Porsche to rename Boxster/Cayman to 718

[particlewave]

Originally Posted by Pominoz

Don't feel guilty about your engine, C02 is good for plant life and the planet. Once the religion of global climate catastrophe doomsday dies down, bigger engines will make a come back. Luckily there's plenty of oil left as well. Hooray!

The 718 sounds like Porsches take on the MX5, back to basics. I like the idea, shame about the engine.

Put your tinfoil hat back on and return to the kiddie table. Those of us that are actually qualified to address the bigger issues will do so.

You should really avoid the conspiracy theory websites.

[JayG]

Originally Posted by Pominoz

Don't feel guilty about your engine, C02 is good for plant life and the planet. Once the religion of global climate catastrophe doomsday dies down, bigger engines will make a come back. Luckily there's plenty of oil left as well. Hooray!

The 718 sounds like Porsches take on the MX5, back to basics. I like the idea, shame about the engine.

Have you been sniffing kiwi glue?

[911monty]

Originally Posted by particlewave

Put your tinfoil hat back on and return to the kiddie table. Those of us that are actually qualified to address the bigger issues will do so.

You should really avoid the conspiracy theory websites.

It is precisely comments like these that have created the PC correct, no discussion, polarization that is all too prevalent in this nation today. What next? Call him racist?Global warming, cooling, climate change or whatever narrative fits into the current fear mongering is certainly not proven to any degree of certainty and is being driven by exactly the wrong mechanism, Politics? While we all know that we need to convert eventually from a fossil fuel economy, it needs to be done by the private sector and not the government which is purely control/ greed motivated enforced by what the non political EPA. How's that new Government healthcare working? I'm sure I'll get piled on after threads such as Bullying, Oil and filters etc!! I even read a simple thread which seems to have died last night when some PC person decided to get Offended for all his Corvette friends who never use cheap tires. Unbelievable. Particle wave I must say I am surprised by some of your latest posts, I very much appreciate the things you do on and for this forum. O would think you should be very happy since your pal Mr. Musk should do very well with the Paris circus act. But don't worry they're so smart they are going to keep global warming less than 1.5 C. Please. :ah:

[BIGJake111]

Originally Posted by particlewave

Put your tinfoil hat back on and return to the kiddie table. Those of us that are actually qualified to address the bigger issues will do so.



You should really avoid the conspiracy theory websites.

Yes the environment is going bad, but banning every car wouldn't do much. The damage is done.

Focus on the container ships that bring over everything on the shelf at wal mart before you restrict my low production garage queen sports cars.

[Pominoz]

Originally Posted by particlewave

Put your tinfoil hat back on and return to the kiddie table. Those of us that are actually qualified to address the bigger issues will do so.

You should really avoid the conspiracy theory websites.

Oooh, the zealotry is strong in this one!
I'm not going to with you who is 'more qualified' to judge the 'important issues'
I have better things to do than waste time on that

If you're so worried, maybe sell your Boxster and buy a bicycle ��

[fridsten]

Please stop!

Skickat från min HTC One via Tapatalk

[Pominoz]

Originally Posted by fridsten

Please stop!

Skickat från min HTC One via Tapatalk

But I'm seriously liking the way the 718 looks. Wow.

http://i.auto-bild.de/ir_img/1/1/8/1/0/0/6/Porsche-718-1200x800-cd6265a39fe562cd.jpg


http://image.automobilemag.com/f/75618852%2Bq100%2Bre0/porsche%2B718%2Billustration.jpg

[Eric G]

It will only be a true Boxster if they can replicate the IMS in some other insufferable hard to reach and costly location.

[tomonomics]

Originally Posted by Pominoz

But I'm seriously liking the way the 718 looks. Wow.

I wish....those are some old concept drawings. The 718 looks much closer to the 981...

2016 Porsche 718 Boxster - first ride | Autocar

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by 10/10ths

....This move has NOTHING to do with building a "lower cost" car.

It actually costs MORE money to build the 4 cylinder turbo engine.

The reason they are doing this is the same reason the 911 is going turbo and the BMW's are turbo and Honda is now selling small turbo fours---EPA and CAFE.

All the auto manufacturers MUST reduce Co2, NoX, and particulate emissions by a huge amount.

Also, all Corporate Average Fleets MUST be 54.5 MPG by 2025 in the USA.

It's the law.

It's the law but in practical application the penalties for falling short of the fleet average, which is not an issue for Porsche, are a literal pittance relative to Porsche's revenue and earnings. Perhaps for a struggling boutique car company this might be an issue, MAYBE. But for Porsche, strong dollar and import taxes in other markets are a far bigger consideration. IMHO, CAFE as the thrust behind moving to fancied up Jetta Turbo's is grossly overstated when you look at Porsche's numbers which continue to climb to historic levels. And the few sports cars that Porsche still make will eventually account for a very small part of their production, to the point that Porsche will be a luxury brand first that happen to make a few sports cars. Porsche could use the turbo 4's on their mainstays, the Cayenne, Cayene mini, and Pana and leave the already very fuel economical flat 6's to the two seaters and simply pay the minuscule penalties for falling a few ticks short of fleet average. Heck I wouldn't be surprised if they would make MORE money in the end by up-selling the flat 6 at a bigger margin over the turbo 4 to the purists and simply factor in the CAFE penalty as a cost of capturing that additional business. Purists are willing to pay the added margin, especially when you pair the NA engine with a strip down performance oriented offering. The Cayman GT4 sold out just like the GT3's.

The real rationale, imho, for the Turbo 4 is to lower their in-warranty liabilities while sustaining this relentless power increase of the last 15-20 years.
Look at how much power an M3 for instance had in 1999 (240 HP?) compared to what is expected for a performance label these days. Expectations keep going north with price tags. hard to do one without the other. Continuing to make that kind of power in an also bullet proof NA engine is a serious challenge in the mass production era of 200K Porsches a year. Going with the Jetta 4 Turbo is simply easier and more profitable in aggregate once all in-warranty costs are deducted. And really, I don't think 9 in 10 Porsche buyers care one way or the other so all the easier for Porsche to go the easy way out. And Just look at the 991 GT3 flambe engine debacle. Total recall. You can't have your German Chocolate cake and eat it too if you want to bring home the big profits.

Believe it our not our 986/987 cars will be special in the end. A thoroughly modern Porsche (no new oil leak of the day in your drive way), without electric steering nor Jetta turbos, superb handling and feedback... all at relatively low running costs (for a Porsche). None of the really bad of an old Porsche and none of the bad of all the new ones.

[JayG]

Where did using a Jetta engine come from?

Porsche is saying a newly develop[ed flat 4 turbo
The VW engines are inline 4's

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by JayG

Where did using a Jetta engine come from?

Porsche is saying a newly develop[ed flat 4 turbo
The VW engines are inline 4's

It's more a term of endearment. Much like how some Porsche enthusiasts now refer to the company as being VW instead of PAG.

[BIGJake111]

Here is my question, other then fuel economy what benefit is the carrera 3.0 turbo to the old 3.8?

Is it significantly lighter at all? Does it make packaging easier?

[Pominoz]

Originally Posted by tomonomics

I wish....those are some old concept drawings. The 718 looks much closer to the 981...

2016 Porsche 718 Boxster - first ride | Autocar

What a missed opportunity.
The concept is like a modern take on the 986. Wonderful.
If they really are going to produce something that looks
Like a pygmy 981, then I won't be queuing up.

[Porsche9]

Originally Posted by BIGJake111

Here is my question, other then fuel economy what benefit is the carrera 3.0 turbo to the old 3.8?

Is it significantly lighter at all? Does it make packaging easier?

Power potential. This is the beginning of the development cycle with lots of easy power increases on the table for Porsche to add as needed.

[10/10ths]

....yes, there are EPA credits based upon vehicle footprint and other waivers to make reaching 54.5 mpg easier without actually achieving that number for their vehicles.

The flip side, however, is that a smaller displacement engine also pollutes less NoX and Co2 and that is also the LAW globally now.

Porsche MUST downsize displacement and add forced induction.

Again, look at what EVERY manufacturer is building now, they are ALL doing this because they ALL have to do this.

Again, the GOOD part is, forced induction engines make great torque, get better mileage, and are pretty easy to hot rod to higher power levels.

We can all debate the merits of "Global Warming", but the politicians have passed the laws and the car companies must build to the regulations.

This is why you have Auto Start-Stop, Active Grill Shutters, Hybrids, etc., they all get the companies to 54.5 MPG by 2025.

The BIG issue is the EV mandate in California, New York, and fourteen other states. Those STATE laws require that 16% of all the vehicles a car company sells in those states MUST be a plug-in of some kind or they get cut off from selling vehicles in those states, whether people want to buy them or not.

That's the tough one.

That's why Porsche announced the big "Tesla fighter" EV car. That's why BMW sells the i3 and i8, that's why Ford, Chevy, Nissan, et. al. sell plug-in hybrid and full EV cars now.

Here's a great round table discussion about the industry and where EVs are heading:

Engineering the Future (Show #1930) on Autoline This Week

Cheers.

P.S.

They will have to pry my naturally aspirated, 3.2 liter, Flat 6 and 2004 Boxster S 50 Years off 550 Spyder Anniversary Edition from my cold, dead, fingers.

[Perfectlap]

^ There is also competitive pressure to look like the most technologically advanced company. When Lamborghini unveiled some outlandishly expensive offering, I believe it was the Veneno, it was widely panned for being stuck in the past meanwhile Porsche was comprehensively obliterating the N-ring lap record using a hybrid 918, McLaren was offering the P1, etc. Electric supercars are as much a high tech throw down to the competition as they are a realization that if they wait too long to jump on alternative energy they might have too much ground to make up in the mass market cars.
Whether its super car or sub $100K SUV or sedan, people are demanding or better yet expecting that you are going to wow them on fuel economy. Otherwise your car company looks dinosaur like. The educated wealthy have a bigger appreciation for high tech than other segments of the market. The car companies can't ignore that, there's good margin in those cars.

[BIGJake111]

Originally Posted by 10/10ths

The BIG issue is the EV mandate in California, New York, and fourteen other states. Those STATE laws require that 16% of all the vehicles a car company sells in those states MUST be a plug-in of some kind or they get cut off from selling vehicles in those states, whether people want to buy them or not.

What the hell happened to liberty?! That makes me want to be a lobbyist; The power should be in the dollar of the consumer, not the government.

[kk2002s]

Originally Posted by BIGJake111

What the hell happened to liberty?! That makes me want to be a lobbyist; The power should be in the dollar of the consumer, not the government.

Ok calm down Donald.
Lobbyist look out for special interest, Government is suppose to look out for the good of all citizens. I know, I know, Special interest and the Government go home to bed each night.
I'll bet if you had $5-$10 per gallon gas, The consumer $$$ would chose a 4 cyl turbo getting 40mpg over the v8 getting 18mpg

Then again, freedom and liberty might chose the V8 because it's got 500 hp and it sounds great

[flaps10]

Here's what we'll have to suffer with:

What we know today is that there will be two types of turbocharged flat four available for the new Boxster, both developed from the new turbocharged flat six engine (codenamed 9A2B6T) created for the recently facelifted 991-generation 911.

In essence, Porsche has got rid of two cylinders in order to create the new turbocharged flat four (codenamed 9A2B4T). The base 2.0-litre boxer unit has a single turbo and is expected to make around 295bhp and 258lb ft. This engine’s bore and stroke dimensions are 91mm and 76.4mm respectively and these, as well as the cylinder pitch, are the same as the 911’s.

The Boxster S will have a larger bore and stroke than the base model, increasing engine capacity to 2.4 or 2.5 litres and making around 355bhp and 295lb ft. The rumour is that a turbocharger with Porsche’s Variable Turbine Geometry (VTG), as used by the 911 Turbo, will be fitted to this engine.