Need Professional Help Diagnosing with Durametric Data

[Jamesp]

Well the car was all put back together with a new 40 amp relay, everything seemed good and at 50 miles it throws the bank 1 and bank 2 SAI codes again. :ah:

Checked for voltage at the 40 amp fuse in the trunk and it is there.

Jumpered the 40 amp relay in the trunk and the SAI pump ran like a champ.

Checked the new 40 amp relay out of the car confirming switching and continuity.

Pulled the SAI hose and verified the fan is pushing air.

Video inspected the vacuum connections in the system and they all look good - they also hold vacuum using a hand operated vacuum pump.

Video inspected the electrical connection on the change over valve and it is connected and looks good (dusty but not oily).

So moving forward, and trying not to pull the flipping thing apart I figured I'd ask the Forum for their thoughts before I do some serious damage.

So here's the plan:

I've pulled connectors 1 through 4 from the main computer in the trunk.

The power from the SAI changeover valve appears to be coming from Connector 2 pin 30 from the Cartronics computer in the trunk. I'd appreciate it if someone can confirm that for a 2003. My documentation is for a 2000 and I'd hate to let the smoke out of something.

My plan is to probe pin 30 with 12 volts to manually actuate the changeover valve.

I can supply vacuum to to the system with the manual pump at the check valve.

At that point the shut off valve should open (may need to refresh the vacuum at this step)

With the shut off valve in the open position blow into the tube from the SAI pump to check for free air flow.

Jumper the SAI pump and note RPM changes with the hose connected, disconnected and with the changeover valve open and closed

If no free air flow or no SAI RPM change while manually configuring different system states work to inspect change over valve, shut off valve, passages in head etc.

Thoughts?

[particlewave]

Originally Posted by Gelbster

"everything seemed good and at 50 miles it throws the bank 1 and bank 2 SAI codes again
Obviously this is not the regular SAI problems.
Now that you've become an involuntary expert on the subject- the SAI system should not be running 50 miles after a start. So what happened then to produce code? A bump+loose connection? Fault to ground ? Such a transient fault would set a Pending Code and the next bump would add to the store of Pending codes and eventually the CEL would illuminate on the dash.
I ask this seemingly silly question because you've tested the system physically and electrically very carefully many times.
After the car has warmed up, can you wiggle any of the harness/connectors to produce the CEL ? Unless we can reproduce the situation that prompts the CEl we're just flailing.
The other more intelligent(?) option is to check continuously for Pending Codes whenever you are driving. Maybe there was a Pending SAI code set at start up but it requires reconfirmation before the light on the dash illuminates(at 50 miles) ? Or could this be just a Drive Cycle readiness process and it will eventually become 'ready'.
Good luck !

SAI fault will not immediately trigger a CEL.

Originally Posted by Jamesp

So here's the plan:

I've pulled connectors 1 through 4 from the main computer in the trunk.

The power from the SAI changeover valve appears to be coming from Connector 2 pin 30 from the Cartronics computer in the trunk. I'd appreciate it if someone can confirm that for a 2003. My documentation is for a 2000 and I'd hate to let the smoke out of something.

My plan is to probe pin 30 with 12 volts to manually actuate the changeover valve.

I can supply vacuum to to the system with the manual pump at the check valve.

At that point the shut off valve should open (may need to refresh the vacuum at this step)

With the shut off valve in the open position blow into the tube from the SAI pump to check for free air flow.

Jumper the SAI pump and note RPM changes with the hose connected, disconnected and with the changeover valve open and closed

If no free air flow or no SAI RPM change while manually configuring different system states work to inspect change over valve, shut off valve, passages in head etc.

Thoughts?

Sounds like s solid plan. Can the electronic changeover valve and air pump be triggered by the Durametric with the engine not running? I thought I read that they could, but have not played with my Durametric much yet.

Guess what I got yesterday...p0410 and p1411! Yay! :dance:
I suspect my changeover valve cleaning didn't take, though it lasted a few months.

[Gelbster]

This is why I wrote "Pending Code" -twice.
Good luck with the diagnostics. Awful access ,much sympathy.
Before you dig in, may be worth running the engine longer to see if any other Pending Codes appear. I suggest this because it would be a pity to have to do over.
If you remove the SAI pump, run it on the bench for 5 minutes to see if it makes distressed noises or becomes hot. The internals of these pumps have issues. There is a diy to refurb and lube it.Dismantling the pump part is easy but the motor itself is staked. So if the motor is getting hot ,that may become a failure eventually.
On mine you can run the SAI pump with key on engine off using Durametric. If you try the valves - you can hear them make a muffled click.