Go Back   986 Forum - for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners > Porsche Boxster & Cayman Forums > Boxster General Discussions

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-29-2010, 12:19 PM   #1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 206
Garage
IMS Retrofit value when selling car

Some of you may have heard that my Boxster S was totaled during Boxtoberfest. I am now battling the insurance company over value of the car. I am trying to figure out if anyone has sold a Boxster / 996 / Cayman at a higher price when the IMS upgrade was done.

I will post the pix when the insurance claim in completed.

Thanks everyone!!

__________________
rob76turbo
Current Porsches: 2002 Boxster S (Speed yellow)
Past Porsches: 1972 914, 1987 944S, 1976 930, 1986 951, 1999 986, 1992 968, 2001 986 S, 2006 Cayman S, 1986 951 track car, 2001 986 S, 2005 Cayenne

Last edited by rob76turbo; 09-29-2010 at 01:08 PM. Reason: fix typo
rob76turbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 12:30 PM   #2
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Depends on the day of the week....
Posts: 1,400
I'm trying to sell mine and my IMS is the LN bearing....
__________________
Boxster S
Cloudsurfer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 12:37 PM   #3
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: It's a kind of magic.....
Posts: 5,284
I'd have to say yes; while I have not personally sold a car with the upgrade, but several customer's have and judging from the requests for supporting documents and buyer's asking for verification, there has to be some level of value. If you think about it, if the car has been done, it is like having a $3,000 aftermarket sound system; you won't get it all back, but it does have residual value for the buyer................
__________________
Anything really new is invented only in one’s youth. Later, one becomes more experienced, more famous – and more stupid.” - Albert Einstein

Last edited by JFP in PA; 09-29-2010 at 12:39 PM.
JFP in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 01:11 PM   #4
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 206
Garage
Many insurance companies use a valuation service from a company called CCC. They just look at "comps" or cars that have been sold (or are for sale) like your car in a given area. They just do not have the experience to handle something like an IMS upgrade and determine how it effects or impacts the value of the car.

That is the main issue I am running up against.
__________________
rob76turbo
Current Porsches: 2002 Boxster S (Speed yellow)
Past Porsches: 1972 914, 1987 944S, 1976 930, 1986 951, 1999 986, 1992 968, 2001 986 S, 2006 Cayman S, 1986 951 track car, 2001 986 S, 2005 Cayenne
rob76turbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 02:44 PM   #5
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Texas
Posts: 101
Hand them receipts for the investment. FWIW, I'd pay ~$1k for an upgraded IMS on a used purchase. But unknowing people won't value the work and probably think it is just tinkering for tinkering sake.
__________________
'04 986 Aero - Seal Metallic Gray
Fabspeed: Maxflo Mufflers, Headers with sportcats, Tips; Alpine & Infinity sound
davemon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 02:46 PM   #6
Registered User
 
Lil bastard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Du Monde
Posts: 2,199
Personally, I doubt it increases the value much, if at all.

I mean the car is expected to work and the LN fix does nothing to enhance performance.

While it definitely can stave off a disaster, I doubt people would be willing to pay more for it - are used Boxster owners, as a group, so knowledgeable before they own the car? I think not - they just won't appreciate the value of it. Sure, you may get an occaisional 'expert', but the average prospect isn't going to have a clue what you're talking about. Even if you do get an expert, I doubt this will shift the car any higher on their priorities list, a set of 19's or 20's, or a CF interior will likely have more juice.

What it may do is get the car sold faster. Then again, if you mention you had the engine rebuilt or worked on, that could just as easily be a turn-off for a prospect.

So far as Insurance valuation is concerned, it's likely that your ins. co. wouldn't value it and might even try to deny the claim based on the car having been 'modified' w/ non-standard parts (most policies have a clause regarding this).

But, a defendent's ins. co. may be more inclined to consider it just to limit the claim and get it settled quickly before that crick in your neck turns into something more serious and costly.

Cheers!
__________________
1990 Porsche 964 Carrera 4 Cabriolet
1976 BMW 2002
1990 BMW 325is
1999 Porsche Boxster
(gone, but not forgotten)
http://i933.photobucket.com/albums/a...smiley-003.gif

Never drive faster than your Guardian Angel can fly!
Lil bastard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 02:59 PM   #7
Registered User
 
Perfectlap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 8,709
I would not buy a pre-2009 996-997/986-987 Boxster or Carrera without one or I would have it immediately installed if I did.

There is certainly value in taking care of that hassle before the purchase.
Kinda like buying a house with a new roof vs. one that needs immediate repairing.
Although with this Porsche not every roofer knows how to or is even pertmitted do this job, including the one who built the flawed roof in first place.

But since you are dealing with an insurance company, you know how that goes.
People are easily swayed if you simply inform them of a potentially catastrophic Porsche problem that was never addressed by the Germans, send the potential buyer the Excellence articles on the subject and a receipt of your IMS upgrade. An updated IMS would be a very strong selling point to a second hand buyer if you sell it that way, and it's not like your making any of this up to get the sale.
__________________
GT3 Recaro Seats - Boxster Red
GT3 Aero / Carrera 18" 5 spoke / Potenza RE-11
Fabspeed Headers & Noise Maker
BORN: March 2000 - FINLAND
IMS#1 REPLACED: April 2010 - NEW JERSEY -- LNE DUAL ROW

Last edited by Perfectlap; 09-29-2010 at 03:12 PM.
Perfectlap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 03:14 PM   #8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In the garage...
Posts: 1,608
sorry to hear of your misfortune

Unfortunately, no added value b/c of the unproven [flame suit on] new IMS you elected to have installed. I'd be careful even mentioning it... As Jim/L-Bastard said above, the car is expected to run. Plus, you'd have a helluva tough time getting Porsche to qualify the LN/Flat6 IMS as an acceptable OEM replacement part...

Sounds like you're already in an uphill battle for getting fair value for the car. Remember, just like in car sales, the adjusters are pros who 'value' totaled cars everyday for a living. As such, they want to give you the least amount possible. Based on the weak #s out there for Boxsters in general, you'll have your hands full pushing them for the most $.

Good luck and you may consider hiring a profession arbitrator/agency (if policy allows) to help even the playing field if their initial numbers are grim
Burg Boxster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2010, 07:11 PM   #9
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 691
Good luck with your claim, and I hope you get a fair price.


Unfortunately, I don't think pointing out a band-aide on a serious engine design flaw is a positive.


So I had the engine in the car your about to buy torn apart and we put this thing-a-majig in the engine so now it wont grenade like all the other Porsches do...yes, really...trust me...your all good now...


I suspect that Boxster owners will get the best resale where there is no discussion of IMS at all in a sales cycle.





/
__________________
SOLD - 2002 Boxster S - PSM, Litronics, De-ambered, Bird Bike Rack, Hardtop, RMS leak...

Last edited by fatmike; 09-29-2010 at 07:16 PM.
fatmike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2010, 05:10 AM   #10
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sanford NC
Posts: 2,377
Would it be

to an informed buyer? Yes. Few of them and they don't set the prices.

The only way I can think of to profit from your LN IMS upgrade is to sell the engine yourself to someone whose IMS just blew, to that person there would be added value. Otherwise it just becomes a commodity.

When I offered the settlement company the paperwork on my '99 when it was being totaled, they weren't even interested. They were gonna put it up for bid and take their money and run.
mikefocke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2010, 07:01 AM   #11
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 206
Garage
I am going to try to find out where they send the car. That way if anyone wants a good 3.2lt S motor with a lot of work done to it....
__________________
rob76turbo
Current Porsches: 2002 Boxster S (Speed yellow)
Past Porsches: 1972 914, 1987 944S, 1976 930, 1986 951, 1999 986, 1992 968, 2001 986 S, 2006 Cayman S, 1986 951 track car, 2001 986 S, 2005 Cayenne
rob76turbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2010, 07:02 AM   #12
Registered User
 
Jaxonalden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Oklahoma City
Posts: 1,209
Garage
Rob,

When you settle with the insurance company ask how much to buy the car back. If it's reasonable you can part it out and possibly make money and a few new friends.

I T-boned a guy after he left turned me in my truck. Truck was totaled (more than 80% of the current value to repair) and I was paid ($5,500) and I turned around and bought my truck back for $500. Still have it and its worth way more than what I paid.

If your engine is in good shape I'm sure someone would like to have a spare sitting around just in case, especially a 3.2.

Good luck.

P.S. I hope it comes up here to Oklahoma Foreign.
__________________
Sadly on the outside looking in.
"Drive it like the Doctor ordered"

Last edited by Jaxonalden; 09-30-2010 at 07:05 AM.
Jaxonalden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2010, 06:31 PM   #13
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 874
I'll give insurance as much grief as the next guy for the efforts they go to regards not paying out or offering lousy settlements. But in this case, I'd have to side with them. Strictly speaking, I would say the benefit of bearing upgrades is unproven. Likewise, one or two isolated examples of a car selling for a bit more than market due to having one fitted should not oblige an insurance company to pay out more.

Don't get me wrong, I certainly believe the bearing upgrade is worthwhile, but when it comes to insurance pay outs, I don't see it as being relevant. I think the bearing upgrade is best viewed as money you pay out to help protect against the cost of engine failure. If you get a little back when you sell it on, great. But I certainly wouldn't expect an insurance company to pay out more on a claim.
__________________
Manual '00 3.2 S Arctic Silver
pothole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2010, 07:50 AM   #14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 3,417
Send a message via AIM to blinkwatt
Sorry to hear about your wreck. I totaled my first Boxster a Porsche meet(wasn't speeding or nothing).

I wouldn't see how you can justify payout for any value on a IMS retrofit, after all even if your original IMS went and the engine blew...insurance wouldn't play any part in that either.

Can you PM the value that your going to be paid out? Just curious as i have 01' S.
__________________
-99' Zenith Blue 5-spd...didn't agree with a center divider on the freeway
-01' S Orient Red Metallic 6-spd...money pit...sold to buy a house
blinkwatt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2010, 08:18 AM   #15
Registered User
 
Perfectlap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 8,709
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatmike
I don't think pointing out a band-aide on a serious engine design flaw is a positive.
The probability of having your engine self-grenade from an IMS failure is probably a long blink of an eye. The number of IMS upgraded engines that have imploded because of an IMS failure is probably microscopic. Of those who've done the upgrade I've yet to hear of more than one disgruntled Carrera or Boxster owner. A first time Porsche buyer over reacts to the slightest warning. In this day and age with Google and a long list of Porsche forums it will take about 5 minutes for a potential buyer to find out about the IMS issue. Any buyer who has done even a little homework will get hip to it, not pointing it out won't ensure a thing and when the buyer does ask about it you're going to say "yes I have the IMS upgrade". Particulary when the longest threads by number of pages and thus most search hits are for this very subject. Someone familiar with the internet and forums seems to be inline with the typical German sports car buyer. How many times has a potential yet leary buyer logged onto one of these forums asking about RMS and IMS failures? I've lost count. To date, this is the only action you can take for a flawe that could turn your entire investment into vapor by simply turning the ignition key.
The insurance company doesn't give a damn about all this or that you faithfully changed your oil every six months instead of every three years. They'll pay you the same for the engine. The value in an IMS upgrade is the usual value of buying an enthusiast owned and well-maintained car.
__________________
GT3 Recaro Seats - Boxster Red
GT3 Aero / Carrera 18" 5 spoke / Potenza RE-11
Fabspeed Headers & Noise Maker
BORN: March 2000 - FINLAND
IMS#1 REPLACED: April 2010 - NEW JERSEY -- LNE DUAL ROW

Last edited by Perfectlap; 10-01-2010 at 08:23 AM.
Perfectlap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2010, 09:47 AM   #16
mts
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 312
I know I would pay more for a car that had the IMS procedure done. Of course, I've had a failure so I'm more sensitive to it than most.

On the other hand I'd be very surprised if the insurance company gave you any extra value on it. To them its just a repair.

Good luck with it though and let us know how it turns out.
__________________
2004 550 SE #1081 of 1953 (sold)
1997 911 Targa (sold)
mts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2010, 07:44 PM   #17
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 206
Garage
You know the old saying...the answer is no unless you ask....

Well, in the end it was probably worth the 20-30 minutes it took to write the letter to the insurance company. They did not move on the valuation. I will try to find out where it end up. I will also post the pix of the accident once the checks have cleared the bank....
__________________
rob76turbo
Current Porsches: 2002 Boxster S (Speed yellow)
Past Porsches: 1972 914, 1987 944S, 1976 930, 1986 951, 1999 986, 1992 968, 2001 986 S, 2006 Cayman S, 1986 951 track car, 2001 986 S, 2005 Cayenne
rob76turbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2010, 07:47 PM   #18
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 206
Garage
Oh and BTW, I am in the market for a 2003-2004 S

PM me if anyone is thinking of selling. If the car has any track mods....that has more interest to me.

Just missed one of the 2004 550 Sypder specials. Oh well.

Colors / Mods:

Yellow (Duh...)
Red
Silver
Gray
Blue(s)

No White, green, burgundy, black.
Manual trans.

Thanks everyone!
__________________
rob76turbo
Current Porsches: 2002 Boxster S (Speed yellow)
Past Porsches: 1972 914, 1987 944S, 1976 930, 1986 951, 1999 986, 1992 968, 2001 986 S, 2006 Cayman S, 1986 951 track car, 2001 986 S, 2005 Cayenne
rob76turbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-04-2010, 07:06 AM   #19
Registered User
 
Perfectlap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 8,709
do have pics of the carnage? I'd be curious to see what constitutes a total loss.
You didn't do it a Dario Franchitti end over end did you?
__________________
GT3 Recaro Seats - Boxster Red
GT3 Aero / Carrera 18" 5 spoke / Potenza RE-11
Fabspeed Headers & Noise Maker
BORN: March 2000 - FINLAND
IMS#1 REPLACED: April 2010 - NEW JERSEY -- LNE DUAL ROW
Perfectlap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-04-2010, 10:02 AM   #20
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sanford NC
Posts: 2,377
You'd be amazed

how little damage it takes to total a Boxster...at least I was. When the estimate hit 85% of replacement value they total it per my insurance company. Based on experience repairing other makes over the years, I thought $5k...they stopped at $26k. The car was driveable ... just slid under a pickup's bumper. Maybe $100 damage to the pickup.

mikefocke is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page