Go Back   986 Forum - for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners > Porsche Boxster & Cayman Forums > Boxster General Discussions

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-17-2017, 02:34 PM   #1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,625
Auto insurance claim questions

Had a mishap with the Box this weekend, and am trying to figure out my options regarding insurance. (No injuries, happy to reportÖjust a serious fender bender.) Iím afraid the car, which has been running great, has the great potential for being totaled, an outcome Iíd love to avoid. Have had this ride for 11 years and have never tired of it.

At this point she was flat-bedded to where Iíd get any body work done, but theyíre not open til Monday. (Actually, they were open for a few hours on Sat, and I did go in and talk to one guy. He said the person whoíll get things going with the estimate will be in come Monday morning.)

My problem is that over the 40-some years Iíve been driving Iíve very rarely submitted any claims and have no experience with this situation where a car I donít want totaled very likely may be. I guess my questions probably would be:
1) Iíve got a $1k deductible on my collision insurance. Are insurance companies at all open to offers to up the amount Iíd personally be willing to fork out towards the repair? This all assumes that thereís no structural damage (if there is, sentiment aside, Iíd readily go along with the ďtotaledĒ assessment). From what Iíve read so far, it sounds like itís kind of a black/white thing---not totaled and they fix it, totaled and they donít. But if itís just bumper/fender/headlight repair thatís needed to make the car whole again, it seems crazy they wouldnít be open to me tossiní in a few more bucks to bring about the fix. The car would then be no less sound than it was prior to the accident.

2) Is there any illegality to working with the body shop, offering to pay part myself (ie directly to them) and have them then submit an estimate that the insurance company IS likely to result in a Ďgo-aheadí to fixing the car? (Sounds kind of bribe-like, I know, but thereís really no intent to defraud anyone here. I just want to get a car that I'm pretty sure is fixable fixed.) I havenít talked to Ďthe maní at the body shop---I have no idea what their policy would be in such circumstances. Is it likely theyíd be willing to talk to me about the estimate prior to submitting it to the insurance company?

3) If a car is totaled, apparently there is a process by which one can buy it back from the insurance company? How does that work? Iím not sure Iíd do that, but if that happens and I have the car repaired elsewhere (this body shop has already indicated they have a policy against doing repairs on cars declared totaled), will it have a salvage title? Is it likely the insurance company I've been with for decades would still be willing to insure it?

4) Iíve got a rental clause in my insurance contract, and Iíve not done that yet. At the moment my older son has a spare vehicle heís willing to loan me. If I continued to use it instead of burning up additional insurance company funds, does that help my case negotiating any of this?
I guess what I really just need to know boils down to this: What points should I bring up and what questions should I ask, to both the insurance company and the body shop, and (I guess), what order do I need to be doing these things?

I donít know if Iím crazy to even push this angle. It IS a fair amount of miles on the carÖitíd probably make more sense to negotiate the buyout and put the bucks towards a replacement. Like I said, though, I still really love this car---for a 16-year old car it still looks great (other than the obvious current problem), and mechanically it feels like it could go another 95k.

Frodo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2017, 05:17 PM   #2
Certified Boxster Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 7,517
First, get an estimate that you and the insurance company agree on.

Second, the insurance company will either agree to pay the amount of the estimate or tell you that the car might be a total loss.

If they are going to pay to repair, just work with the insurance company and body shop to get it done. Inspect the work closely and reject anything not done properly.

If possibly total loss, the devil is in the insurance company valuation. They are notoriously inaccurate. Read it carefully and dispute any and everything that isn't correct. If needed, create your own valuation by finding cars online and do the same math that they do and submit it as a competing valuation. Then be ready to argue with them endlessly.

Once you and the insurance agree on a valuation, they will tell you the buy back price of your totaled car. You can then go to the body shop on your own and get an estimate of the work that you want done. It is possible that the valuation amount will be more then the buy back cost + the repair cost (meaning you could have money left over in your pocket). It depends on how good you are at negotiating with the body shop (for example, have them refurbish the bumper cover vs buying a new one and that sort of thing).

The insurance company should provide a rental car until they repair the car or until they pay you the valuation amount. Be SURE to get the date that they expect you to turn in the rental car stated clearly. Any days after that you will be charged. You will likely have to argue about this with them also.

Yes, a total loss car will have a salvage title which will hurt re-sale value but I would expect your insurance company to be willing to insure it as long as you can prove that it was professionally repaired. They might ask to inspect before insuring it but that's not a big deal.

Hope this helps.
__________________
1999 996 C2 - sold - bought back - sold for more
1997 Spec Boxster BSR #254
1979 911 SC
POC Licensed DE/TT Instructor

Last edited by thstone; 09-17-2017 at 05:28 PM.
thstone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2017, 05:26 PM   #3
Certified Boxster Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 7,517
For a real world example, my son's BMW X5 was hit by someone who ran a red light in May.

I drove the car to a local body shop and got an estimate. The insurance came back and said that it was likely a total loss.

Their first valuation offer was $5,400 which I didn't agree with. Comparable cars ranged from $4,500 to $9,000 (these were my comps. All of their comps were $4,00-$6000). I was willing to meet in the middle of my range. They weren't. They insisted on paying nothing more than $6K. After endless arguing, I settled for $7,309. But it took lots of phone calls, emails, and working with their management to get what I felt was fair. It was not an enjoyable experience but in the end, I got $2,309 more than I would have otherwise. Was it worth it? I thought so, but it did take a lot of time and effort.

The other advantage that I had was that I didn't need their money to buy my son a replacement car and I didn't need their rental to get him around. We turned in the rental within a two weeks when I bought him a replacement car (2008 Mini Cooper S) so I didn't have any time pressure to have to settle for less.
__________________
1999 996 C2 - sold - bought back - sold for more
1997 Spec Boxster BSR #254
1979 911 SC
POC Licensed DE/TT Instructor

Last edited by thstone; 09-17-2017 at 05:36 PM.
thstone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2017, 05:37 PM   #4
1997, PCA Riverside
 
rexcramer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Upland, CA
Posts: 1,097
Garage
Good to hear no injuries. I would suggest that you don't tip your hand to the insurance company too early. Be firm and start pushing from the beginning. Insurance companies are in business to minimize their loss, not yours. Do your homework and crunch the numbers. Always ask for more than you want. I was rear ended in March. The car is repaired and I am happy with the condition. I am still arguing with them regarding the medical claim.
rexcramer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2017, 07:14 PM   #5
Registered User
 
husker boxster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Omaha
Posts: 2,239
Take some pics of the damage / condition it is in now. If you get it repaired and ever need to sell it, you'll have documentation as to the wrecked condition. If you get it repaired after being totaled and keep it for 4-5 more yrs, having a salvage title will hurt less if a buyer knows it's been driven for many yrs since the repair.
__________________
PCA National HPDE Instructor
2008 Boxster S Limited Edition #005
2007 Cayman S - SOLD on Valentine's Day 2013
2008 Cayman S Sport - Signal Green
husker boxster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 04:08 AM   #6
Registered User
 
itsnotanova's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Bastrop, Tx
Posts: 2,251
Can you post a picture of the damage? I'm pretty good at telling what's messed up from looking at pictures. I've never worked the insurance side of the business but I can tell you that the insurance companies are very quick to total a 986 boxster. I've seen them write off boxster's for as little as a bumper cover getting ripped off. I've even seen them total a boxster because the AOS went out. I hate to tell you but they're more than likely going to want to total it. I have had customers who were able to convince the insurance company not to write their car off by getting quotes from body shops on their own. They also searched for replacement parts on their own as to drive the cost down. I think it will have a lot to do with your insurance company's rules and procedures, but also the claims adjuster and how willing they are to work with you. If you want to save your boxster, you'll need to start getting prepared to have information that will save the insurance company money. Take some pictures to body shops in your area and get a rough estimate. Every body shop will need to see the car in person to give an accurate estimate, but at least you can somewhat weed out the more expensive shops. You also need to start calling around to your local salvage yards for parts. I can help you with the small stuff, but large body parts you'll want to source locally.
__________________
Woody
itsnotanova is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 07:08 AM   #7
On the slippery slope
 
JayG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: San Diego
Posts: 3,350
Garage
Tom Stone pretty much told it like it is.

As far as the rental car, you have pad for it through your premiums. It won't effect your claim one way or another
__________________
2004 Boxster S 6 speed - DRL relay hack, Polaris AutoTop DIY
2004 996 Targa Tip
Instructor - San Diego region, 2014 Porsche Performance Driving School
2013 C300, 2010 Jetta 2011 Mazda 3, 1998 Windstar - Dog van , 2004 F-150 "Big Red"
JayG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 07:53 AM   #8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,625
Thanks to all. Good advice across the board.

Woody, I wanted to get a photo up at the start. Problem for me is Iíve always used photobucket to do that. Now that theyíve stopped being reasonable on their terms (and I therefore no longer use them), I need to develop a new way of doing the pics. I just havenít take the time to figure that out yet, especially now that my life just got more complicated with this damaged car. Iíll see if I can come up with something.

In the meantime (Sigh) I may start half-heartedly looking at potential replacements. Itís a testament to the Boxster, at least to the one Iíve driven for the past 11 years, that I have no doubt Iíll be getting another. Iíve never tired of driving that car.

So HuskerÖfor the record, you still have no interest in selliní Punkin??
Frodo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 08:15 AM   #9
Motorist & Coffee Drinker
 
78F350's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2,323
Garage
Do not be timid. Insurance is a service that you have paid for. You are the customer and are entitled to claim all the value and benefit for which you have been charged.

Years ago I had an Infiniti I30 that was rear-ended by a motorcycle. Center of the rear bumper was pushed slightly into the spare tire well. The insurance company totaled it. I took the settlement minus the residual value of the car. The settlement was more than I had paid for the car, but I still could have negotiated a better price over their comps. I gave the car to my son, who had it repaired to be safe, but not cosmetically perfect for $500. He was happy to drive it for another 2 years before selling it.
Laws on salvage and rebuilt titles vary widely from state to state. Start at your states DMV website and make some calls to learn the details.
__________________
I am not an attorney, mechanic, or member of the clergy. Following any advice given in my posts is done at your own peril.
78F350 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 08:37 AM   #10
Registered User
 
husker boxster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Omaha
Posts: 2,239
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frodo View Post
So HuskerÖfor the record, you still have no interest in selliní Punkin??
For the record - nope, not for sale.
It's only a few months short of TEN YEARS ago that I bought her. No thoughts of selling. 2nd longest stint for me owning a car. Will be 5 yrs in a few months for my CSS. She'll be in 3rd place then. Usually get the itch to sell after 4 yrs, but not with these 2.

The Mercedes dealership here in OMA just had an LE but it was a tip. However, it is evidently sold as it's not listed in their inventory. There are LEs out there. Do it, you'll love one.
__________________
PCA National HPDE Instructor
2008 Boxster S Limited Edition #005
2007 Cayman S - SOLD on Valentine's Day 2013
2008 Cayman S Sport - Signal Green
husker boxster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 09:16 AM   #11
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,625
Quote:
Originally Posted by husker boxster View Post
There are LEs out there. Do it, you'll love one.
That's what I'd figured. A few years ago I'd never have considered an orange car.

Now? It's growing on me.
Frodo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 09:33 AM   #12
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: La Salle County IL
Posts: 76
Garage
You need to get an agreed figure from the carrier and the shop to make any decision. Some state laws total cars once the estimate is at a certain percentage of the value. Some strictly look at the dollars of damage, the dollar value of the salvage, and the market value of the car prior to the loss. If you retain the car (not the same as buying it back) the title never changes hands and there is no salvage title. There will very likely be a record on the VIN history of the loss. Some carriers will pay you to use a family member's car, some won't. Be sure and review the data behind the total loss value to know its comparable to what you had.
FoxRvrBox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 02:25 PM   #13
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Mississauga
Posts: 67
Garage
Here in the Toronto area we have some independent appraisers who get involved in this kind of case on behalf of the driver. Often the insurance companies will not be aware of the value of a Porsche, so getting a proper estimate of the value before the crash can help with what they pay out if they write it off. I would think the same thing is available where you are.
TripleTrophy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2017, 03:25 PM   #14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sanford NC
Posts: 2,344
I was amazed at what repairs done right cost when an estimate was done on my first Boxster. I had in my head $3-4k, the body shop stopped at $26k. I got a check for several thousand more than I paid for it 5 months before and the insurance company knew what I paid to the penny. I took the check and bought a 2 year newer Boxster but this time an S for the insurance money. Not 6 months later someone rear ended me and the bill was what I would expect, $1400 or so. Looking back I wonder if the second body shop (dealer owned) would have saved the first car, after all there were F-cars waiting the best body shop in town's attention.
mikefocke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2017, 03:54 PM   #15
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,625
Well, good (and highly unexpected) news. Insurance company agreed the damage was below the cutoff for totalling the car and have, accordingly, agreed to the repair. The estimate came to around $6700 (before deductible) to include $1800 (!) just for the passenger side headlamp. (Woody tried to help me, but the insurance people wouldn't accept parts from miscellaneous third parties...even those with great reputations on 986forum )

They apparently valued the car ('01 S, 95k miles) at around $11k.

Thanks, all, for the input...much appreciated.
Frodo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2017, 05:25 PM   #16
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,244
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frodo View Post
Well, good (and highly unexpected) news. Insurance company agreed the damage was below the cutoff for totalling the car and have, accordingly, agreed to the repair. The estimate came to around $6700 (before deductible) to include $1800 (!) just for the passenger side headlamp. (Woody tried to help me, but the insurance people wouldn't accept parts from miscellaneous third parties...even those with great reputations on 986forum )

They apparently valued the car ('01 S, 95k miles) at around $11k.

Thanks, all, for the input...much appreciated.
That's great news, thanks for the update and hope you are back on the road soon!

PaulE is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page