IMS - First Time Buyer Question

[AlanR]

Originally Posted by particlewave

No. You can't see it unless it's removed.
You have more reading to do.

So in this video,
www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3kyGJzlikg
is this not a valid check?
I'm not trying to be smart, I just genuinely don't know if this is a legitimate way of checking it for integrity.

[maytag]

Originally Posted by Homeoboxter

What did you replace it for? Just curios..

I succumbed to the paranoia. haha.
Seriously: I'm sitting there looking at the IMS bearing and the Rear Main Seal. I had ordered parts for both, because everything says "do them while you're in there", which of course makes sense, right?
So I'm sitting there looking at them. No reason to suspect either have any problems whatsoever.... but BOTH are destroyed by pulling to inspect. So I did it.... and now I worry about it sometimes while I'm out driving. I worry more now than I did BEFORE I replaced it, without a doubt.



Whatev'..... sometimes I drink the cool-aid too.

[AlanR]

I wonder why the IMS Guardian never took off? That would seem like a decent middle ground. Give you some peace of mind but without having to do any immediate expensive upgrade. Can't find one for sale anywhere.

[03S]

I replaced my IMS, in my 03s, and the seals were intact. I pulled a seal and it was full of old oil, no grease was left. The bearing seemed fine but for how long. Just replace and enjoy. There are many things that can go wrong with these engines, and if you worry about it, you shouldn't own one.

[Homeoboxter]

Originally Posted by maytag

I succumbed to the paranoia. haha.
Seriously: I'm sitting there looking at the IMS bearing and the Rear Main Seal. I had ordered parts for both, because everything says "do them while you're in there", which of course makes sense, right?
So I'm sitting there looking at them. No reason to suspect either have any problems whatsoever.... but BOTH are destroyed by pulling to inspect. So I did it.... and now I worry about it sometimes while I'm out driving. I worry more now than I did BEFORE I replaced it, without a doubt.



Whatev'..... sometimes I drink the cool-aid too.

Haha, it`s crazy, right? The more you read this stuff the more anxious you get for no reason.. Sorry, sometimes I forget to speak English: the question I wanted to ask was what you replaced the old bearing with?

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by AlanR

I came across a few comments of replaced ones failing and this video also.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_IeP_iShxA

None of the bearings either shown or discussed were the IMS Solution. The one if the video was one of the roller bearing replacements that some people think are so great. The video does however show why replacing a failed or failing IMS bearing in an engine full of metal is a bad idea.

[78F350]

Originally Posted by AlanR

I wonder why the IMS Guardian never took off? That would seem like a decent middle ground. Give you some peace of mind but without having to do any immediate expensive upgrade. Can't find one for sale anywhere.

There were some issues with the durability of the IMS Guardian, but I think that the main reason that it didn't take off is that by the time it triggers, the engine will need to be torn down for a rebuild anyway. It is too late to just replace the bearing.

Info is scattered across many threads, but here's some discussion: http://986forum.com/forums/performance-technical-chat/46572-does-ims-guardian-work.html

[AlanR]

Thank you to everyone for taking time to reply and it’s nice to get a few different view points.
There are 2 options I can find online - both require me bringing the car to England ( which adds to the cost massively) but I’ll ring a couple of places here in Ireland & see what they offer. Their websites say they are Porche Specialists but no mention of IMS upgrade by any of them.
https://www.kenplantautotech.ie/
https://www.specialistcarsireland.ie/
Optimum Performance & Handling | Porsche Independent Specialists
Porsche Car Sales, Prestige Car Sales, North Dublin

In England I see
IMS Bearing Replacement | Revolution Porsche of Yorkshire
and
https://rpmtechnik.co.uk/servicing/ims-bearing-upgrade/

I think the first one, Revolution, is the upgrade that most would recommend?

I would usually be happy enough to drive on if it was something that could fail, and would then require a repair. But there is no repairing here - full new engine, which may as well mean a new car.
But it’s not the rate of failure, which in all honesty I think is blown out of proportion due to the nature of how the internet works ( I mean if every Porsche owner that never upgraded & never had a problem came online it might give a different perspective) BUT the consequences of a failed bearing are not in dispute and it’s one thing everyone can agree on.
I am surprised that when looking around in the aftermarket car sales websites that there aren’t more Porches for sale as “parts only” or “needs new engine” - I mean if this was a major issue you would expect to see plenty of cars that had the failing, are not worth fixing & so go on sale for their other valuable parts.
And of the 30+ running and good condition cars I viewed only 2 said they had the IMS done. 2!! If others had it done it would surely be a selling point. So u have to reasonably presume they haven’t had it done and all these years later they are still running fine. And so many comments from ones that have had it done & their original bearing was pristine - so while LN etc will say how many units they have sold, that doesn’t mean that all those thousands of units were actually needed.

But, I keep coming back to the consequences of a failure & the lack of forewarning.

I am torn, but my gut is telling me to get it done. I will eventually take it to France & maybe later Italy for a weeks driving holiday with my wife and that would not be a good place for something like this to go wrong.
I’ll try and negotiate a bit more discount on the car to get me over the line, and I guess if I ever do come to reselling it, it would be a selling point in its favour.
I’ve had cars in the past that have required expensive enough repairs, I remember a Toyota Aristo with a stupid oil leak that ended up running into €800, but I wasn’t about to get rid of car over €800.
I guess if I had the Boxster for a year & something needed doing at a cost of €800 or a €1000 I wouldn’t give it to much thought, just get it done. Not going to give up the car for something like that, unless it was expense like that on an ongoing basis - but what I’m reading is they are pretty reliable & not crazy expensive to keep running.
So if the IMS failure was not engine ending, but still €1000 to repair if it broke, would I buy the car & drive on in the knowledge that it might fail & cost me €1000+ to fix? Yes, yes I would.
So why not spend the money upfront as a preventative step? If I would be willing to spend that money to have it repaired, why not be willing to spend it to stop it from happening in the first place.
It’s a bit like the flu jab or other jabs before u go to exotic places on holiday - pay €100 now to prevent yourself getting ill on holiday & spending hundreds on medical bills & time off work in recovery OR spend €100 now and avoid it in the first place.
It’s effectively an insurance policy. All the years paying insurance on health & car & house & I have never once made a claim. And u know what would happen the first time I didn’t insure something? Bang!!

So all in all I will most likely get it done if the sale goes ahead.
Just need to figure out if I can get it done in Ireland or need to go to UK.

[paulofto]

Originally Posted by AlanR

I wonder why the IMS Guardian never took off? That would seem like a decent middle ground. Give you some peace of mind but without having to do any immediate expensive upgrade. Can't find one for sale anywhere.

I posted this in another thread a couple of weeks ago.

"Just to throw a wrench into the mix, I owned 2 LN IMS Guardians. Not only did both leak (yes they were torqued to 19 ft/lbs per instructions) but both failed where the electrical wires enter the Guardian. Without proper stress relief they simply worked their way into fraying and becoming useless. I thought the first fail was a freak thing and ordered a replacement but it too leaked and failed in the exact same way. Neither lasted a full driving season.These units are a great idea but poor execution doomed them. So I'm 2 for 2 with LN drain plugs/Guardians. So far my LN IMS bearing is fine, I hope, after putting ~15,000 miles on it."

BTW, my wife and I spent 3 weeks in your beautiful country last May. We loved it. You should have great miles and smiles in your Boxster on those amazing back roads!

[thom4782]

Here's the deal...you're never going to be 'safe.' 986 engines will eventually wear out. Replacing the IMS bearing is one way to avoid a premature, catastrophic engine failure

The math is simple. Either pay to replace the IMSB as a preventative measure to avoid one failure mode or pay $3000+ (DIY) to $6000+ (shop swaps engine) to recover from a catastrophic engine failure.

Bottom line is this. One day you'll pay for a major engine rebuild, an engine replacement, or preventative repairs. It just a matter of which and when that should drive your planning.

[BoxMann]

Originally Posted by thom4782

The math is simple. Either pay to replace the IMSB as a preventative measure to avoid one failure mode or pay $3000+ (DIY) to $6000+ (shop swaps engine) to recover from a catastrophic engine failure.

Is the $6,000 "shop swap" a used engine or a fresh rebuild with an upgraded IMSB?

[thstone]

Originally Posted by BoxMann

Is the $6,000 "shop swap" a used engine or a fresh rebuild with an upgraded IMSB?

$6K would be a used engine with a shop doing the engine swap. A 2.5L used engine swap by a shop can be done for $4,500 (had this done last year for the 5th time).

A professionally rebuilt S engine is $8K-$10K for the engine alone.