Cheap easy HP gains?

[Topless]

Originally Posted by shadrach74

I think an easy way to gain a few pony's is to leave the stock headers in place and remove the secondaries. $250 buys a 2-3% hp increase on an S plus a loss of ~35lbs. If you then opened the intake with a better set up, reflashed the ECU and added an underdrive pulley. I think you'd get gains that you could feel for about $1200-1500. Earth shattering? No. However, if properly fettled, there is no reason why the 3.2 can not make around the same BHP/liter as the 3.4 996.

It all sounds good on paper Shad but in 7 years of looking I have seen very few examples of success with this. None were inexpensive. The best example was a few years ago when a guy had quality headers, racing exhaust, well thought-out custom one-off intake, larger TB, plenum, ported intake runners, and a custom dyno tune to make the most out of his changes. He did find about 25 hp at 6500rpm but it cost him $6k to get it done and the torque curve was significantly narrowed. Lap times after all this... no measurable improvement. He gained paper hp but sacrificed a broad torque curve and driveability in the process. The car was also no longer street legal.

Ultimately it is your car and your dough so if you think you can find the magic bullet here, have a go and let us all know how it turns out. A cool dyno slip doesn't really interest me. Until I actually see a car turning faster laps by making these changes, I'll be on the sidelines. Compare this to dropping in a 3.4L, the difference in performance is instant and measurable in significant improvement in lap times.

[JAAY]

I have dyno'd my car more times than I can remember. I'd like to not re visit the BS I had to deal with when posting my graphs. HP numbers are subjective. I used my dyno time to tune and compare products.

My signature states the best result combination with no loss of hp or torque.

[JAAY]

This guy tells it like it is with proof. in his case the ebay headers were not a good choice. I run turbowerx only because I got a great deal on them.


Porsche 996 by OZ951

[shadrach74]

Originally Posted by Topless

It all sounds good on paper Shad but in 7 years of looking I have seen very few examples of success with this. None were inexpensive. The best example was a few years ago when a guy had quality headers, racing exhaust, well thought-out custom one-off intake, larger TB, plenum, ported intake runners, and a custom dyno tune to make the most out of his changes. He did find about 25 hp at 6500rpm but it cost him $6k to get it done and the torque curve was significantly narrowed. Lap times after all this... no measurable improvement. He gained paper hp but sacrificed a broad torque curve and driveability in the process. The car was also no longer street legal.

Ultimately it is your car and your dough so if you think you can find the magic bullet here, have a go and let us all know how it turns out. A cool dyno slip doesn't really interest me. Until I actually see a car turning faster laps by making these changes, I'll be on the sidelines. Compare this to dropping in a 3.4L, the difference in performance is instant and measurable in significant improvement in lap times.

I hear you, improperly done mods typically decrease performance. I'm not saying there is a magic bullet. What I'm saying is there must be a reason that that the 996 make 10 more HP per liter, or 20% more HP for 6.25% more displacement. IIRC, the heads are the same and the cams are the same. The CR is almost the same 11.3 to 11.1. That leaves the engine management, exhaust and intake as possible choke points. It's not magic, it's physics. what one can do the other ought to be able to closely match in scale. IF Porsche had built the 3.2 to the same level as the 3.4, we'd be complaining that the 3.2 only has 275-280HP.

6K for 25hp? OK, a 3.4 buys you 50HP over an S, what's that cost? It would likely make 6K easily palatable.

[Topless]

Originally Posted by shadrach74

6K for 25hp? OK, a 3.4 buys you 50HP over an S, what's that cost? It would likely make 6K easily palatable.

Well, for $6-8K a guy who is handy with tools could install a good used 3.4L and his car would actually be measurably faster. Ask JAAY.

JAAY, thanks for the link to that guys build. A very honest and thorough appraisal of his findings without all the hype, bravado, and confirmation bias so often found on other websites like suxspeed. He clearly "gets it".

[BYprodriver]

Originally Posted by Topless

Well, for $6-8K a guy who is handy with tools could install a good used 3.4L and his car would actually be measurably faster. Ask JAAY.

JAAY, thanks for the link to that guys build. A very honest and thorough appraisal of his findings without all the hype, bravado, and confirmation bias so often found on other websites like suxspeed. He clearly "gets it".

HaHa "suxspeed" the official bling site of Porschedom!

[BYprodriver]

My oem exhaust manifolds had a minimum of 1/4" extra weld thickness at the entrance & exit pipes pre & post warmup cat. Grinding this away to minimum weld thickness minimizes the flow restriction while maintaining emmisions compliance. This should enhance high rpm power & possibly low rpm torque. Replacing the oem exhaust manifold gasket with a quality, thick header gasket MAYBE will reduce engine temp, although this is the one area of the engine you want hot since hot air moves faster than cold.

[shadrach74]

Originally Posted by BYprodriver

HaHa "suxspeed" the official bling site of Porschedom!

Have you used their test pipes? Were not talking about a complex piece here, pretty much an 90 degree L pipe with a few minor angles.

[Johnny Danger]

Shadrach74,

Here's the answer to all of your header/cat exhaust woes . A set of custom fabricated headers and precats from M&M Exhaust in Germany. They feature longer, equal length primaries with 2.25 diameter piping, along with an F1 style merge collector and HJS 200 cell trimetal cats - beautifully made from T316 stainless steel . Net hp increase - probably somewhere in the range of 8 to 10 hp at the wheel . Cost - approximately $3800 . Aggregate cost- about $300 or so per hp .



http://www.fvd.us/us/en/Porsche-0/Boxster_986-13-41/-/-/item/item_details/VID_57324217-VCD_35203588-gid_28-sort_4-display_50-item_BES98601200S/EXHAUST_-_Tuning_-_Headers-BES98601200S-Sport_Headers_`Brombacher`__986_S_-04_with_200_cell_sport_catalytics.html

[Ghostrider 310]

I'm starting to think you just have a Woodrow Wilson for Chinese goods, my pipes were equal length, metal was T304 stainless, merge collectors were the same, pre cats? Not a problem for the 2.5 people. The only thing I see is a higher price.

[BYprodriver]

Originally Posted by shadrach74

Have you used their test pipes? Were not talking about a complex piece here, pretty much an 90 degree L pipe with a few minor angles.

No, I have Fabspeeds. I assume Topspeed was refering to 6speedonline in his post, thats the go to place for bling mods!

[Topless]

Originally Posted by BYprodriver

No, I have Fabspeeds. I assume Topspeed was refering to 6speedonline in his post, thats the go to place for bling mods!

Absolutely accurate prodriver. I go there when I need a good laugh.

[shadrach74]

Originally Posted by Ghostrider 310

Almost anything is better than that 3 hole flute they shipped it with

Ya think? What a work of art...