Go Back   986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners > Porsche Boxster & Cayman Forums > Boxster General Discussions

Post Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-28-2017, 03:18 AM   #21
Registered User
 
Nine8Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Montreal, QC. (currently expat to Shanghai)
Posts: 3,249
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertKing View Post
Jump start it, drive around for 30 or 40 minutes and you're likely good to go. If the battery was disconnected, that does not mean the battery is good. 12.3 or so volts sounds right but, that's not under a load. Test the battery before going for expensive and likely unnecessary repairs.
You have no idea how hard it is to jump start a 2,050 horsepower Boxster, Rob Batt is brand new from 2016, from Porsche (in special, of course). But will take your advice and drive it as soon as it starts.

Thanks for helping me out bud

__________________
______________________________
'97 Boxster base model 2.5L, Guards Red/Tan leather, with a new but old Alpine am/fm radio.
Nine8Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 03:25 AM   #22
Registered User
 
Nine8Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Montreal, QC. (currently expat to Shanghai)
Posts: 3,249
I haven't tried the now dried Immob in the car yet. I'm actually petrified it explode. INstead I took my wife's advice and crashed for an hour. Pretty hard to get the adrenaline drained out after something like that man... especially a $3,500 part/labour. Makes it even worst when you actually find out that the part itself (immob) has roughly $27 worth of Tokyo, Manila and Taiwan components and a $10 PCB, but sold back at 1000% profit :/ F'(ed) up stuff.....

Anyway, took some the out for souvenirs before the explosion lollll I'll report 2mrw when the carpet is 'dried' from that topless night (placed chopsticks under the carpet holding parts of it straight up), I'm done for the day though. Thanks for all the support and help so far folks. Great people - great forum.



PS: The Boxster is NOT a pos, was really mad and out of myself when I wrote that. My sincere apologies guys.... shouldn't happen again.







__________________
______________________________
'97 Boxster base model 2.5L, Guards Red/Tan leather, with a new but old Alpine am/fm radio.

Last edited by Nine8Six; 08-28-2017 at 03:32 AM.
Nine8Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 03:26 AM   #23
Registered User
 
Nine8Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Montreal, QC. (currently expat to Shanghai)
Posts: 3,249
stupid car though.... plug the batt NEG and the trunks pops up. Bloody funny but not funny at the same time :/
__________________
______________________________
'97 Boxster base model 2.5L, Guards Red/Tan leather, with a new but old Alpine am/fm radio.
Nine8Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 05:05 AM   #24
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: New England
Posts: 296
Fred,
You might look into a waterproof immobilizer case from ECU doctor. I haven't installed one myself, but I think anyone who parks their 986 outdoors should probably go this route...

Porsche Boxster & 996 Immobilizer Waterproof Case Enclosure
Need_for_speed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 06:29 AM   #25
inveniam viam aut faciam
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Arvada, CO
Posts: 440
Just saw this thread. I think the immobilizer under the seat is the "IMS bearing" of the 986/996 electrical system. A lot of Boxsters have been needlessly totalled as a result of this VERY stupid design to put a critical electronic device on the floor in a roadster. The first thing to do if you get water on the floor is to disconnect the immo or battery. The damage results from power being applied while the module is wet, as you get a kind of "electrolysis" which turns the metals on the board to metal salts, which will not stop until either the power is removed or the circuits open up.

As for the repairing it, it is good that you got it out and dried out ASAP. The problem is, if it gets to the point where functions start to fail, you have corrosion under the relays. The ONLY way to fix that is to desolder the relays, clean it up thoroughly (soap and water with a brush is good), dry it and repair the damage. That may include replacing relays. I would also replace the electrolytic cap any time the immobilizer gets wet.

I have a few immobilizers where the corrosion under the relay was not repaired and the traces under the relays got thin enough that they burned. That is a death sentence for the PCB as the board turns to carbon and conducts. While it is possible to repair the holes (BTDT all the time in a former life - cut out all burned areas, re-fiberglass, then put in new traces and vias.), I wouldn't bother, as you can almost always find used ones. FWIW, one of my first jobs out of school was working at an electronics company that did disaster recovery on main frame computers. I still remember getting a "mission critical" computer (DEC MicroVAX) that was in flood that was shipped in a big plastic crate full of water. It was better to leave it wet, and then disassemble it down to individual components. Even the disk drives were soaked, but we got all the data and rebuilt them another machine using most of the parts from their original. That job paid six figures as I recall, but the customer gladly paid. But I digress...

Yes, you can usually swap the EEPROM or EEPROM data from one module to another, as long as they are the the same part number. I do have a good memory map of where the various codes for the vehicle are (remote transponder codes, "learning" code, immobilizer code, etc.) I did find one immo where there was a firmware difference making the EEPROM data incompatible between two immos of the same part number. In that situation I had to rewrite the data in the proper format, so knowing where the necessary information to transfer was necessary. I find this situation is more likely when you go to a new immo.

So, for Fred I would recommend disassembling the immo, clean it with a brush and soap and water (it already got wet, right?), getting off ALL the visible corrosion (metal salts) as that stuff is conductive. You really need to get under the relays, as just spraying electrical cleaner, etc. will not get that corrosion out, and the only way to do that is to remove the relays.

As for my user name Qmulus, I have been using that on internet sites for 20 years and it is also the name of my company. I do this kind of work as a part of my business, but I honestly don't make much from it as this stuff take WAY more time to do than I can ever charge for. I see it more of as a "community service", but I can't do it for free.

Steve
Qmulus Technology
__________________
'03 S, manual, 18" Carrera wheels, PSM, PSE, Litronic, 996 Cluster, +

Last edited by Qmulus; 08-28-2017 at 06:35 AM.
Qmulus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 07:40 AM   #26
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Detroit
Posts: 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine8Six View Post
'97 for your reference/record below Charles. And can you please source/fabricate us a sealed enclosure that the Immob fits into? (please). You'll save so many great Boxsters and 911... these things are nearly shot man, or soon will be if not taken care right away. Take my word... not exactly cheap
Like this?

Porsche Boxster & 996 Immobilizer Waterproof Case Enclosure
Disaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 07:49 AM   #27
Porsche "Purist"
 
Paul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 2,123
Garage
Interesting. A reset EEPROM?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCnpQvEWL_U
__________________
1998 Boxster with 7.8 DME, 2005 3.6 liter/325 hp, Variocam Plus, 996 Instrument panel
2001 Boxster original owner. I installed used motor at 89k.
1987 924S. 2002 996TT. PST-2
Owned and repaired Porsches since 1974. Porsche: It's not driving, it's therapy.
Paul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 09:40 AM   #28
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 374
Garage
First of all, I feel your pain... Sure I´m not the only one, this really sucks...

However, is this not the perfect time for the thread we have all been praying for (secretly)..?

"Custom Waterproof Immobilizer for Porsche 986 [from CAD, prototyping to finish]" Go Fred Gooo!
Robert986 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 11:35 AM   #29
Registered User
 
kjc2050's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Wake Forest, NC
Posts: 867
Garage
Ugh. Good luck, Fred. Hope you get it sorted quickly!
__________________
2000 Boxster S, 6 speed, Sport Package, Litronics, LED tail lights, LNE IMS-B, OBC, Skybreaker wind deflector, Arctic Silver/Graphite Grey
kjc2050 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 11:37 AM   #30
I am No. 1348
 
algiorda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Tampa/FL
Posts: 340
Garage
Sorry for laughing at this thread Fred, but you are one funny Sum-n-a-********************!

p.s. your wife sounds like a cracker as well.
__________________
Current: 2004 Boxster S 550 Spyder Anniversary Edition (BSSE)
algiorda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 01:15 PM   #31
MWS
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 410
Quick question... Did you do the "donor battery - fuse box" method to originally open the frunk? I ask beause I did (a year or so ago) on a totally dead Box and ended up with a world of electrical gremlins. Took a while to investigate and fix, but eventually all resolved (had to buy a new climate module though)...all good now except climate unit still blinks on startup.

I mention this because when I asked on forum, I got the same answers... "ignition switch", "immoblilizer" etc; I ruled out immoblilizer (or moved it down on list) because I didn't want it to be that. Ignition switch... I thought not as bad, but but I'll keep looking. I found a couple bad fuses and a relay, which I replaced. Car ended up starting, but I kept blowing one fuse, wich lead me to disassemble the climate unit and inside I found a shorted board.

Anyway, and I am sure you know this, but start at the easiest thing, don't assume the worst, be a good detective and I'm sure you will find the answer.

Or maybe it's just the immoblilizer... Or the ignition switch.

As always, best wishes.
MWS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 03:15 PM   #32
Certified Boxster Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 7,669
I keep a spare set of ECU/immobilizer/key fob on hand at all times. If you can buy the same year, then no PWIS programming is required - its an easy 10 min DIY swap of all three components together as a matched set.

A set will typically sell for $500-$700.
__________________
1999 996 C2 - sold - bought back - sold for more
1997 Spec Boxster BSR #254
1979 911 SC
POC Licensed DE/TT Instructor

Last edited by thstone; 08-28-2017 at 03:18 PM.
thstone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 09:23 PM   #33
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Visalia, Ca
Posts: 136
I read the first post, the immobilizer is under the drivers seat so, dismissed the water under the passenger seat as an issue. Basic trouble shooting is to go from simple to complex, not the other way round, hence my suggestion. A battery can be new and have sat on a shelf for many months before sale. ALWAYS, test the battery first. Next, test for current draw. Then, test ECU/Immobilizer for issues. If you go the opposite direction, you needlessly spend time and money when it may be as simple and cheap, as a battery cable. My own Boxster S (2001 3.2L) had a very low battery after 3 weeks of not being driven. Same symptoms. Hooked up a charger for a few hours, turned the key and she started right up.
RobertKing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 09:29 PM   #34
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Visalia, Ca
Posts: 136
2,050 horsepower? On what planet? Brand new battery is meaningless. Brand new, can fail just as often and as quick as 3 years old or more. You've no idea how long that battery sat on a storeroom shelf before it was sold to you. I do diagnostics on computers every single day, it's my living. Batteries and such issues are no difference. Simple to complex is the proper order. Eliminate the simple before moving onto something complex. While it could be, the immobilizer, it's far more likely something much higher on the chain is the actual culprit. As I said in a previous post, my own, 2001 Boxster S did the same thing after 3 weeks of not being driven. A few hours charge and she was back up and running.
RobertKing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 09:32 PM   #35
Custom User Title Here
 
particlewave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ft. Leonard Wood
Posts: 6,163
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertKing View Post
I read the first post, the immobilizer is under the drivers seat so, dismissed the water under the passenger seat as an issue. Basic trouble shooting is to go from simple to complex, not the other way round, hence my suggestion. A battery can be new and have sat on a shelf for many months before sale. ALWAYS, test the battery first. Next, test for current draw. Then, test ECU/Immobilizer for issues. If you go the opposite direction, you needlessly spend time and money when it may be as simple and cheap, as a battery cable. My own Boxster S (2001 3.2L) had a very low battery after 3 weeks of not being driven. Same symptoms. Hooked up a charger for a few hours, turned the key and she started right up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertKing View Post
2,050 horsepower? On what planet? Brand new battery is meaningless. Brand new, can fail just as often and as quick as 3 years old or more. You've no idea how long that battery sat on a storeroom shelf before it was sold to you. I do diagnostics on computers every single day, it's my living. Batteries and such issues are no difference. Simple to complex is the proper order. Eliminate the simple before moving onto something complex. While it could be, the immobilizer, it's far more likely something much higher on the chain is the actual culprit. As I said in a previous post, my own, 2001 Boxster S did the same thing after 3 weeks of not being driven. A few hours charge and she was back up and running.
Yikes.

Yeah...I'm fairly sure it's the immobilizer.
You really ought to read every post on a thread before commenting. His battery is fine.

Last edited by particlewave; 08-28-2017 at 09:35 PM.
particlewave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 11:23 PM   #36
Registered User
 
Nine8Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Montreal, QC. (currently expat to Shanghai)
Posts: 3,249
Robert, my battery is the Best-in-the-World! Well, you know what I mean by that. Made in Tacalloo (new country), and marked up 1000%. Fits well though



What you said totally make sense and I should have charged up the battery before to rule this out. I actually did today just to give it a better life than it had. And you are so right man, often the silliest things we forget are often the cause of bigger problem(s). Always best to keep a down to earth approach when doing car diagnostic. Although pretty hard to achieve when you know zero about Porsche cars (my first Porsche man).

All I know is when electronics starts flashing and resisting in porsche cars, it either the audi $10 switch or the windshield washer fluid gone bad lollll As hard as I tried to believe it wasn’t the immobilizer, trust me I did tried :/

Keep up the great advice man
__________________
______________________________
'97 Boxster base model 2.5L, Guards Red/Tan leather, with a new but old Alpine am/fm radio.
Nine8Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 11:29 PM   #37
Registered User
 
Nine8Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Montreal, QC. (currently expat to Shanghai)
Posts: 3,249
preetee pics, as always....

Immob back in car, car start normally (amazingly?), but everything else fails; locking/remote mechanism, windows, etc etc don’t know what else, don’t care. Windshield washer pump and brake lights works super well though :/ man it xux

Steve (Qmulus Technology) thanks for jumping in – way too kind. The information you’ve published is already invaluable to the community, thanks so much. Same goes to the folks who can tweak and flash those YEEPROMM. Pretty amazing the wealth of knowledge and skills we have on this forum.

Saying skills; to reverse engineer and go as far as removing 20y old crispy components (relays, caps, whatever else it'll need), or flashing chips, you need that guy with 30y experience and with some preety damn solid ‘skills’. The problem is not much knowledge, it’s about NOT screwing up (zero/nada) anything in the process LOLLL So if this happens to you, place your brain where it normally goes and hire the folks who knows what they are doing. DO NOT ATTEMPT BY YOURSELF (you’ll screw up something and create more problems I promise LOL).



Steve was spot on though. You can trace back those relays to that Toshiba driver and much all pins from that are high. Consistent with what happening in the car (solid ugly RED lights on every switches).

So now my current status is passed well beyond suicidal, not sure what it’s called but it doesn’t feel right – my boxster is dead for the first time, OUCH lollll My indy found a replacement ($300) but said don’t expect it to be less damaged than yours (+dealer’s pst/piwis, + whatever else they have at $3000 for sale there I’m sure…).

The (only) other option is the cleanup, repair and/or get a fresh set of relays (clearly). Steve – give me a week to figure out if the guys can do this here if not, check your mail next week and slip me in your schedule if you can man. I’d really appreciate if it comes to this.
__________________
______________________________
'97 Boxster base model 2.5L, Guards Red/Tan leather, with a new but old Alpine am/fm radio.
Nine8Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 11:43 PM   #38
Registered User
 
Nine8Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Montreal, QC. (currently expat to Shanghai)
Posts: 3,249
Quote:
Originally Posted by algiorda View Post
Sorry for laughing at this thread Fred.
Wait until I've drafted the "What I've Learn from the Immobilizer - in a swampster" thread. That's going to go online very soon

That whole heavy rain thing, parking outdoor, covers, humidity, dehumidifier technique (BS btw), permanent markings/discoloration of aftermarket "porsche" carpets onto savanah beige flooring, immobilizingzer, and all the trouble.... will have cost me what my car worth in your neighborhood man.

We are ordering a brand new carpet from Porsche, hope those comes dry? All at the formal request of my wife... she is royally pissed right now, its her boxster too also :/

THANKS TO ALL who've provided some of the best advice RE this problem. You guys rocks. 100% certain a lot of us is learning right now so please let the Tips & Trick loose fellas. Great info for everyone here
__________________
______________________________
'97 Boxster base model 2.5L, Guards Red/Tan leather, with a new but old Alpine am/fm radio.
Nine8Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2017, 11:54 PM   #39
Registered User
 
Nine8Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Montreal, QC. (currently expat to Shanghai)
Posts: 3,249
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need_for_speed View Post
Fred,
You might look into a waterproof immobilizer case from ECU doctor. I haven't installed one myself, but I think anyone who parks their 986 outdoors should probably go this route...
Nice find. Couldn't find the submerged in a fish tank test/video anywhere though. Does it work? Although I probably won't need it. The Boxster is 'urgently' going back inside... at my wife's company indoor & environmentally controlled parking lot ladies and gent (just heating during winter months). Cost me $200/year... and that's a special price. Covers the security guards and others (nothin free in life man)
__________________
______________________________
'97 Boxster base model 2.5L, Guards Red/Tan leather, with a new but old Alpine am/fm radio.
Nine8Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2017, 04:45 AM   #40
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Bastrop, Tx
Posts: 2,643
Not sure what a new carpet set goes for but I can't imagine it being cheap. If it's not too late, I recommend just taking out the wet one and letting it hang dry. It takes about a week in a nice dry climate. Don't put it in direct sun light as that will fade the carpet and turn the foam brown. I've never noticed any mildew smell either after letting it dry. It sounds like you have the time.

__________________
Woody
itsnotanova is offline   Reply With Quote
Post Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 05:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page