read this and be warned about your motor

[funkdefino]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

As far as the IMS bearing goes:
An engine can go 225,000 miles with all 24 lifters bad... You'll have loud valve train, but it'll go that far without catastrophe.. BUT you'll be losing .040" valve lift, which is about 10% of the net valve lift of the engine.. That makes for low power, etc, etc...

What test can be done or what do I tell my mechanic to find out if I have bad lifters?

[gregdacat]

Maybe I am ignorant or a bit touched, but I knew what I was buying when I bought my 986. I paid significantly less for my car than my wife paid for her Jeep Liberty. I have had it a tad over a year and put about 9,000 miles on it (74,000 on the clock). The honeymoon is not over. The only repairs I have put into it other than routine Maintenance is to replace the A/C display and a brake light switch.

If it implodes tomorrow or 4 years from now I would probably buy another. What is it they say about insanity, "It's doing the same thing and expecting different results."

If that is the case, I am crazy about my 986. :dance:

[mptoledo]

Originally Posted by gregdacat

Maybe I am ignorant or a bit touched, but I knew what I was buying when I bought my 986. I paid significantly less for my car than my wife paid for her Jeep Liberty. I have had it a tad over a year and put about 9,000 miles on it (74,000 on the clock). The honeymoon is not over. The only repairs I have put into it other than routine Maintenance is to replace the A/C display and a brake light switch.

If it implodes tomorrow or 4 years from now I would probably buy another. What is it they say about insanity, "It's doing the same thing and expecting different results."If that is the case, I am crazy about my 986.

I feel pretty much the same way. I got my boxster at a fire sale price. I always said if I end up liking it(which I do/did) then if the engine goes kaboom, I might think about dropping in a 3.4 or even a 3.8.

After chatting with an "expert" on the IMS subject, I am trying to weigh the cost of Preventive maintenance and engine replacement. The Ims is about 12.4% to 25% of an engine replacement(depending on what size I get). Here is the sick part. to do the lifters,clutch rebuild and ims/rms its 47% of what I paid for my Boxster two months ago. I have the upmost confidence in the "expert" but that is a lot of money to ponder, especially in this economy(couldn't resist blaming it) .

[chitowndad]

Jake,
What are some normal price ranges for upgrading the IMS and a few lifters etc. Are we talking $500 or $5,000?

-Steve

[Jake Raby]

Originally Posted by funkdefino

What test can be done or what do I tell my mechanic to find out if I have bad lifters?

Your mechanic should have a trained ear to recognize the tappet noises... A dyno run will show if the engine is low power, but you'll need other graphs from similar cars to know what is actually low power..

The only way to know is to pull the lifters and inspect them...

I know the main contributor to this issue, but will not post it, because it would start WWIII...

[spine911]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

I know the main contributor to this issue, but will not post it, because it would start WWIII...

LOL ....NOT ANOTHER teaser from you - i smelled that coming......

[Jake Raby]

Originally Posted by spine911

LOL ....NOT ANOTHER teaser from you - i smelled that coming......

See, I get in trouble even if I keep my mouth shut..
Open the rear trunk of your Boxster and the issue is staring you right in the face.

[mptoledo]

"m.... . "?
.
.
.
.
.
Sorry couldn't resist guessing!!

[spine911]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

See, I get in trouble even if I keep my mouth shut..
Open the rear trunk of your Boxster and the issue is staring you right in the face.

It is Reverse Psychology - i bluffed ,and it "forced" you to give in a little of your tease....I just LOVE it when you start teasing us

(mptoledo), can i buy a numerical character to add to your guess??

[mptoledo]

Originally Posted by spine911

It is Reverse Psychology - i bluffed ,and it "forced" you to give in a little of your tease....I just LOVE it when you start teasing us

(mptoledo), can i buy a numerical character to add to your guess??

We could play hangman!!



Dead body? close, maybe dead dinosaurs(sort of).

[spine911]

Originally Posted by mptoledo

We could play hangman!!



Dead body? close, maybe dead dinosaurs(sort of).

Sounds Fun!

Dead body?......Dead dinosaurs?..... or, Fossilized "dead dinosaur" bones for Oil????

[funkdefino]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

Open the rear trunk of your Boxster and the issue is staring you right in the face.

A dead body?

[Brucelee]

Jake,

You may have covered this but, why do you supposed the lifters are sticking? Is this a design issue with the engine. Can lubrication in any way deal with this?

[Lil bastard]

The basic reasons lifters stick, or their valves do, is that either 'gunk' clogs the valves or varnish accumulates on the lifter body, oil feed, or valve.

There are a few tried and true methods of cleaning/correcting these conditions, and I want to convey these, but in our litigation-happy culture, I simply cannot tell you what they are...

OK.. I will :

You can use a qt. of kerosene in your oil, or any of a number of additives such as SeaFoam, Lucas or Marvel Mystery Oil or you can substitute a qt. of ATF for a qt. of oil.

I do not recommend the first because of kerosene's effect of stripping the oil coating from the internals, creating additional wear while it aids the lifters.

Oil additives have varying formulas and achieve varying results, but no big downside to their use.

ATF has the benefit of first being a lubricant, but unlike motor oil, has a disproportionate amount of detergents in it's formulation, specifically to keep the valves of an auto trans clean, and last a long time in what is essentially a 'closed system'.

This is not a snake oil treatment, it is a tried and true method used by many enthusiasts and mechanics since hydraulic lifters were first introduced by Pierce-Arrow in the 1930's, just search the web and see how many times this is recommended as a cure, albeit not a cure-all.

Any of the additives mentioned above will dissolve varnishes and open restricted valves and oil galleries.

There are a couple of caveats though. It is best to add them to fresh oil and operate the engine for no more than 30 min. (after fully warmed) and not place the engine under extreme loading, though you don't want 30 min. idle time either.

Secondly, immediately change the oil and filter afterward, draining it while still very warm (not HOT) before the gunk can fall out of suspension and varnishes redeposit on the internals.

Then, it would be prudent to do a short service interval of the 'new' oil of say 500 - 1000 mi. to insure that all of the additive and any remaining varnish and gunk is expelled from the motor.

I'm not trying to take the bread from Jake or Charles mouths, and I think it's great that they claim to have produced a superior lifter. But, I've never seen a hydraulic lifter that was immune to the issues suffered by the oem ones (though several may have greater longevity before succumbing). Nor do I believe we have any longterm 'fleet' data on their new device upon which to make absolute claims.

Then there are those who are budget restricted from implementing the flat6 solution and this method will offer them some relief, even if it may not be 'as good', it's still better than doing nothing, at a price many more can afford. And if performed every 25k mi. or so, should at least stave off the worst of it for many more miles than currently experienced.

[disclaimer] Do your research and adopt this fix on your own accord (placed here so that my wife and I may actually get to retire someday... that is unless HulaBwana finds another way of taking it away from us... )

[spine911]

You are no fun Mr. Lil bastard........mptoledo and myself are trying to play a little hangman here.

Kidding aside, i have to agree on the ATF method...Ive seen this used by my mechanic especially when "breaking in" newly rebuilt engines .

[mptoledo]

Originally Posted by spine911

You are no fun Mr. Lil bastard........mptoledo and myself are trying to play a little hangman here.

Kidding aside, i have to agree on the ATF method...Ive seen this used by my mechanic especially when "breaking in" newly rebuilt engines .

Yeah, what he said ^.

Hey what is atf? I am sure I got some serious sludge being 60k miles and the previous owner used " M.... 1 " ( I gave you your number) Anybody got a linky?

[spine911]

Originally Posted by mptoledo

Hey what is atf? I am sure I got some serious sludge being 60k miles and the previous owner used "

It is just your regular Automatic Transmission Fluid...Ive seen my mechanic use this method several times after complete engine work; ATF is mixed with the engine oil to aid in faster lubrication upon initial start-up, and it also helps clean up the engine's internal parts.

The whole procedure is much like how Mr. Lil bastard described but my mechanic uses a 50/50 (ATF/Engine oil) mix.

[Lil bastard]

Originally Posted by spine911

...The whole procedure is much like how Mr. Lil bastard described but my mechanic uses a 50/50 (ATF/Engine oil) mix.

HEY!...

Mr. Lil bastard is my father's name... R.I.P.

Just call me L.b.