Internal engine damage to my boxter 2001

[s86]

My car has been running perfectly until yesterday!

I saw a huge cloud of smoke behind me, pulled over and the engine started to run roughly. Had it taken to my mechanics shop and they told me the motor has internal damage, it can't be identified without pulling the engine out to determine the problem.

Options given:
Buy rebuilt engine from Porsche dealer - $18,000
Find good used engine for approx $6,000
Pull engine and determine problem $1,600 - X? for fixing , if fixable
Sell car for parts, buy new vehicle

My car is a 2001 Boxter, 110,000km, excellent condition, serviced regularly, I've owned it for 4,000 km (almost brand new)

What to do??? I think there are many very knowledgeable people on this forum, some thoughts suggests would be welcome

[ekam]

How do they know there's internal damage? What's their diagnosis? Does the engine still run when you start it? It could be a failed AOS for all you know?

[JFP in PA]

Unless they pulled the oil and filter, and/or removed the sump cover and confirmed internal damage, I'd start by find another shop; one that has some idea what they are doing............

[s86]

The car still starts and runs (well enough to get onto the flat bed by it's own power) but it is rough and there is a huge amount of white smoke (I assume it means water) - the mechanic believes it is D-chunk, which he attributes to flaws in the 2.5 and 2.7 engine casings, but I don't think he has done any exploratory beyond starting it up and plugging it in, so far.

[thstone]

Thoughts on engine options...

Option 1: Used Donor (eBay or equivalent) Engine This is the cheapest route - simply replace the engine you have with another used engine and do a 60K service to get the car back on the road. Future reliability is unknown and you may be right back where you are now (needing an engine replacement) in anywhere from 10K-100K miles. Obviously 10K miles would be a bummer and 100K miles would be awesome - but no one can say for sure which it will be. $3K-$6K.

Option 2: Refreshed Engine Some shops call them "refreshed" or even "certified pre-owned" and some sellers will even call them "rebuilt" even though they are not really rebuilt. But this option will generally consist of a used engine that has good compression as-is with maybe new timing chain/guides, a new water pump and/or alternator, new thermostat, and a 60K service. Be sure to check which exact parts are new/replaced because it varies. Again, you may be right back where you are now in anywhere from 10K-100K miles. $4K-$10K with higher priced engines having fewer original miles and/or add'l components replaced and/or coming from better known shops.

Option 3. Rebuilt/Remanufactured Engine A remanufactured engine where the engine is rebuilt to meet the original spec's, mostly using OEM parts. This is a classic rebuilt engine. Some engines may have updates like IMS/RMS but you'll need to specifically check . This option should give you ~100K miles of service but the reliability is (again) completely dependent on the engine builder and the extent and quality of the updates installed to address reliability issues. Likely to have a warranty of some kind so be sure to check the warranty details. $8K-$12K. Higher priced engines have more high quality parts/updates and/or come from better known shops.

Option 4. High End Fully Rebuilt The engine is rebuilt from the ground up with lots of new parts and all upgrades. Buyer may be able to specify some build details as desired. Engine is probably better than anything coming straight out of the factory brand new. Shops that do this work are top-end and their business relies on a good repuatation. Should expect ~100K+ miles but check the warranty details. $12K-$22K. This will give you the most peace of mind (and maybe the highest performance) but it comes at a cost. Be aware that you may not get 100% of the engine cost back in resale value but that really depends on the buyer.

In summary, only you can decide which path is right for you and depends on how long you expect to keep the car, how much you love the car, how much money you are willing to spend, etc, etc.

[JFP in PA]

There are a couple of well known issues that cause non terminal smoking; the most common is a failed AoS. This can be checked by simply starting the car and trying to remove the oil filler cap with it running: if it is very difficult to remove, the AoS has crapped out and can be replaced for a couple hundred bucks. It could also be a failed head gasket, also non terminal.

You need to get some facts before your wallet gets emptied or more damge is done………

[Burg Boxster]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

You need to get some facts before your wallet gets emptied or more damge is done………

Good suggestion but he might just as well be a "promoter" . . .

With the known potentially catastrophic failures of these motors, no mechanic or flatbed operator in their right mind would risk causing further damage (and possibly be held responsible for such) by running the thing, let alone under heavy load to get it onto a flatbed. That's why they have winches and tow hooks . . .

He could easily check for a bad AOS by just pulling the J-tube at this point and not starting the engine (possibly causing catastrophic hydroloc) to test filler cap.

So, either he's a "promoter" (and yes everyone knows what I mean by that) or someone whose really in for a wallet draining w/ this mechanic.

Good luck and if these problems are real, definitely start by getting a new mechanic... one who knows what the heck they are doing

[thstone]

Ok, maybe I am the only person who didn't know what a "promoter" was, so I looked it up and this seems to be the general job description:

As a forum promoter for our company you would post threads about our products and special offers in online forums of your choice. Salary will be paid based on the amount of reviews and replies a given thread receives. Our top promoters usually earn $200 - $300 a month.

We require our promoters to post at least 8 threads per month. In order to avoid being banned from forums for self-promotion it will also be necessary to post products from other websites and maybe engage a little in the community.

[harryrcb]

Originally Posted by thstone

Ok, maybe I am the only person who didn't know what a "promoter" was, so I looked it up and this seems to be the general job description:

As a forum promoter for our company you would post threads about our products and special offers in online forums of your choice. Salary will be paid based on the amount of reviews and replies a given thread receives. Our top promoters usually earn $200 - $300 a month.

We require our promoters to post at least 8 threads per month. In order to avoid being banned from forums for self-promotion it will also be necessary to post products from other websites and maybe engage a little in the community.

you are not alone, learn something everyday, never heard about this till now. DANG

[s86]

Thank you everyone - all input is appreciated, I am talking to some other shops and exploring my options...one thing I was told is that the 2.5 and 2.7 engines have been problematic - has anyone had any experience with installing the 3.2 engine as a replacement? I understand that it requires updating the computer as well...

[JFP in PA]

Before planning on replacing this engine, make sure it really needs replacing first………

[ekam]

Who's a forum promoter? I need that job.

[The Radium King]

i think you have to read between the lines on the promotor statement - it's a veiled shot at Jake.

re the op, i think you've been had by your shop. throw a cookie-sized piece of the cylinder wall into the cylinder and your car will do more than run rough and blow smoke. and from what i know, d-chuck was only a problem in the earlier engines.

do your research; jfp has given you some very sound advise. if you want to swap your engine regardless, that's a different thread.

[BerneseMtnDog]

It's premature to start thinking about replacement engines when you really don't know what's going on with yours. These are failed AOS symptoms and this should be the first place you look. +1 about getting another mechanic's opinion. For someone to throw around terms like "D chunk" without first digging into it and confirming where the issues are is bad IMO.

Steve
2000 2.7L

[s86]

Agreed. I've moved the car to another Porsche shop which thought it sounded like an AOS issue, I won't know until next week, but it will be a huge relief if that is the problem.

Thank you again for the good input

[Brucelee]

Call Jake Raby. He knows what he talking about.

[thstone]

Originally Posted by s86

Thank you everyone - all input is appreciated, I am talking to some other shops and exploring my options...one thing I was told is that the 2.5 and 2.7 engines have been problematic - has anyone had any experience with installing the 3.2 engine as a replacement? I understand that it requires updating the computer as well...

In paralell with having your engine further checked, do your own research and learn everything you can. An easy place to start is at Wayne's Pelican Parts website which has a great technical article about engine swaps/upgrade compatibility:

http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/Boxster_Tech/11-ENGINE-911_Engine_Swap/11-ENGINE-911_Engine_Swap.htm

[Burg Boxster]

Originally Posted by Brucelee

Call Jake Raby. He knows what he talking about.

I'm sure he already has . . .

[Dave928]

As a forum promoter for our company you would post threads about our products and special offers in online forums of your choice. Salary will be paid based on the amount of reviews and replies a given thread receives. Our top promoters usually earn $200 - $300 a month.

hardly seems worth the effort.

[BYprodriver]

Originally Posted by Burg Boxster

Good suggestion but he might just as well be a "promoter" . . .

With the known potentially catastrophic failures of these motors, no mechanic or flatbed operator in their right mind would risk causing further damage (and possibly be held responsible for such) by running the thing, let alone under heavy load to get it onto a flatbed. That's why they have winches and tow hooks . . .

He could easily check for a bad AOS by just pulling the J-tube at this point and not starting the engine (possibly causing catastrophic hydroloc) to test filler cap.

So, either he's a "promoter" (and yes everyone knows what I mean by that) or someone whose really in for a wallet draining w/ this mechanic.

Good luck and if these problems are real, definitely start by getting a new mechanic... one who knows what the heck they are doing

Not at all familiar with the "promoter" label, but I don't see how it would be possible to have as many posts as you do & not be aware of the excellant reputation of JFP in PA. His frequent posts are as helpful as anyone's on this forum.