Hope & Change With New Congress

[extanker]

maybe not rewritten but updated.....i know it was written by a bunch of guys in a tavern so i understand that. or they had a sense of humor and wanted to break chops. didnt they think there would be a problem with "we the people". i think some words need to be defined more clearly.....i meant to say "the right of the people.....my bad wrong doc

[Lordblood]

Honestly, I'm expecting more of the same. While the Democrats "controlled" the Senate and the House before, they didn't have 60 candidates so the Republicans filibustered EVERYTHING the Democrats wanted to do. Nothing really got done, health care was filled with nonsense and compromise to get a couple of Republican votes, finance reform was rubbish. The tax cut debate was just a smearing campaign. Now everything the Republicans get passed through the house and senate will just get vetoed by Obama, unless he compromises as he promised.

I'm not opposed to seeing any one ideology be tested, because I don't think even the best economists can tell you truly if Keynsian economics will work any better than Smithian economics, or vice versa. We all believe one is better than the other, but belief is not proof, it is assumption.

Personally, I think Keynes is the way to go. While we can sit back and let the Economy fix itself, I'd much rather have everyone pitch in and contribute money towards infrastructure and education to not only try and fix the economy, but invest in the future as well. Of course where and how much we spend is up to debate, but I believe that at least the notion of trying is right.

[Iflylow]

As I read all the other posts, and thought about buying American, I realized that without a lot of independent research, there is no way I can determine what companies are american. How hard would it be to set a standard regarding american parts, manufacture, employment, and post them on a high-profile website?

Many would still choose the cheaper imported goods, but the ones who care would spend the extra to buy american.

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

What Congress could do is simply start a campaign to encourage consumers to buy from companies A thru Z which have pledged increasing jobs X% in 2011.
A yearly pledge of sorts. Surely they will want something in return but at least we are informing the consumer about which companies have a long term plan that involves American workers. Andy Grove who built Intel was recently complaining about this in the tech sector recently in a Wall Street Journal Opinion piece: "every tech firm wants to send every job possible to China as part of a 'China Plan'...but where's the USA Plan?".

[jcb986]

Well, the way I see our industry is simple. Compare our industry as a mighty whale cruising along as it did many years ago supplying jobs and wealth. Now comes along unions, local, county, states and Federal governments as suckers and attach themselves and start draining the whale. Slowing it down and making it sick. There are just to many suckers attached anymore for the whale to get back to health and that is why our manufacturing industry is in trouble. To get back to health we need to revamp the whole system...patching as we have is like a dike with many plugs, all of them seeping through their or around their plugs. One day, well......

[Perfectlap]

^Our industry has seen their U.S. workers increase their productivity 2% a year every year for the last decade, while their company's share prices soared to DOW 14,000 (highest ever), revenues were up accross the Fortune 500 board and not until the markets crashed in 2008 did profits plummett. This meant that union participation fell by almost 2/3's (as did benefits and 401K matches) from the 90's, in other words these corporations had FIXED labor costs for perhaps the longest period on record. So much for the unions getting in the way. Despite these fixed, low wages for Americans they still sent jobs to Asia and India by the fistfull. How else does China go from $1 trillion to $6 trillion in a decade? It took the U.S. from the Civil War to World War I to get even half that much growth.
In the run up to these 'good times' for big business worker wages fell, job growth faded to nothing and household net worth went into the negative. Even now during the weak recovery the stock market is back to its pre-bubble normal, particularly the NASDAQ which has seen tech stocks have their best days in nearly two years, Fortune 500 profits are up again and Wall Street is planning its biggest bonus season on record after holding back for PR reasons last year.

That's a long way of saying that unions or no unions, U.S. corporations didn't skip a beat in the 20 years. It's the U.S. worker that has taken it on the chin. But Wall Street likes companies that hire Chinese workers at 1/10 the cost of $14 an hour U.S. factory worker. By the way $14 an hour doesn't even get you to the U.S. Median income.

[jcb986]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

^Our industry has seen their U.S. workers increase their productivity 2% a year every year for the last decade, while their company's share prices soared to DOW 14,000 (highest ever), revenues were up accross the Fortune 500 board and not until the markets crashed in 2008 did profits plummett. This meant that union participation fell by almost 2/3's (as did benefits and 401K matches) from the 90's, in other words these corporations had FIXED labor costs for perhaps the longest period on record. So much for the unions getting in the way. Despite these fixed, low wages for Americans they still sent jobs to Asia and India by the fistfull. How else does China go from $1 trillion to $6 trillion in a decade? It took the U.S. from the Civil War to World War I to get even half that much growth.
In the run up to these 'good times' for big business worker wages fell, job growth faded to nothing and household net worth went into the negative. Even now during the weak recovery the stock market is back to its pre-bubble normal, particularly the NASDAQ which has seen tech stocks have their best days in nearly two years, Fortune 500 profits are up again and Wall Street is planning its biggest bonus season on record after holding back for PR reasons last year.

That's a long way of saying that unions or no unions, U.S. corporations didn't skip a beat in the 20 years. It's the U.S. worker that has taken it on the chin. But Wall Street likes companies that hire Chinese workers at 1/10 the cost of $14 an hour U.S. factory worker. By the way $14 an hour doesn't even get you to the U.S. Median income.

I agree to some extent, but the high cost of doing business has underlying problem do the regulations. I remember Stanley Tools starting to outsource some and maybe all to China so it could sell it's product competitively. Now $16 bucks an hour is a minimum requirement for an worker to make if he is getting normal benefits. Now at that rate can we compete with China. ???????

[Perfectlap]

^Not for low cost goods mass production.

Perhaps if like the Germans, we only concentrated on the very high end of manufacturing we might of had a shot at holding onto 5% unemployment.
But that German model requires a very different level of investment in education. They also have a mixture of public and private options when it comes to healthcare, a big advantage that allows more money to be poured into the quality of the product. German factories pay their workers well north of $14 an hour but guess what? Their employers aren't completely footing the bill for their healthacare. Now they're one of the few surpluss nations in trade. Turns out a highly skilled, highly educated and healthy workforce can deal with $2 an hour Chinese labor pretty well since they are selling to two completely different customers. You'll never beat the Chinese selling $4 ipods (that retail for $300), $5 hammers and $10 sneakers.

p.s.
I see you guys voted out Rep. Alan Grayson in Orlando. While being perhaps the biggest jerk in the House he's also BY FAR the smartest elected official in the state of Florida. A Bronx public school kid who graduated Phi Beta Kappa with three Harvard degrees, including clerking for the D.C. court of appeals no less and became a self-made millionaire 30 times over who moved for an first ever audit of the Fed. And in his place is an incoming 30 year career politician churned out by the state political machine?

Here's a great clip of Grayson calling out Bernanke on his bull****************.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0NYBTkE1yQ&feature=youtu.be

[tonycarreon]

i am not ashamed to say that i will miss alan grayson. but then again, i'm a progressive.

[jcb986]

Originally Posted by tonycarreon

i am not ashamed to say that i will miss alan grayson. but then again, i'm a progressive.

Well, if Alan was like the Governor of New Jersey and could stand and deliver in incredible manner as he does...then he might have made it. But, we are tired of the dirt throwing politicians who are incapable of being in such a position that demands honesty and integrity. Me, I want Chris for President.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by tonycarreon

i am not ashamed to say that i will miss alan grayson. but then again, i'm a progressive.

There isn't a Libertarian Fed-hating American that won't miss that character.

p.s.
Chris Christie honest? That guy is the epitome of skewing the facts. Last week he made a speech to a GOP audience where he claimed that right before his innauguration he had been "tipped off" to a "secret wire transfer" by our hapless ex-governor to "his buddies" and had one of his aids stop it the minute he swore the oath. When I read this my head nearly exploded. First of all ANYONE with access to a newspaper knew that this money had been approved IN ADVANCE because the budget approval to NJ cities was printed in the newspaper! Also, he recently fired his education chief after Christie himself was so out of the loop on the Race To the Top funding ($400 million) that he didn't find out that the application was INCOMPLETE until his delegation had come back from D.C. !! Christie promplty tossed that education official (a well known NJ Republican) right under the bus. Schundler has since quoted the Governor as saying "the money is not worth it if it looks like I'm working with the teachers union". Although I like the idea of having a Republican Governor with a Dem state legislature, I take EVERYTHING Chris Chrisite says with a grain of salt and 10 minutes on Google.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by tonycarreon

Technically, the Constitution can not be re-written, only modified. To do so would require a vote in the affirmative by 2/3 of each house, then 3/4 of the States OR 2/3 of the State's Legislative bodies have to request a Constitutional Convention and 3/4 of the States then have to approve. Therefore, it always takes three to tango - the House, the Senate and the States.

Interestingly, especially given the constant "Obama is rewriting the Constitution" rhetoric, the President has no role in amending the Constitution.

I have NO doubt in my mind that progressives would LOVE to rewrite the Constitution without having to go to the trouble that you describe. This is why FDR tried to pack the SC so many years ago.

Intellectuals view the Constitution as an annoyance, to be dealt with as they see fit.

Some of us feel differently.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

There isn't a Libertarian Fed-hating American that won't miss that character.

p.s.
Chris Christie honest? That guy is the epitome of skewing the facts. Last week he made a speech to a GOP audience where he claimed that right before his innauguration he had been "tipped off" to a "secret wire transfer" by our hapless ex-governor to "his buddies" and had one of his aids stop it the minute he swore the oath. When I read this my head nearly exploded. First of all ANYONE with access to a newspaper knew that this money had been approved IN ADVANCE because the budget approval to NJ cities was printed in the newspaper! Also, he recently fired his education chief after Christie himself was so out of the loop on the Race To the Top funding ($400 million) that he didn't find out that the application was INCOMPLETE until his delegation had come back from D.C. !! Christie promplty tossed that education official (a well known NJ Republican) right under the bus. Schundler has since quoted the Governor as saying "the money is not worth it if it looks like I'm working with the teachers union". Although I like the idea of having a Republican Governor with a Dem state legislature, I take EVERYTHING Chris Chrisite says with a grain of salt and 10 minutes on Google.

Wrong as usual PL.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by tonycarreon

i am not ashamed to say that i will miss alan grayson. but then again, i'm a progressive.

Really, no kidding?

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by Lordblood

Honestly, I'm expecting more of the same. While the Democrats "controlled" the Senate and the House before, they didn't have 60 candidates so the Republicans filibustered EVERYTHING the Democrats wanted to do. Nothing really got done, health care was filled with nonsense and compromise to get a couple of Republican votes, finance reform was rubbish. The tax cut debate was just a smearing campaign. Now everything the Republicans get passed through the house and senate will just get vetoed by Obama, unless he compromises as he promised.

I'm not opposed to seeing any one ideology be tested, because I don't think even the best economists can tell you truly if Keynsian economics will work any better than Smithian economics, or vice versa. We all believe one is better than the other, but belief is not proof, it is assumption.

Personally, I think Keynes is the way to go. While we can sit back and let the Economy fix itself, I'd much rather have everyone pitch in and contribute money towards infrastructure and education to not only try and fix the economy, but invest in the future as well. Of course where and how much we spend is up to debate, but I believe that at least the notion of trying is right.

"managing the economy is a myth. It is, what it is.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

^Not for low cost goods mass production.

Perhaps if like the Germans, we only concentrated on the very high end of manufacturing we might of had a shot at holding onto 5% unemployment.
But that German model requires a very different level of investment in education. They also have a mixture of public and private options when it comes to healthcare, a big advantage that allows more money to be poured into the quality of the product. German factories pay their workers well north of $14 an hour but guess what? Their employers aren't completely footing the bill for their healthacare. Now they're one of the few surpluss nations in trade. Turns out a highly skilled, highly educated and healthy workforce can deal with $2 an hour Chinese labor pretty well since they are selling to two completely different customers. You'll never beat the Chinese selling $4 ipods (that retail for $300), $5 hammers and $10 sneakers.

p.s.
I see you guys voted out Rep. Alan Grayson in Orlando. While being perhaps the biggest jerk in the House he's also BY FAR the smartest elected official in the state of Florida. A Bronx public school kid who graduated Phi Beta Kappa with three Harvard degrees, including clerking for the D.C. court of appeals no less and became a self-made millionaire 30 times over who moved for an first ever audit of the Fed. And in his place is an incoming 30 year career politician churned out by the state political machine?

Here's a great clip of Grayson calling out Bernanke on his bull****************.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0NYBTkE1yQ&feature=youtu.be

Indeed, having three Harvard degrees means that you are smart!


When GWB was in the WH, apparently that MBA from Harvard meant nothing.

[Brucelee]

BTWW- I used to guest lecture at the Harvard School of Pubic Health. Believe me, that is NO guarantee that one is "smart."

[Brucelee]

That's a long way of saying that unions or no unions, U.S. corporations didn't skip a beat in the 20 years. It's the U.S. worker that has taken it on the chin. But Wall Street likes companies that hire Chinese workers at 1/10 the cost of $14 an hour U.S. factory worker. By the way $14 an hour doesn't even get you to the U.S. Median income.

No offence but YOU are Wall Street. Where do you think all that capital comes from?
Are YOU driving an American car? Can YOU find an American washing machine?

Folks love low prices and high value.

How puzzling is that?

[Lordblood]

Originally Posted by Brucelee

"managing the economy is a myth. It is, what it is.

You say it as if that is it. Sorry Brucelee, but Keynes didn't base his economics on BS or a conservative agenda. There is real research behind it, and to dismiss it is honestly an insult to economics as a field.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by Lordblood

You say it as if that is it. Sorry Brucelee, but Keynes didn't base his economics on BS or a conservative agenda. There is real research behind it, and to dismiss it is honestly an insult to economics as a field.

Given that I teach Economics and Finance, that would be a mistake on my part, no?

Actually, Keynes initial work has some merit as far as it went. Subsequent observations and of course, the misuse of his THEORIES, have called most of his assumptions and conclusions into dispute among reputable economists.

I think the US' recent experience with Stimulus and such will put the final nail in the coffin except for of course, the true believers.

The question isn't really whether the government can contribute to aggregate demand in the short run (it can given the method). Rather, the issue is whether this is the best way (among alternatives) for the government to act.

That I think, is very much in question.

My last comment is to the "economics as a field." In truth, economics is not a science as traditionally defined. It is much more a bunch of theories about aggregate human behavior with money as a signal.

One can prove almost nothing in economics. That is why it is so much fun to teach.

[Lordblood]

Originally Posted by Brucelee

Given that I teach Economics and Finance, that would be a mistake on my part, no?

Actually, Keynes initial work has some merit as far as it went. Subsequent observations and of course, the misuse of his THEORIES, have called most of his assumptions and conclusions into dispute among reputable economists.

I think the US' recent experience with Stimulus and such will put the final nail in the coffin except for of course, the true believers.

The question isn't really whether the government can contribute to aggregate demand in the short run (it can given the method). Rather, the issue is whether this is the best way (among alternatives) for the government to act.

That I think, is very much in question.

My last comment is to the "economics as a field." In truth, economics is not a science as traditionally defined. It is much more a bunch of theories about aggregate human behavior with money as a signal.

One can prove almost nothing in economics. That is why it is so much fun to teach.

We're on the same page now. I wholeheartedly agree that the spending over the recession has been wasteful. I suppose what we have to figure out is, which would be the better spend of money: tax cuts or government spending. I think at the moment it would have to be government spending, as tax cuts are not going to directly encourage anyone to spend.

I would like to know where you think Keynes' original theories stop and bad assumptions begin, and perhaps this is more of an opinion than a fact but either way I'm curious.