3 more IMS reports

[landrovered]

Have to agree, the Rover Bosch 4.0 and 4.6 V8s from 2000 to 2004 have a much higher mortality rate than any Porsche engine.

[Jake Raby]

That does NOT mean that a shop is better than one that is not on the list just because they give money to LN Engineering.

I won't recommend anyone.. Because we end up ultimately responsible for the "other shop" should someone get hosed by them.. Thats the reason why it is a paid list at LN. For me there is no amount of money that someone can pay me to gain my recommendation.

[bartocollector]

Just had my 04 S inspected by Matrix integrated in Portland. They have diagnosed a faulty water pump bearing and say the IMS is OK. They have done several IMS bearing updates with the LS kit. They said "in good conscience " they could not recommend doing the IMS . They have 30 years experience and have seen only one bad bearing and no engine failures.

[landrovered]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

I won't recommend anyone.. Because we end up ultimately responsible for the "other shop" should someone get hosed by them.. Thats the reason why it is a paid list at LN. For me there is no amount of money that someone can pay me to gain my recommendation.

This is clear as mud.

[Ghostrider 310]

The insinuation seems to be that the L&N list of master wrenches has never effected a repair that reflected negatively on the list or people who admire said list. If that's the case, it's only a matter of time before a repair does not meet the requirements of the fickle and unpredictable public consumer and someone gets angry at a list member. What the list does not mean is that someone not on it is incapable of effecting the repair.

[fivepointnine]

mine had no indications of failing when I took it up to redmond european outside Seattle....but it was extremely worn and on its way out. They also showed me a bag of failed bearings!

mine is an 02 with 66k miles.

[landrovered]

It just means LN is leveraging their reputation for additional profit.

[harryrcb]

Originally Posted by landrovered

This is clear as mud.

Originally Posted by Ghostrider 310

The insinuation seems to be that the L&N list of master wrenches has never effected a repair that reflected negatively on the list or people who admire said list. If that's the case, it's only a matter of time before a repair does not meet the requirements of the fickle and unpredictable public consumer and someone gets angry at a list member. What the list does not mean is that someone not on it is incapable of effecting the repair.

Originally Posted by landrovered

It just means LN is leveraging their reputation for additional profit.

WOAH guys, let's not get off subject, I only mentioned the list because another member pointed it out and I have heard some of my customers ask if I was on it. As you can guess I'm not on the list and that is all I will say on the forum about this.

The fact remains that LN Engineering have done their homework on this and as far as I'm concerned it's the only viable option to address this problem.

[landrovered]

I stand behind my statement. Why would you charge to be on a list of prefered installers if it was not to make additional revenue.

[Jake Raby]

Originally Posted by landrovered

I stand behind my statement. Why would you charge to be on a list of prefered installers if it was not to make additional revenue.

To partially pay for the wasted time and bull**************** associated with said recommendations. When you to work isn't your company employing you to do a job that will generate revenue for the company? What's so freakin horrible about making a profit these days?

[Ghostrider 310]

Nothing wrong with making a profit, the issue is paying to be recommended. It carries the same stench as finding out the Hollywood walk of fame is a track of purchased awards or when whose who in HS students puts you in Christmas lights for a fee. Ethics is everything, when we leave this life our wealth pile isn't what people remember us for, it's the moments and deeds. The honest wrenches in my town have full schedules they don't need no stinking badges.

[mikefocke]

So you expect that Charles will maintain a list of several hundred shops with all the data entry/update/verification that that entails for free? Maybe he does a credit check or a Better Business check? Maybe being on the list implies that the installer can call him for help if he gets stuck in doing your job?

(I come at this as the President of a home owner's association of 305 lots where the maintenance of the data base of names, addresses, phone numbers, email addresses, etc is a several days a month job.)

Recall that Jake had to stop selling IMSR kits because the overhead of supporting those trying to do the installs was forcing him to have a full time employee just answering the phone. When your reputation is on the line and someone out there is doing the work and you are a long way away it is a tough situation. Will the car owner blame the XYZ shop or that darn LN kit installed by the guy that was on your list?

[Ghostrider 310]

So you expect Charles will maintain a list of several hundred shops with all the data entry/update/verification that that entails for free?


It's not like he has to do it on an abacus, so um, yes, yes I do. I had to maintain volumes of dealer information and MSDS sheets, never charged a customer one dime for any of it. If you can market yourself in national magazines you have to give some simple customer service along with the quest if you intend to see dramatic sales results and loyal customers.

PS Since you brought it up how much is the fee? Share that with me and I'll be able to tell you if it's a "Missouri boat ride".

[landrovered]

There is nothing against making a profit on boxster forums. People expect companies to make a profit conducting the business that they are in. In the case of LN it is selling Porsche parts.

What they object to is, people making money off of information EITHER by selling data about their customers to third parties or charging third parties to have access to their customers.

Charging a business to be on a recommended list is in essence charging a business to have access to LNs customer base. It is outside of the perceived core business and that can be objectionable.

[Jake Raby]

In other words, it gives whiners something to whine about.

[landrovered]

Sure, people that expect others to act in an ethical manner are whiners.

[Ghostrider 310]

Originally Posted by landrovered

Sure, people that expect others to act in an ethical manner are whiners.

Honor is like virginity, you lose it once

[Jake Raby]

Originally Posted by landrovered

Sure, people that expect others to act in an ethical manner are whiners.

Only if they ********************, moan or WHINE about it.

I also expect ethical engagements from purchasers; its a two way street here.

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by landrovered

Sure, people that expect others to act in an ethical manner are whiners.

There is absolutely nothing “unethical” in what LN is doing; parts and supplies vendors often require shops participate in marketing referral programs. It might require carrying a minimum amount of inventory, or an upfront payment to be included in these marketing programs. Happens everyday…………

[landrovered]

So is it ethical to create hysteria in order to sell your services?