Go Back   986 Forum - for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners > Porsche Boxster & Cayman Forums > DIY Project Guides

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-21-2016, 03:27 PM   #1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Northern illinois
Posts: 39
anybody try the pelican ims retrofit kit?

I know you typically get what you pay for so what do you all think of this? I am not due for a clutch but its so much less expensive and might be worth the peace of mind what do you all think??? $165 compared to $849
jimmythemufflers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2016, 03:38 PM   #2
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Sunny Florida
Posts: 73
Garage
I'm confused, your post doesn't contain a link to this very inexpensive part. Can you please post the link, I don't see anything that price at pelican.
__________________
2001 Boxster S
6 speed MT
chaiyz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2016, 06:06 PM   #3
Beginner
 
Jamesp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Houston
Posts: 1,659
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmythemufflers View Post
I know you typically get what you pay for so what do you all think of this? I am not due for a clutch but its so much less expensive and might be worth the peace of mind what do you all think??? $165 compared to $849
It's a single row bearing with a non contact seal. I bought it for the mounting hardware and replaced the bearing with a fully sealed high temp 6204 viton Nachi. I wouldn't use it in a dual row engine.
__________________
2003 S manual
Jamesp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 02:39 PM   #4
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Northern illinois
Posts: 39
sorry bout that, here it is

Pelican Parts.com - Pelican Parts IMS Bearing Retrofit Kit
jimmythemufflers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 03:55 PM   #5
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 150
The bearing is described as similar quality to the original single row bearing. A spacer is supplied if you are replacing a double row one. As said above I wouldn,t use it to replace a double row one but would consider it an acceptable replacement for a single row (but NOT an improvement like a ceramic one might be.) Whatever you do DO NOT USE PELICAN flawed installation instructions. Use the ones from LN.
johnsjmc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2016, 02:14 AM   #6
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: It's a kind of magic.....
Posts: 5,029
Personally, I fail to see the logic in skimping on a part that can kill your engine in a heart beat. The Pelican bearing is basically the same as an OEM single row unit; so the moment your car hits the ground after installing it, you have exactly the same probability of failure that you had before you took it apart. Just because it is new, the odds have not really changed as many single row IMS failures occur when the car has low miles on it. If you are paying someone to install it, most of your expense is going to be labor, not parts, regardless of who's bearing you install, so why go cheap on the parts?
__________________
Anything really new is invented only in one’s youth. Later, one becomes more experienced, more famous – and more stupid.” - Albert Einstein
JFP in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2016, 06:47 AM   #7
B6T
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Waterloo, Ontario
Posts: 183
^ The literature published about the original IMS states that the seals are compromised due to the type of service environment the bearing operates within, the grease washes out, and the lack of sufficient lubrication kills the bearing in a short period of time.

Therefore, the age of the bearing is a factor more than the mileage because as the bearing ages, the seals dry up. The occurrence of failure in low mileage cars supports this theory (more inactivity, less oil circulating around the bearing, etc.). From what I have read, I don't think anyone has seen either a single row or dual row bearing fail based on pure mechanical loading conditions, so it always has to be lubrication related. The fact that Porsche switched from a dual to single row bearing also supports that - and they have the type of design and testing data on the M96 that most engineers would salivate over.

So your statement that the "the moment your car hits the ground after installing it, you have exactly the same probability of failure that you had before you took it apart" is false because you will have refreshed the seals and eliminated any degradation with time that has occurred with the original bearing.
B6T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2016, 08:22 AM   #8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: It's a kind of magic.....
Posts: 5,029
Quote:
Originally Posted by B6T View Post
^ The literature published about the original IMS states that the seals are compromised due to the type of service environment the bearing operates within, the grease washes out, and the lack of sufficient lubrication kills the bearing in a short period of time.

Therefore, the age of the bearing is a factor more than the mileage because as the bearing ages, the seals dry up. The occurrence of failure in low mileage cars supports this theory (more inactivity, less oil circulating around the bearing, etc.). From what I have read, I don't think anyone has seen either a single row or dual row bearing fail based on pure mechanical loading conditions, so it always has to be lubrication related. The fact that Porsche switched from a dual to single row bearing also supports that - and they have the type of design and testing data on the M96 that most engineers would salivate over.

So your statement that the "the moment your car hits the ground after installing it, you have exactly the same probability of failure that you had before you took it apart" is false because you will have refreshed the seals and eliminated any degradation with time that has occurred with the original bearing.
And I have four customers that had OEM IMS failures in less than 6K miles on new vehicles. While their engines were replaced under warranty, it also says that being brand new does not exempt the OEM style bearing from failure, so it is more than just the seals failing over time. One of the guys that suffered an early fail had the one in the replacement engine go less than a year after it was installed (as soon as he got his second replacement engine, he drove the car to another dealer and traded it in).

As for pure mechanical failures, we (and others) have seen a couple where the center bolt of the IMS was found lying in the bottom of the bell housing. And while the bearing was tore up from the bolt failure, the balls did not show the normal severe galling associated with long term lubrication problems. So there are different ways these things can crap out, and they can a do die young, which I think is one of the factors contributing to the general belief that low mileage cars are more susceptible than those that accumulated a lot of miles quickly.

Porsche's own data in the class action noted that the expected rate of failure for the single row bearing was around eight or so percent, with no caveat for the age of or mileage on the bearings.
__________________
Anything really new is invented only in one’s youth. Later, one becomes more experienced, more famous – and more stupid.” - Albert Einstein

Last edited by JFP in PA; 03-23-2016 at 08:35 AM.
JFP in PA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2016, 09:31 AM   #9
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: DE
Posts: 122
I agree with B6T, the probability of failure from seal degradation is much improved with a new bearing. There are other ways the IMS system can fail, but that doesn't mean a new bearing will have exactly the same probability of failure as an old one.
spendy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2016, 03:55 AM   #10
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Northern illinois
Posts: 39
Oh crap, I started an ims debate didn't I? Well, I am cheap! If I can save money doing something I will which is why I asked. I would take the car in to get it done and if the LN retro fit is superior than it is worth the extra money. I have 1 year or 10,000 miles left on a warranty so I'm not as worried. Yet! Thanks for the input
__________________
One day my wife will learn I do not work hard and I will have to start waking up with the kids and dog.
jimmythemufflers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2016, 05:57 AM   #11
Registered User
 
thom4782's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Foster City CA
Posts: 1,074
This is pretty simple.

OEM and OEM-like IMS's fail - total cost is $165 + labor + cost of replacement engine + installation labor. LN IMS's don't fail - total cost is $849 + labor. So if you want to roll the dice, the dollar delta is the cost of a replacement engine + installation labor - $684 difference in the price of the parts.

To sum up: the bet is: $684 v $,$$$s to replace a failed engine.
thom4782 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:57 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page