6% off MSRP?

[Brucelee]

"I was referring to the the private owner selling price. Most consumers (I personally know) think of this price when they discuss the value of their used car they intend to sell. Most people I know who are not extremely wealthy and busy wouldn't ever trade in a car so they never refer to the retail trade-in value when they are figuring out the bluebook value."

This is a start as you now specify what BB value you are referring to.

"And I'm not saying his 1995 968 is worth $19K, Kelley BB says it is.
(since he's from LI I put in NY when I ran the calculator)"

KBB does not say that his car is worth 19K, only that the average price for a car of his type HAS BEEN 19K over time and distance. What he gets for it is what he gets for it, so it is a guide and KBB says that very clearly.

"Sure he might not find a buyer right away but the generally accepted guideline is the one put forward by the KBB. I'm not an economist so I can't say what the true woprth of a particular car is (whatever that means) but since most people don't know the auto business as well as dealers and at the same their is great distrust of auto sales industry, they turn to a third party to tell them what is "fair value" for a car."

I have no issue with KBB, use them all the time. However, they produce value guides and are careful to disclaim that in their literature.

"A set of Carrera 5 spoke wheels can be purchased any day on Ebay for $3,000 with tires. Yet no one ever bids. Yet the seller has determined that $3,000 is the fair market value. Porsche believes it to be higher. Does this mean the wheels are not worth $3,000 because they are relisted week after week without a buyer? I've always thought of worth to be the amount of money I can recoup if I decide to sell without using/wearing down the product."

If you can't sell the wheels at $3000 then by definition they are not worth $3000.

"At some point a consumer with the money to spend on a nice set of new Carrera 5 spokes will make the purchase and no one will say that since he bought wheels that were sitting around for months, that he was ripped off for paying $3,000."

It does not matter what other people say, if he paid $3K, they were worth it to him, no?



"I guess their are two perspectives on "worth" what the consumers believe and
what the auto industry believes. Unless you are buying a Saturn(if they still do that)."

Worth is determined by where the buyer and seller agree to a deal.

"By the way the car's I've sold for many friends, lend them to believe I do know what I'm talking about when I say how much their cars will bring in. Because so far with online auctions/ads its ALWAYS been higher than what either the KBB told them it was worth (to them as private sellers) or what the local used car lot guy offered them."

You are waffling here. The way you word your statement by definition makes your right. Can you sell it for PPT all the time or do you just beat the trade value?

I have done much data crunching of EBAY sold data on the Porsche Boxster and 911. It rare but possible to get PPT KBB on EBAY but most folks do not. In fact, most Porsches don't sell at all on EBAY. Of the 20% that do, most sell for around trade value and a few rare ones get to PPT.

That is also true for Corvettes, and most BMW models.

If you don't believe me spend an afternoon sorting the data. You will be surprised I believe.

"The ebay pricing for used car's often differs with the audience that car has.
Allot of conservative people don't feel comfortable buying a Boxster in an Ebay auction thus the bids come from a certain type of buyer, one that has greater trust in the internet than a more traditional buyer. An older 911 may have a different type of audience as well, one that regularly buys used parts from the internet and has much more experience with online purchasing. Those buyers will propbably be more likely to bid on an older 911. Than the buyer of a Boxster.
The point is that even within the same Brand the buyer of one model might be more willing to buy than the buyer of another model.
Its all becoming more complex with every passing day."

Candidily, unless an EBAY car is local and can be inspected by me personally, I would never buy a car over EBAY. The horror stories abound and buying this way is Russian Roulette. My neighbor bought a Jag on EBAY that he has inspected by a service far away. That car had been hit in every panel, as I showed him when he brought it over. The guy did not use a paint meter and got fooled by a nice repair job. Of course, the car won;t drive staight but hey, he got a great deal!



"BUT DON"T TRADE IN YOUR CAR "

Again, trade ins are fine for those who do not want to sell there car on their own and who understand that this will cost them some dough. I tell every prospect that every time I evaluate a trade. And I have not issue with direct sale. I make my money on selling my car, not taking advantage of a buyer. I can buy cars at auction all day long.

Different strokes for diff folks.

[longislander1]

I haven't talked to the Porsche dealer about trading the 968 yet, but GM has an appraisal section that gives you an approximate trade-in value of $8-$12K, so that's the most I could probably expect on a trade for a Corvette. $8K for that car is criminal, but $19K is probably too high. Private sale should be around $15-$17K, I hope, although I hate entertaining the tire-kickers. If anyone here would like a pretty nice 968 in that range, send me a PM. It's Guards Red with tan partial leather and black top, 56K miles. I'm the original owner. It outperforms the early Boxsters and still turns heads.

[Perfectlap]

well admittedly I haven't sold any German cars on ebay. Its been only Japanese car with solid reputations for reliability. Mazda, Toyota, Honda. All were sold above the highest possible price quoted by Kelly Blue Book. Some two and three times the highest quoted KBB price. One was as old as ten years with more than 100k on the speedo. I agree the buyer was nuts to agree sight unseen. But this car was immaculate and was repainted by a high end Body shop with paint that was better than factory. It sparkled in the sun like the day it left the Honda plant.
The buyer took a risk in buyin online But I think people put allot of stock in these feedback ratings if they are perfect and well north of 100. Feeback heavily influences the final price of a car sold on Ebay Motors.

Longislander take your car to a Porshe Club Concours event. Slap a for sale sign on it and let's see how you do. If you can wait until the warm weather returns.
I always try to sell my cars to other enthusiasts. They know well maintained sports cars don't just grow on trees. I saw eBay bids on a 1992 with 80K at over $10,000.

[Brucelee]

Well again I don't know that he highest possible price from KBB means. If you mean retail, then I assert this would only apply to older specialty models that are bringing larger dollars.

If you are telling me that routine late model Hondas are bringing high book, I guess I would have to say you are dead wrong.

Moreover, I will reiterate, anyone who buys a car on EBAY without seeing it first is insane or just foolish with their money. I recently bought a part from a guy on EBAY with GREAT feedback. The part was junk, he left EBAY the week after and I was out 60 bucks. Now, if that was a $18K Porsche .......................

And EBAY will NOT help you if you are taken by a seller.
That is simply a lie.

Caveat Emptor!

[graybeard]

Brucelee, have you had good experiences with Ebay in the past? Is this a case of a few bad apples? I want the buyer of my car to have a good feeling about their new Boxster. It is my intent to point out the shortcomes as well as the strong points of this car. I am 100% on the up and up and might be upset if it was not for the fact that we have all heard these horrors before, the "infomation age" has sure created a whole new pond of scum.

[Brucelee]

My experience as a buyer and seller on EBAY for Autos is limited. I bought one car through EBAY but it was a local car and i was able to check it out personally before I bid.

I have sold two cars through EBAY but not at auction. Two local buyers saw my cars on EBAY and bought them directly from me after the auction closed. In both cases, they were able to check the car out directly and in one case, the person has the car inspected by the local Porsche dealer before buying. This was a $44K 911 and I think this buyer was very very prudent in his purchase.

The fact is that most EBAY sellers are honest I would bet. However, the cost of most cars would dictate a very prudent approach and buying a car sight unseen seems fool hard at best. NO amount of pictures or descriptions can do the can justice.

Since I inspect cars for a living, I hope you believe me when I say that this is NOT an easy process and many cars can make fools of even pros like me.

Imagine how tough it would be to do this over the INET>

Obviously, buying a new car over the Net is a totally different issue and I think that is a very wise way to go.

In summary, I would consider EBAY to be a national ad but I would not expect to actually sell a car through the auction process. Percentage wise, this just does not happen that often.

Originally Posted by graybeard

Brucelee, have you had good experiences with Ebay in the past? Is this a case of a few bad apples? I want the buyer of my car to have a good feeling about their new Boxster. It is my intent to point out the shortcomes as well as the strong points of this car. I am 100% on the up and up and might be upset if it was not for the fact that we have all heard these horrors before, the "infomation age" has sure created a whole new pond of scum.

[graybeard]

Brucelee

I do hear what you are saying. I plan on listing it in the local papers where the buyer can see and feel it. I would love to see the smile on their face as they as they leave in a great car at a good price. The trade in on the car plus the tax break is not realy that bad, as a last resort just would prefer seeing someone getting a good deal without passing it through additional hands, no offense. I've sold my last two vehicles via private party and both times I've put a little extra in my pocket and felt very comfortble knowing they did well also. You sell car and I'm certain you understand.

I do enjoy this site immensely!

[longislander1]

That's a great idea. We have one coming up here in June if I don't sell it before then. Thanks!

QUOTE=Perfectlap]Longislander take your car to a Porshe Club Concours event. Slap a for sale sign on it and let's see how you do. If you can wait until the warm weather returns.I always try to sell my cars to other enthusiasts. They know well maintained sports cars don't just grow on trees. I saw eBay bids on a 1992 with 80K at over $10,000.[/QUOTE]

[graybeard]

I'm folllowing this thead with interest because my '99 will be up for sale soon. I'm going to give Ebay a shot, with a reserve. There is a transferrable warranty in place with 2 1/2 years and 35k miles left on it. I have met all the conditions of the policy. Not being familiar with Ebay, how much influence will this have on the sale?