you will...
I understand your point of getting sick of throwing a shifter after years many, many years. I too will most likely sing that song with you someday, by your estimations sometime around 2020.

That being said, I don't have a "problem" with automatic sports cars (not just porsches, had the same thought with my other neighbors automatic 350z) it's more that it makes me sad. For these this reason:

As I stated earlier, people in my generation just simply don't drive sticks. They are, by in large, afraid of them. I have friends with mustangs and 350z's and everything else under the sun and not one of them has a stick. All guys under 30. Not ONE of these guys really gives a damn about their car. Most of them simply 'like the way they look'. Does that mean they shouldn't own the car? No, it's their money they can do what they want. Am I being an ass? Usually. But who here doesn't get a little sad when they see a killer sports car with an auto?
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Old 01-20-2006, 09:51 AM   #18
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ditto. I had the same feeling when I saw my ex gf's new Passat with an automatic.
There's nothing cooler than seeing a girl shifting gears at high RPM's. Is there anything cooler?

p.s. how do you load a pic onto your signature?
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Old 01-20-2006, 10:01 AM   #19
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I understand your point of getting sick of throwing a shifter after years many, many years. I too will most likely sing that song with you someday, by your estimations sometime around 2020.

That being said, I don't have a "problem" with automatic sports cars (not just porsches, had the same thought with my other neighbors automatic 350z) it's more that it makes me sad. For these this reason:

As I stated earlier, people in my generation just simply don't drive sticks. They are, by in large, afraid of them. I have friends with mustangs and 350z's and everything else under the sun and not one of them has a stick. All guys under 30. Not ONE of these guys really gives a damn about their car. Most of them simply 'like the way they look'. Does that mean they shouldn't own the car? No, it's their money they can do what they want. Am I being an ass? Usually. But who here doesn't get a little sad when they see a killer sports car with an auto?
Hi,

Don't get me wrong, I love the shifting in my other 3 Fun cars. But it's just an enjoyable change when I drive the Boxster not to have to do the Shift Dance. Just, shake the Right Foot and let the Car do the Rest.

I suspect that if I didn't have these other Cars, I would not feel so strongly.

But, having any Boxster, Manual or Tip S, is hardly a Hard-Scrabble Sports Car. FI?, AC?, Power Steering?, Power Top?, Independent Suspension?, Disc Brakes?, PSM?, Traction Control? Hardly the Sports Car stuff of Yesteryear. The most Pure Sports Car I ever owned was a Lotus Europa. It was a Pain in the Ass, but still the Most Sports Car I have ever experienced. Most people today want the Latter while foregoing the Former part of the equation.

So far as your friends, well, Engineering advances, no stopping it. I could say the same thing of people who've never owned a Carb'd Car. Dialing in a set of Carbs is really fun, and Carbs will usually outrun FI, which is why they're still around so abundantly. FI's popularity is due mostly to Emmissions Regulations and concerns. They are also less maintenance, and easier to start, but something was given away in the switchover. The same can be said of ABS, Power Steering, and the like.

All these things will make an Average Driver better, but do little for those with more adavanced skills except maybe lighten the workload.

Interesting aside about ABS. It won't shorten your stopping distances, that's not what it's there for. It is there to allow you to keep control of the Car. In an impending accident, it is supposed to allow the Driver enough control to manuever out of trouble. The problem is, they don't teach people to do this and consequently, after nearly 15 years of having mostly ABS equipped Cars, there is no statistical reduction in accidents. People still usually just stomp on the Brakes, hold on, and freeze like a Deer in the headlights, while the car careens forward into the collision anyway.

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99
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Old 01-20-2006, 11:06 AM   #20
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It just makes me sad that people in my generation (let's say 30 and under), in large, either don't know how to drive a stick or don't like to
Sorry to break it to you but thats the way its going. A lot of highline sports cars are going Fi sequential transmission with paddle shifters. There is a reason you dont see many F1/CART/INDY race cars with a stick...because there is something better, though more expensive

As soon as Porsche offers a SMG/DSG(sequential clutch peddless) F1 treansmission, I'm taking it over a stick any day. Paddle shifters will shift faster than any pro driven stick. An F1 boxster will be faster than your stick boxter.

I also assume the guy got an auto for the bumper to bumper traffic on the 101 or 110. Not everyone likes being in first gear for HOURS...


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