Porsche engines for sale

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by porsche-land

People pay you $700 for a bearing that costs you $100 to make....

Can I offer you some unsolicited feedback? This is not a good point to make in the US or Europe. First of all $650 -$700 is not a lot of money for the critical job that is done by this part even if it has to be replaced at an interval. It will cost a lot more than $700 to fix any engine damage because there where short cuts to bring the cost down to $100 or whatever. Secondly, a Porsche owner by and large is a fairly sophisticated consumer and understands that the cost of materials and manufacture is not the only cost. Take for instance the number of educated people who use iPhones. These phones do not cost anywhere near $700 to manufacture but few are saying "F U Apple those guys are ripping us off!! I'm going to buy an Oppo Find 7 or One Plus One for half the price that uses even better hardware". The sophisticated consumer knows that they are buying from a seller in Apple (or Samsung) that has a large knowledge base and have substantial resources to deal with with warranty issues or any other problems that arise. Thirdly, the LNE bearing has a proven track record so in this world that affords a seller the ability to set a price that the market will accept. I'm probably the longest regular poster on this forum (10 years this month). Since the LNE bearing has come out and thousands of retrofits performed I still couldn't point you to one complaint on this forum on any of the other popular Porsche forums. And unlike most aftermarket sellers and devs these guys regularly provide useful information on this subject and the many other ways an m96/7 can fail. This is something important in this era of internet forums for sports cars. Most often is someone has an issue, however trivial, right away some pissed off forum member goes right onto a car forum to start getting back their pound of flesh from the aftermarket seller. Yet this is virtually unheard of for the LNE bearings even after this many retrofits.

So all this taken together, I don't think you're going to find too many people complaining about a $700 part that frees you from the chore and expense of having to remove an engine just to service this one part. I assume Jake Raby and Charles Navarro had a lot to with sparing us all that expense and providing our indys the tools to do these retrofits locally which might be the first time I can think of such a thing ever happening that even the factory making the engines didn't bother to provide at their service shops.

[porsche-land]

QUOTE:"This statement proves to me that you do not know what you are talking about. The larger bearing Porsche went to increased the ball speed, reducing street failures, but increasing track failures. Furthermore, ball bearings like RPM - it has been seen time and time again that cars driven like they were stolen (or at high speeds in Germany) have less IMS failures do to higher engine RPMs. This is just like you rebuilding engines and only sleeving the cylinders that have damage or problems, leaving others unfixed, which will eventually fail. We loose one Motormeister to only be replaced by another."

You statement regarding IMS failure due to driving style is simply false. You implied that these cars get stolen in Germany, and that the thieves drive fast on the Autobahn (and thanks to that they do not fail) is simply a picture of what you and Raby have in your heads.
Both of you push your theories which you have created to people. If you will ever open your eyes, you will realize that Porsches have been fixed in Europe long before you both existed on these forums. We have driven these cars in Europe 300km/h, and the IMS would fail for no reason sometimes. Driving style has nothing to do with it.
We will repeat again, we did not start this conversation about your IMS. Raby's the one who started "sharing" his opinion here on OUR tread. We did not start getting into your business until Raby started attacking us on the forum. We did not just start to talk about your bearing out of the blue, we know you've been selling them for years, and great for you. But when you get into our business, you will have to face the consequences. You're not the only person who can produce a bearing like that, we will prove you wrong. Even if we have to sell it for our costs, we will provide an option for people to buy it for a better price than yours.
Next time maybe you and Raby will learn NOT TO GET IN ANYBODY'S BUSINESS.
He's already facing the consequences of his previous posts on this tread.
We did change our name 2 times, in Europe people use brand names commonly, it's not being blocked as much there as here, so automotive shops use the name of the make they specialize in all the time. We have received a letter from Porsche, and changed our name. It hasn't been done because we are trying to avoid any responsibility or anything like that. So please don't imply we're not trustworthy because of our name change.
We will let you know about the IMS investigation as soon as we will find out. We deal with people in Europe, and even if we will have to dig it out of the ground, we will get it.

[Flavor 987S]

Originally Posted by porsche-land

You statement regarding IMS failure due to driving style is simply false. You implied that these cars get stolen in Germany, and that the thieves drive fast on the Autobahn (and thanks to that they do not fail) is simply a picture of what you and Raby have in your heads.
Both of you push your theories which you have created to people. If you will ever open your eyes, you will realize that Porsches have been fixed in Europe long before you both existed on these forums. We have driven these cars in Europe 300km/h, and the IMS would fail for no reason sometimes. Driving style has nothing to do with it.
We will repeat again, we did not start this conversation about your IMS. Raby's the one who started "sharing" his opinion here on OUR tread. We did not start getting into your business until Raby started attacking us on the forum. We did not just start to talk about your bearing out of the blue, we know you've been selling them for years, and great for you. But when you get into our business, you will have to face the consequences. You're not the only person who can produce a bearing like that, we will prove you wrong. Even if we have to sell it for our costs, we will provide an option for people to buy it for a better price than yours.
Next time maybe you and Raby will learn NOT TO GET IN ANYBODY'S BUSINESS.
He's already facing the consequences of his previous posts on this tread.
We did change our name 2 times, in Europe people use brand names commonly, it's not being blocked as much there as here, so automotive shops use the name of the make they specialize in all the time. We have received a letter from Porsche, and changed our name. It hasn't been done because we are trying to avoid any responsibility or anything like that. So please don't imply we're not trustworthy because of our name change.
We will let you know about the IMS investigation as soon as we will find out. We deal with people in Europe, and even if we will have to dig it out of the ground, we will get it.
Changing the subject, we have touched on this with Raby, but he checked out of this tread after he buried himself with this ignorant comments. If you're such great engineers, why don't you resleeve the cylinders with aluminum instead of steel? Factory uses aluminum blocks for a reason.

More bla, bla, bla, bla, and bla. In the spirit of Christmas, why don't you do something for the 986 Forum besides try to sell something and line your pockets? You've never contributed a single thing here. Nothing. Ever.

[porsche-land]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

Can I offer you some unsolicited feedback? This is not a good point to make in the US or Europe. First of all $650 -$700 is not a lot of money for the critical job that is done by this part even if it has to be replaced at an interval. It will cost a lot more than $700 to fix any engine damage because there where short cuts to bring the cost down to $100 or whatever. Secondly, a Porsche owner by and large is a fairly sophisticated consumer and understands that the cost of materials and manufacture is not the only cost. Take for instance the number of educated people who use iPhones. These phones do not cost anywhere near $700 to manufacture but few are saying "F U Apple those guys are ripping us off!! I'm going to buy an Oppo Find 7 or One Plus One for half the price that uses even better hardware". The sophisticated consumer knows that they are buying from a seller in Apple (or Samsung) that has a large knowledge base and have substantial resources to deal with with warranty issues or any other problems that arise. Thirdly, the LNE bearing has a proven track record so in this world that affords a seller the ability to set a price that the market will accept. I'm probably the longest regular poster on this forum (10 years this month). Since the LNE bearing has come out and thousands of retrofits performed I still couldn't point you to one complaint on this forum on any of the other popular Porsche forums. And unlike most aftermarket sellers and devs these guys regularly provide useful information on this subject and the many other ways an m96/7 can fail. This is something important in this era of internet forums for sports cars. Most often is someone has an issue, however trivial, right away some pissed off forum member goes right onto a car forum to start getting back their pound of flesh from the aftermarket seller. Yet this is virtually unheard of for the LNE bearings even after this many retrofits.

So all this taken together, I don't think you're going to find too many people complaining about a $700 part that frees you from the chore and expense of having to remove an engine just to service this one part. I assume Jake Raby and Charles Navarro had a lot to with sparing us all that expense and providing our indys the tools to do these retrofits locally which might be the first time I can think of such a thing ever happening that even the factory making the engines didn't bother to provide at their service shops.

We did not start attacking Raby or LN, if you read the tread from the start it explains itself. We do not care what, or for how much other people sell their products, as long as they stay out of our business. If they were 100% sure of their market, they would not attack other people. Nobody asked them to review our IMS in the first place.

[BYprodriver]

LN Engineering "Nickies" sleeves are aluminum.

[Flavor 987S]

Originally Posted by porsche-land

We did not start attacking Raby or LN, if you read the tread from the start it explains itself. We do not care what, or for how much other people sell their products, as long as they stay out of our business. If they were 100% sure of their market, they would not attack other people. Nobody asked them to review our IMS in the first place.

See, I thought you were just "stupid" when I saw you named your company Porsche-land. Then I changed that opinion to "an idiot" when you changed your company name again to Forsche-land. But now, after you keep taking the bait, I don't know what to do, other than just laugh. This is really entertaining.

[porsche-land]

Originally Posted by Flavor 987S

See, I thought you were just "stupid" when I saw you named your company Porsche-land. Then I changed that opinion to "an idiot" when you changed your company name again to Forsche-land. But now, after you keep taking the bait, I don't know what to do, other than just laugh. This is really entertaining.

Dude, we already told you to come and talk to us in person instead of posting online...Looks like you do not have the balls for it. You're a real ass...and other forum members already know it. If you can't stand that someone else stuffs their pockets, than just get a better job and make some $ on your own...Then, you will be less envious!
We have to disappoint you, we have sold 2 engines today. Your hates just give us more business, so thanks!

[particlewave]

Do we have moderators here anymore, or is it just a free-for-all?

[Flavor 987S]

Originally Posted by porsche-land

Dude, we already told you to come and talk to us in person instead of posting online...Looks like you do not have the balls for it. You're a real ass...and other forum members already know it. If you can't stand that someone else stuffs their pockets, than just get a better job and make some $ on your own...Then, you will be less envious!
We have to disappoint you, we have sold 2 engines today. Your hates just give us more business, so thanks!

Oh, so now you want to threaten me, and fight me? Where was all your key-board testosterone back in June when I asked you properly in a PM for a contact name? And you invited me for coffee, not to talk. What kind of coffee do you have? I'm very picky.

[cnavarro]

Originally Posted by porsche-land

QUOTE:"This statement proves to me that you do not know what you are talking about. The larger bearing Porsche went to increased the ball speed, reducing street failures, but increasing track failures. Furthermore, ball bearings like RPM - it has been seen time and time again that cars driven like they were stolen (or at high speeds in Germany) have less IMS failures do to higher engine RPMs. This is just like you rebuilding engines and only sleeving the cylinders that have damage or problems, leaving others unfixed, which will eventually fail. We loose one Motormeister to only be replaced by another."

You statement regarding IMS failure due to driving style is simply false. You implied that these cars get stolen in Germany, and that the thieves drive fast on the Autobahn (and thanks to that they do not fail) is simply a picture of what you and Raby have in your heads.
Both of you push your theories which you have created to people. If you will ever open your eyes, you will realize that Porsches have been fixed in Europe long before you both existed on these forums. We have driven these cars in Europe 300km/h, and the IMS would fail for no reason sometimes. Driving style has nothing to do with it.
We will repeat again, we did not start this conversation about your IMS. Raby's the one who started "sharing" his opinion here on OUR tread. We did not start getting into your business until Raby started attacking us on the forum. We did not just start to talk about your bearing out of the blue, we know you've been selling them for years, and great for you. But when you get into our business, you will have to face the consequences. You're not the only person who can produce a bearing like that, we will prove you wrong. Even if we have to sell it for our costs, we will provide an option for people to buy it for a better price than yours.
Next time maybe you and Raby will learn NOT TO GET IN ANYBODY'S BUSINESS.
He's already facing the consequences of his previous posts on this tread.
We did change our name 2 times, in Europe people use brand names commonly, it's not being blocked as much there as here, so automotive shops use the name of the make they specialize in all the time. We have received a letter from Porsche, and changed our name. It hasn't been done because we are trying to avoid any responsibility or anything like that. So please don't imply we're not trustworthy because of our name change.
We will let you know about the IMS investigation as soon as we will find out. We deal with people in Europe, and even if we will have to dig it out of the ground, we will get it.

Remember, you are the one that made the off hand comment about us and also invited Jake on here by making a pass at him as well. It was other forum members that were asking about your bearing kit and you brought us up. It's only fair that we respond in kind.

Our "theories" are based off of well documented facts about ball bearings and are backed up by data from our bearing manufacturer and others in the field.

Again, I'd like to see where the Germans invented the IMS fix. As far as they were all concerned, there was no problem and no reason to fix it.

We've helped out countless dozens of Porsche dealerships worldwide and helped to rebuild confidence in a whole generation of vehicles that were otherwise considered disposable and resale values reflected this. Not to mention the level of support we provide the aftermarket to ensure the integrity of the brand is upheld.

Jake and I have separate businesses. If you have a beef with Jake, that's fine by me. But attack my brand and my integrity, and I too will reply in kind. I have nothing to hide. Our installations stand over 20,000 strong and we've rebuilt over 1000 engines. I have nothing to prove here.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by porsche-land

We did not start attacking Raby or LN, if you read the tread from the start it explains itself. We do not care what, or for how much other people sell their products, as long as they stay out of our business. If they were 100% sure of their market, they would not attack other people. Nobody asked them to review our IMS in the first place.

My statement has nothing to do with this spirited debate you are engaged with LNE/Flat6. I am merely providing IMS customer feedback on your point about cost to manufacture vs. retail cost. $700 is well within my checking account tolerances.
I'm guessing others agree if the preponderance of IMS units in service since the Pelican options (and others) became available continue to come from LNE despite their higher cost to purchase.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by particlewave

Do we have moderators here anymore, or is it just a free-for-all?

moderators on a public website are more trouble then they are worth. imho.
If you don't like someone's response ignore it. Now if you are a paying member of a website then some tailoring of published responses can certainly be in order.
Besides the N SA are getting a good laugh, or at least the ones who drive fine German cars.

[BIGJake111]

Originally Posted by porsche-land

Dude/ you do not have the balls for it./ You're a real ass

Professional vernacular.

[Nine8Six]

^ dunno about your indy there Jacob but mine here... when he is not happy, people crawls under tiles to avoid the dude. That's one of the reason I go there... I get the feeling my car is in good hands and no one would dare to screw around his town.

I'd expect and hope for the same attitude from my performance engine builder lol

Kewl forum

[Jake Raby]

He's already facing the consequences of his previous posts on this tread.

No, "he" is not.. That sentence proves your intent and further it proves that for some reason, you believe that you are winning.

I will stand behind every single thing that I have said, and given the opportunity I would say it eyeball to eyeball.

As for the "bottom feeder" comment, those people know who they are and my reference was not to any customer or group of people. A bottom feeder can exist anywhere, any time. I am who imam and I say exactly what I think. If someone can't handle forward, direct communication, they'd never appreciate my way of business anyway.

So be it.

[Wayne 962]

Originally Posted by tonichristi

Car = $10k
Raby motor = $20k (or more. I don't care enough to check and I will never buy anything from or by him)
Total invested in car = $30k

Cars final value with super special Raby motor = still $10k

Basic math states that Raby rebuilds are a baaaaaaad investment.
I don't care what magical fairy spells he knows; only an idiot would invest that much money in a $10k car.

Someone needs to tell that guy that these aren't $50k cars anymore. Apparently, he didn't get the memo.

Here I go, getting sucked into these "interesting threads." Tonichristi, while I cannot argue with anything that you said, the issue is that one can't really enjoy the cars and the hobby and the experience if one looks at it as a pure investment. One has to look at it like a vacation or a new car or boat - not an investment in the S&P 500. If you're going to enjoy the car, track it, and keep it for 20+ years, then it makes perfect sense to invest the $$$ in it. It's the same as if you spent a ton of $$$ on a new kitchen in your house. The returns on that are about 40-50% loss at the time of sale. But the intrinsic "enjoyment" value of the "investment" is key.

For pure investment purposes, yes, you are 100% correct. But for life-enjoyment and investment in one's passion, that doesn't hold here. I would estimate that 95% of my customers are in this latter category.

-Wayne

[jacabean]

I read this entire thread , nothing of value . The top dog and the under dog in a childly pissing match . these motors are absurdly overpriced your better off buying a new car with 996s at 20k all day long and boxsters at 10k by the thousands . you would have to be a fool to rebuild or even buy a junkyard motor at 10k , nuts .

[Wayne 962]

Hmm, this thread seems to have run its course. I'll add my comments though, before I close this thread.

As many of you know, there are more IMS replacement solutions on the market now than I have fingers on my hands (and I have not lost any fingers yet). We resell the LN Engineering IMS kit on the website and I also recommend it in my book (101 Projects for Your Porsche Boxster). Pelican has also developed our own kit to replace the IMS bearing for the cost conscious customer as well. Between these two solutions, I feel that the Boxster customer-base is pretty well covered. We've sold hundreds of our kit, and it's basically based on simply replacing the Porsche factory bearing with a new one of nearly identical type. The LN Engineering kit is similar, except that their kit uses a custom-manufactured end-plate and a custom-manufactured ceramic bearing which in theory should last longer than the original steel ball bearing used by Porsche.

No one knows exactly and definitively why these bearings fail. There are lots of clues that have resulted in lots of theories, but the fact of the matter is that the exact failure mechanism remains unknown. The bottomline is that it is my opinion that the design of the original engine from Porsche has a weakness (some would say design defect depending upon who you speak with) that will cause these bearings to fail. The best one can do to help prevent this is to replace the bearing every 30,000 miles when you perform a clutch replacement.

I have more information available on the IMS replacement here:
Pelican Technical Article: Boxster Intermediate Shaft Bearing Replacement and Upgrade (IMS) - 986 Boxster (1997-04) - 987 Boxster (2005-06)

Also, more information on some of the weak points of these engines here:
Pelican Technical Article: Common Boxster Engine Problems and Failures - 986 / 987

With that said, I think this thread can only go down the tubes from here. If people want to continue discussion from here, then they should just probably just start a new thread.

Thanks,

Wayne