Winter Storage Tips?

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by Ciao

Flat spotting is reality, can occur, and not an old wives tale.

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=42

In more than forty years of storing cars, I have NEVER encountered permanent flat spotting. Temporary, yes, permanent never. It is an old wives tale...………..unless you are running crap tires, as mentioned earlier.

[husker boxster]

Some moth balls or dryer sheets would be a good idea too since you're storing outside. Mice love the taste of wire insulation.

[Ciao]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

In more than forty years of storing cars, I have NEVER encountered permanent flat spotting. Temporary, yes, permanent never. It is an old wives tale...………..unless you are running crap tires, as mentioned earlier.

Flat spots can be permanent it doesn't matter the cost, type, of car you drive whether its 1 year or 140 years.

https://consumertire.com/blog/view/flat-spots-let-s-clear-up-some-myths-about-that

[Frodo]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

In more than forty years of storing cars, I have NEVER encountered permanent flat spotting. Temporary, yes, permanent never. It is an old wives tale...………..unless you are running crap tires, as mentioned earlier.

In the dozen years I've owned my '01 Box I've garaged it annually from late Nov/early Dec until late Mar/early Apr. No intermittent rolling the car, and no long term flat spotting issues. Ever.

[jaykay]

I definitely have experienced flat spotting. Permanent? Well depends how long you want to spend ironing them out. The fronts are particularly sensitive after sitting a couple of couple weeks at regular tire pressures. Vibration can be felt through the wheel for quite some time after. What is this doing to your tires and steering linkage? Don't know, but I don't like it. Low profile 18>20s are particularly susceptible. What is the effect after 6 months sitting in one spot?

I still pump up to 50 psi all round for storage as was once recommended by Porsche. Not sure if that fell out of favour yet or this detracts from tire life. Way back, I also started rolling the car (or jacking) up on foam insulation pads (cut from sheets available at home depot and the like) such that it deforms rather than the tire. Later on I found out that this idea had come to others and been commercialized....

The 50 psi tire deforms the dense foam insulation and a moderate tire cradle effect is created. Something like carpet would not work. Every spring things are crystal smooth.

Overkill? Perhaps, but any vibrations coming up the through wheel is/are real feedback and my tires (street) tend to last until worn down to the bars. I am just really picky about front tire and steering feel and wish I could get more in this car. Perhaps this came from my motorcycle time....where spurious front wheel vibration is no bueno...

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by Ciao

Flat spots can be permanent it doesn't matter the cost, type, of car you drive whether its 1 year or 140 years.

https://consumertire.com/blog/view/flat-spots-let-s-clear-up-some-myths-about-that

From the article you quoted, “ In some severe cases, the flat-spotting is permanent.”

Sounds to me like “the cost, type of car you drive whether its 1 year of 140 years” does matter according to the author of the article..............

[marsheng]

Originally Posted by Ciao

Flat spots can be permanent it doesn't matter the cost, type, of car you drive whether its 1 year or 140 years.

Things change shape when you exceed the stress point of no return. Standing for months does not make the rubber bend past its point of no return. So if you say it developed a flat spot, what has happened? Has the rubber 'flowed' into this new shape ? If that is the case, then the flowing must have been caused by gravity of just the bending of rubber. If that was the case, I doubt that cars would get 1000 km per tire before being bent out of shape. Heaven help you of you hit a curb, it will put a permanent dent in the rubber ?

Can anyone produce some factual information on what may happen ?

[Stroked & Blown]

I’m sure I cause far more flat spotting at autocross than sitting in my garage...and they are still fine.

[Ciao]

Originally Posted by marsheng

Things change shape when you exceed the stress point of no return. Standing for months does not make the rubber bend past its point of no return. So if you say it developed a flat spot, what has happened? Has the rubber 'flowed' into this new shape ? If that is the case, then the flowing must have been caused by gravity of just the bending of rubber. If that was the case, I doubt that cars would get 1000 km per tire before being bent out of shape. Heaven help you of you hit a curb, it will put a permanent dent in the rubber ?

Can anyone produce some factual information on what may happen ?

https://consumertire.com/blog/view/flat-spots-let-s-clear-up-some-myths-about-that

Marsheng,
You should reply to the link in the posting as it clears up some myths about flat spots. T

[marsheng]

Originally Posted by Ciao

https://consumertire.com/blog/view/flat-spots-let-s-clear-up-some-myths-about-that

Marsheng,
You should reply to the link in the posting as it clears up some myths about flat spots. T

I should have included the article, but it is anecdotal. Has the rubber "flowed" into this new shape ? Has it been bent past its yield point ? What has actually physically happened to the rubber. Can it flow like glass does over 50 years ?

The only time I have seen flat spotting is when the car has stood for many years and the rubber has perished and the tire is no longer usable.

I am being a bit provoking here so we think outside the square, but I'm happy to be educated with the physical parameters of what actually happens.

[MWS]

Originally Posted by marsheng

I should have included the article, but it is anecdotal. Has the rubber "flowed" into this new shape ? Has it been bent past its yield point ? What has actually physically happened to the rubber. Can it flow like glass does over 50 years ?

The only time I have seen flat spotting is when the car has stood for many years and the rubber has perished and the tire is no longer usable.

I am being a bit provoking here so we think outside the square, but I'm happy to be educated with the physical parameters of what actually happens.

Well..sticking with the "outside the square" mentality, rubber IS an amorphous solid and therefore would (in theory) "flow" like glass....however modern tires are not primarily rubber (contains several other polymers) therefore I suppose the question then would be...would the total composition of a modern tire still be considered an amorphous solid, and if so, what properties does the new compound represent as compared to natural rubber?

My knee-jerk answer (based on no information whatsoever, lol) is that a modern tire would degrade in structure well before any actual transference of mass (ie permanent flat spot) would occur due to the compounded material and advancements in materials science...and additionally the competition between tire manufactures to create the "best" compounds.

As always, looking forward to being proven wrong.

[Frodo]

Originally Posted by MWS

As always, looking forward to being proven wrong.

You look forward to proof that permanent flat spots are reality???
You must drive your car year round!

[maytag]

Guys, I live in a seasonal environment, and have never owned fewer than 2 cars at a time in my life.... so parking a car for an extended period is just routine for me. That's been the case for my 30 + years of driving.

To date, I've NEVER experienced any "permanent" (nor even long-term) flat spots in my tires.

This is obviously not empirical data, but it represents a lot of f.h.e.

I guess I'm saying that someone would need to show me that flat-spotting is real.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

[marsheng]

Originally Posted by MWS

My knee-jerk answer (based on no information whatsoever, lol) is that a modern tire would degrade in structure well before any actual transference of mass (ie permanent flat spot) would occur due to the compounded material and advancements in materials science...and additionally the competition between tire manufactures to create the "best" compounds.

I agree, if any flowing occurred, tires would not last 50000 km or more than a few months.

I have a bike dyno and if I leave a bike tied tightly (with race slicks) to the frame over night , the next day the tire does have a flat spot. This takes just a few minutes to work out with no permanent damage.

Tires do contain oil which may be adding to the question on what happens.

See here https://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/hybrid-electric/a7593/the-science-behind-yokohamas-orange-oil-tires-8146348/

Either way, you may have sticky short life tires that may flat spot or long lasting car tire that last for years.