The importance of a 4 wheel allignment!

[kyle986driver]

Hey guys, im very excited. I just had a 4 wheel allignment done at porsche dealer and LOVE the car now. I have had handling and understeer problems in the past, but that has been solved!!! car is very well balanced now and almost oversteers. AWSOME! So, for any of you that have handling problems, get an allignment!!!

just so happy i had to tell everyone!
-kyle

[CJ_Boxster]

Thats great to hear, I think i need struts, then an alignment, I have a recurring chatter in my rear suspension but the car isnt boucey. feels fine.

Originally Posted by kyle986driver

Hey guys, im very excited. I just had a 4 wheel allignment done at porsche dealer and LOVE the car now. I have had handling and understeer problems in the past, but that has been solved!!! car is very well balanced now and almost oversteers. AWSOME! So, for any of you that have handling problems, get an allignment!!!

just so happy i had to tell everyone!
-kyle

[Bob O]

tire pressure. I check tire pressures regularly, like every third day or so. Last week it started pulling to the right, but I attributed it to the cuts in the highway, or the slope of the road. It kept up and I was fearing needing another alignment (just had one 6 weeks ago before taking it to DE)., Anyway, I checked tire pressures and sure enough, right front was 2 (as in TWO) pounds low. Filled it up to 32 psi and presto... no more pull. Its amazing, to me anyway, that such a small difference in tire pressure made such a difference in the way the car handled. On the other hand... 2 psi is about 6% for a 32 psi tire.

Moral... get an alignment, but check your tire pressures too...often!

Bob

[Iatros]

If you don't mind me asking... how much was the alignment?


There's a franchise place near my old house that used to do a "lifetime" alignment... you could come in once a year and get it done if it was out of alignment. I remember it costing 3x what their normal one-time alignment was.


Now *that* would be nice to have again

[blinkwatt]

Here are my recent quotes~
Niello Porsche in Rocklin $365
Franks Automotive(Independent) $180
Linville Brothers (Independent) $150 max,I was promised.

[kyle986driver]

well i believe it was around $300 at the porsche dealer near my house. They did a great job and test drove it a few times to make sure it was right.

However, the first place i tried was a small tire/automotive shop. the said they could do the allignment, no problem, he quoted me $69-$89. I was very happy to hear that. but of course they later realized there machine wouldnt do my 18 inch wheels, and thats how i ended up at the dealer.

I WISH i could do a "lifetime allignment" plan, the car is like new!


- I also played with the tire pressure alot before the allignment, and all it came down to was that my camber and toe-in was WAYY off in the rear.

[8sum8]

Like most things in life. You'd more likely get what you paid for.

Couple of years ago, I changed the wheels on my SLK. There was this tire and alingnment place next to my work. They had the setup with computers and what not. Great, I thought. I can save some money here. They did my alignment for $80. The dealer would have been $180. Got my car back an hour later - drives well but the steering was like one hour off center. Took it back - they got the steering to center but the drive was sluggish and pulled to one side. I ended up taking the car to the dealer. Paid the $180 but was satisfied. Morale of the story: cheap doesn't mean your gain; and better be assured of the shop's capability before using them.

BTW, the last time I was at the dealer, I was told, at the minimum, you should have an alignment everytime you replace your tires.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by 8sum8

Like most things in life. You'd more likely get what you paid for.

Couple of years ago, I changed the wheels on my SLK. There was this tire and alingnment place next to my work. They had the setup with computers and what not. Great, I thought. I can save some money here. They did my alignment for $80. The dealer would have been $180. Got my car back an hour later - drives well but the steering was like one hour off center. Took it back - they got the steering to center but the drive was sluggish and pulled to one side. I ended up taking the car to the dealer. Paid the $180 but was satisfied. Morale of the story: cheap doesn't mean your gain; and better be assured of the shop's capability before using them.

BTW, the last time I was at the dealer, I was told, at the minimum, you should have an alignment everytime you replace your tires.

True, so true!

[Perfectlap]

yeah you get what you over pay for.

$300+ dollars for a wheel alignment to standard specs????

PFFFTTT.....
I didn't spend that much on a custom alignment by a large margin.

that's truly outrageous. Aligning a Porsche is no more complicated tha
aligning an S2000. They are fleecing you.

Geez to think I scoffed at $180 the last time I had it done at the stealership

[MNBoxster]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

yeah you get what you over pay for.

$300+ dollars for a wheel alignment to standard specs????

PFFFTTT.....
I didn't spend that much on a custom alignment by a large margin.

that's truly outrageous. Aligning a Porsche is no more complicated tha
aligning an S2000. They are fleecing you.

Geez to think I scoffed at $180 the last time I had it done at the stealership

Hi,

I agree with you 100%. I would never go to a dealership for an alignment. First, it isn't their area of expertise. Second, they charge too much. I would recommend an alignment specialist, not a Tire Co. or anything like that.

I use a company here which does a lot of Race setups, they can fine tune an alignment to suit your taste and driving style. Mine does a complete 4-wheel for $130 and they do it right the first time, every time. My Boxster is road tuned while my Esprit is track tuned. The Esprit is more neutral because it's setup is not compensating for the crown in the road, like a road alignment will. On extremely crowned roads, I get a little pull, but the benefits on the Track outweigh this.

Remember, an alignment can benefit you much more than removing an annoying pull side-to-side. It will extend the life of your tires, aid in MPG, and give you better control and braking, especially in wet or low-traction conditions, making it a safety issue as well...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

[Brucelee]

My guess is that most dealers don't actually do the alignments anyway, they farm them out.

Having seen several of these done first hand, I would NOT take the Box to the local cheapo alignment shop. I simply think these kids have usually never seen a Box and haven't an idea where to start.

Price of course doesn't guarantee a good job but the quickie job seems to be ill advised here.

[8sum8]

Porsche dealers definately charge much more than most other auto dealerships. Even much more than BMWs and MBs. But again, I think, to a great extend, it is a question of economics. The number of porsches sold annually is a drop in the bucket compared to the other brands. But porsche dealerships are expected to maintain above average facilities both in terms of looks and services. Although, at times, the quality of service, are questionable. They are expected to have the expertise, the equipment, and the ability to service faster or at least as quickly as other dealerships. An that is what makes the math and econoimics difficult to reconcile. Because of the level of service expected, porsche dealerships have difficulty scaling back the number of employees. Although the following example is simplistic; but you will get what I am getting at.

Assuming an oil change tech can do 12 cars a day. But at a porshe dealership, you only have 4 cars a day coming in for oil change. At the same time, it can't operate with only one tech. What if the guy calls in sick? So, you have a 2nd tech. Now you have two techs doing 4 cars. A Honda dealership may, in fact be doing 24 cars a day. Even if it has 3 techs (i.e. one floater), it is still ahead and be able to charge less for its services. That is why Jiffy Lube can charge you $25 for an oil change. They do more than 12 cars a day per tech.

The above example is only about labor. There is also the issue of equipment. A porsche dealership will, like oil change, do much less alignments on a given day. But, the alignment equipment cost the same.

Its all economics. But that's the price for owing a porsche. Hey, don't get me wrong. I do wish, those charges were cheaper.

[8sum8]

Originally Posted by MNBoxster

Hi,

I agree with you 100%. I would never go to a dealership for an alignment. First, it isn't their area of expertise. Second, they charge too much. I would recommend an alignment specialist, not a Tire Co. or anything like that.

I use a company here which does a lot of Race setups, they can fine tune an alignment to suit your taste and driving style. Mine does a complete 4-wheel for $130 and they do it right the first time, every time. My Boxster is road tuned while my Esprit is track tuned. The Esprit is more neutral because it's setup is not compensating for the crown in the road, like a road alignment will. On extremely crowned roads, I get a little pull, but the benefits on the Track outweigh this.

Remember, an alignment can benefit you much more than removing an annoying pull side-to-side. It will extend the life of your tires, aid in MPG, and give you better control and braking, especially in wet or low-traction conditions, making it a safety issue as well...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

I agree. The dealers are generally "dealers of all trades" but not truly specialist in any. It's nothing like a specialist shop ... if you can find one.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Brucelee

My guess is that most dealers don't actually do the alignments anyway, they farm them out.

Having seen several of these done first hand, I would NOT take the Box to the local cheapo alignment shop. I simply think these kids have usually never seen a Box and haven't an idea where to start.

Price of course doesn't guarantee a good job but the quickie job seems to be ill advised here.

Well the last time I foolishly had porsha do my alignment (imediately after nailing a high kerb after sliding on ice) they did it there while I waited. So yeah they have the alignment machine in house. I would expect nothing less from that service garage which looks like an Air Force service hangar both in cleanliness and size. I wonder if they use the same machine to do the Mercs, Astons, Lexus and Maseratis they also service.
Crazy thing is that I rang up a local independent Porsche specialist and they quoted the same $180. I guess it takes nearly two hours or they are charging to get back their investment in that alignment machine. Surely the Stealership has paid it back a million times over. I can still can't think of any way in which a respectable alignment shop would have any difficulty in aligning a Boxster properly to factory spec. Working on the internals is certainly another matter but one you take of the wheels on Boxster it looks any other sports car.


p.s.
MN,
what is "crown of the road"

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

p.s.
MN,
what is "crown of the road"

I think Jim is referring to the high spot in the center of the road, to allow for proper drainage.

[MNBoxster]

Originally Posted by bmussatti

I think Jim is referring to the high spot in the center of the road, to allow for proper drainage.

Hi,

Exactly that. There is a fudge factor built into the OEM alignment specs to compensate.

Think about it - if your car were truly aligned for a flat road, then on a Highway or County/Rural Road, which are the most prevelant, and most heavily crowned to avoid standing water build-up, your Car would veer away from the centerline and you'd have to fight the wheel to keep the car in a straight line.

But, once that car is on a track, especially at high speed, you'll notice the opposite effect because the is no opposing force (no crown). This can be dialed out, but you will be off from OEM specs.

My Esprit and Formula Vee are Track aligned and primarily Track cars (not so much the Esprit, but I want it handling on the limit when I do track it and it's light so you don't really mind the mild pull on the Road). You can feel the difference, especially in a 30-50 lap race. The car has more grip, is more predictable and your arms don't get as tired. I would never do this to a road car because of the annoyance of the car pulling once you get on a road with a pronounced crown. Hope this helps...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99