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Old 07-28-2009, 08:55 PM   #1
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Question for Jake Raby on Turbos

Figure mentioning your name in the title is the way to get your attention.. sorry

I after hearing some of your complaints about pbbb wandered over there intent on some rubbernecking of the issues you mentioned, did a search on your name and found a older thread running through a question i have been meaning to post about.

My 2001 boxster s happily hit 101,000 miles old yesterday. While it is cheery as ever i on the other hand continue the hand wringing that reading what you write about our engines tends to cause. (not debating the point, i just at points enjoying the bliss my ignorance induces) The car runs reliably with just typical (for porsche) wear parts that i can fix myself. (engine mounts, coolant tanks, wheel bearings, cv boots, 02 sensors, MAF replacements)... anyhow... i get bored easily, 15 vehicles in 4 years easy, and i never intended on keeping the boxster too long. The car has grown on me and i have found it difficult to believe i could replace it with something i like as more or more for anything close to what its worth (which is not much being a 100,000 poor man's porsche) I am trying to scheme ways to keep the boxster but it needs some more exciting power (driving STI's make me grin) The thread i found on PBBB talked about a FSI and TurboKraft joint project that you were recommending for us "soon to scatter parts" high mileagers. Is this the boxster s turbo-kit Kraft has available? did it ever get off the ground? I love turbocharged cars and a turbo boxster would be nearly perfect (interior still sucks though) Updates? this thread was from oct 2008.

I know you guys are hard at work, the FSI site doesn't seem particularly up-to-date, particularly when it comes to us 3.2 guys. Info would be appreciated.


Last edited by Jackelfox; 07-29-2009 at 08:13 PM. Reason: clarity
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:36 AM   #2
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Quote:
Figure mentioning your name in the title is the way to get your attention.. sorry

I after hearing some of your complaints about pbbb wandered over there intent on some rubbernecking of the issues you mentioned, did a search on your name and found a older thread running through a question i have been meaning to post about.
No problem.

Quote:
My 2001 boxster s happily hit 101,000 miles old yesterday. While it is cheery as ever i on the other hand continue the hand wringing that reading what you write about our engines tends to cause. (not debating the point, i just at points enjoying the bliss my ignorance induces) The car runs reliably with just typical (for porsche) wear parts that i can fix myself. (engine mounts, coolant tanks, wheel bearings, cv boots, 02 sensors, MAF replacements)
You are definitely in the low percentile of people who have seen over 100K miles with only consumables and small gripes occurring.


Quote:
... anyhow... i get bored easily, 15 vehicles in 4 years easy, and i never intended on keeping the boxster too long. The car has grown on me and i have found it difficult to believe i could replace it with something i like as more or more for anything close to what its worth (which is not much being a 100,000 poor man's porsche) I am trying to scheme ways to keep the boxster but it needs some more exciting power (driving STI's make me grin) The thread i found on PBBB talked about a FSI and TurboKraft joint project that you were recommending for us "soon to scatter parts" high mileagers.
That was some time ago... lots has changed since then.

Quote:
Is this the boxster s turbo-kit Kraft has available? did it ever get off the ground? I love turbocharged cars and a turbo boxster would be nearly perfect (interior still sucks though) Updates? this thread was from oct 2008.
No, we never made any real progress with the actual Turbo kit.. Our time has been spent developing the boost specific internal components and engine design that compliments forced induction. Our own Turbo kit is in work for these specific engines as we have decided to have full control over the entire package, for developmental purposes and the security of the program.

Quote:
I know you guys are hard at work, the FSI doesn't seem particularly up-to-date, particularly when it comes to us 3.2 guys. Info would be appreciated.
Actually the 3.2 is our main focus right now.. Even more so than the 911 engine program. I have gained serious data and the program for the 3.2>>3.6 has grown by leaps and bounds now, with peak output from the stage II 3.2>>3.6 Big Bore now at 300RWHP.

No use to keep the site updated, or even try.. Results and information is changing faster than we can post it... Right now our primary focus is development, even more so than sales of engines and components.. Once its developed and making astounding results-They will come...

Right now its all about internals...
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:57 AM   #3
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wow, that was a prompt response.

though a non engineer, i have always liked what a turbo can do with a small engine. A 3.2 isnt particularly small but even so... The only thing that makes me like the idea of an NA engine is that porsche engine sound (i know,i know)

The big issue is i don't have $20,000 clams to toss your way at the moment. So picking up a turbo kit that will later factor into my engine upgrade sounds like a decent method.

sounds like you had/have a lot of respect for turbokrafts work. I'm not probably buying a kit this week, but if i were, would you still recommend them? (i am assuming the fsi kit isn't just around the corner)

... or if you care to spend the time, convince me out of a boxster turbo?
I would hope that an FSI engine might last me forever, but at 300rwhp NA engine sounds like she might be mightily stressed.
my performance priorities seem to line up with yours (with the exception that i like things to sound good) torque, particularly down low in the rev range is what makes a car feel powerful and entertaining. I cant imagine that can be done more efficiently than with forced induction. (but i'm not an engineer)
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Old 07-29-2009, 05:19 AM   #4
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Personally, I think if you have already made it to over 100k on your car, I don't think you have much to worry about. I am part of an informal Northeast Tri-State Boxster club that gets together for wrenching and drives (www.tsbl.org). We have over 30 members, and I cannot think of one person in the group who has had their engine fail due to an IMS or D chunk failure. One person has had an engine replacement done by the factory on warranty due to an RMS leak, but that's it. I have just hit 60k miles on my 01 Boxster, and other than regular oil changes (always used M1 0w-40, btw) & brake jobs, I've only had to replace the coolant tank, a worn motor mount, and a water pump. Pretty darn reliable if you ask me.

Now I'm not trying to say there isn't a weak point in the M96 engines, as I think there obviously is if Porsche engineered out the IMS, but for many owners, I think they will never experience a problem. Just continue driving it and enjoy it I say, and worry about a problem if/when it ever materializes.
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Old 07-29-2009, 05:35 AM   #5
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Well yes, but I can't believe it will run forever. I get a ton of mileage out of my expensive high wear michelins I'm told. So I'm soft on the car. I want some grunt though, or just a change. I love the lovables on Porsche. Brakes, steering feel, balance, noise.... But it needs a kick in the butt, or I do. I'm still young (25) so call it imaturity.
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Old 07-29-2009, 05:45 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackelfox
Well yes, but I can't believe it will run forever. I get a ton of mileage out of my expensive high wear michelins I'm told. So I'm soft on the car. I want some grunt though, or just a change. I love the lovables on Porsche. Brakes, steering feel, balance, noise.... But it needs a kick in the butt, or I do. I'm still young (25) so call it imaturity.
If that's the case, then I would pass on paying up for the forced induction idea because I'm not sure I'd want to put further stresses on the engine, and instead, for similar money, consider finding a used 996 3.4L engine to drop in. I've driven a Boxster with such a set up, and it does give you more get up and go if you like more ooomph in 1st and 2nd gear stoplight to stoplight driving situations.
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Old 07-29-2009, 06:02 AM   #7
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I not unaware of the options. On the other hand the 3.4 are second only to 2.5 from what I can tell, on a failure standpoint. I have egas, so depending on who I'm talking to a 3.6 would work. By the time I am done with the sourcing the engine, the elctronics, the inevitable issues with tuning and parts like throttle bodies and engine mount fabrication, not to mention that transplant isn't something I can do myself... I'm back to where FSI would take me financially. Except with FSI I have a much better engine, much more power, virtually eliminated the normal weak points, and kept stuff like psm that I would lose getting a 3.6....(am I missing anything from the sales pitch Jake?)

Plus I like turbos
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Old 07-29-2009, 08:09 PM   #8
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can i get raby back (old chili's jingle)

Jake, if i can pull you away from the drama. Does FSI currently sell a turbo kit or have an ETA? do you guys need guinea pigs?... actually not sure i or my wallet can stomach a guinea pig job. Is turbokraft a good solution until i can have you build the engine for boost? and since "a lot has changed since then" is there any better concept of what such a build would cost?

i would call you and save you the time of typing, but it seems to me that i am probably not the only person with this question right now, much less in the future and having the conversation here helps get the word out, and give you a little free self-promotion everyone is soo upset about.

Last edited by Jackelfox; 07-29-2009 at 08:11 PM. Reason: typos.. you'd think i'd proof read then post.
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Old 07-29-2009, 08:56 PM   #9
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Jake, if i can pull you away from the drama. Does FSI currently sell a turbo kit or have an ETA?
No and No... We have to finish the stregthening of the engine at the next level before this will be a priority.. I'd say we'll begin this in the next 18 months if the schedule stays as is and we continue to be successful with the rest of the program...

Quote:
do you guys need guinea pigs?... actually not sure i or my wallet can stomach a guinea pig job.
We do our best to use our own test vehicles as guinea pigs, thats why we have 3 of them (Two Boxsters and a 911). This is because we only benefit from the application if we can experience the details and gather the data personally. It also isn't fair for anyone to assume the risk of being a Guinea pig for our developments.. At the most we need a "First timer" to install the kit and critique it, so we can change the directions or make things more clear.

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Is turbokraft a good solution until i can have you build the engine for boost? and since "a lot has changed since then" is there any better concept of what such a build would cost?
They should be.

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i would call you and save you the time of typing, but it seems to me that i am probably not the only person with this question right now, much less in the future and having the conversation here helps get the word out, and give you a little free self-promotion everyone is soo upset about.
No problem.

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