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Old 07-01-2012, 04:10 PM   #1
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My First Track Day....Video Link Inside

Hello Everyone,

I took the plunge and attended my first track day at BIR on June 29, 2012 and now I Am signed up for the August 6th track day also. The instructors and staff were SUPER.

I have a 2003 Boxster base with the 2.7L. Below is a list of things I did in prepping for my first track day:

New front rotors
New EBC Yellow Stuff track pads (front only)
Flushed and filled with ATE Super Blue brake fluid
New Hankook Ventus V12 Evo K110 tires (700 miles on them by track time)
Desnorkle
Crios muffler mod
Fresh NGK Iridium spark plugs
Fresh Mobil one 10W40 Synthetic

After spending the morning driving with instructors, I spent the afternoon on my own and reported back to my instructor to discuss issues after each session. Air temp in the afternoon was 87 degrees and very humid. I had to run with all windows up and air conditioning on. Below is a Youtube link to my fifth session. Most of the other novices were off the track to take a break from the heat. There were just a few of the BIR purpose built Spec cars on the track so I felt more comfortable during this session.

First track day late afternoon session - YouTube

I would welcome any and all constructive critique or questions. Thanks in advance.
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:03 PM   #2
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Ok, I am calling total bull**************** on this. You were flying with the same car that I have, a 2.7 L. Not possible. There is no way you were passing full race cars cars with 3 or 4 times the HP and grip that we have.

Did you possibly link to the wrong vid?
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:07 PM   #3
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First track day late afternoon session - YouTube

I would welcome any and all constructive critique or questions. Thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Nice video, everything looked smooth. Some of your turn ins might have been a bit early but no large errors. How were the brakes?

One question on the camera--your Elph HS 300 worked well. What kind of mount did you use?

I've got an Elph 100HS and my videos have been fuzzy at various resolutions--like it was going in and out of focus. I've been forced to use an old camera--Canon A540--because the video on the elph is pretty much unwatchable even with a solid mount. What kind of settings on the camera are you using when recording? Resolution/tracking/ stabilization..????

Would appreciate an suggestions on getting my Elph 100 providing better in-car video.

Here's a link to a couple of mine in car videos using the A540; the WG video was with a loose chase cam mount which I fixedby taking out the extension.

MidOHRR0519002short - YouTube
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:14 PM   #4
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If you look at my lap time via the video time counter, it was not at all impressive. My best lap was about 2:12 second on the day.

Those Spec cars were driven by novices that came to the school. There was a 55 year old woman driving one of them.

I have my first solo run without an instructor posted on Youtube also. My times were horrendous at 2:25+ during that session. As I got more comfortable, I was able to brake later and hit the markers (guide cones) much better and my times improved. I have no reason to post a lie. I'm just looking for input like you did a short while back when you posted your experience.

Again, those were novices in those BIR Spec cars. Those cars could handily pound on my Boxster in the right hands.

Here's a link to my first solo attempt: BIR - My First Solo Run - YouTube
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:18 PM   #5
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Again, spectacular driving, but I can't believe that the first time you were on the track, you passed everyone so decisively, and were never passed.
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:21 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikenOH View Post
First track day late afternoon session - YouTube

I would welcome any and all constructive critique or questions. Thanks in advance.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Nice video, everything looked smooth. Some of your turn ins might have been a bit early but no large errors. How were the brakes?

One question on the camera--your Elph HS 300 worked well. What kind of mount did you use?

I've got an Elph 100HS and my videos have been fuzzy at various resolutions--like it was going in and out of focus. I've been forced to use an old camera--Canon A540--because the video on the elph is pretty much unwatchable even with a solid mount. What kind of settings on the camera are you using when recording? Resolution/tracking/ stabilization..????

Would appreciate an suggestions on getting my Elph 100 providing better in-car video.

Here's a link to a couple of mine in car videos using the A540; the WG video was with a loose chase cam mount which I fixedby taking out the extension.

MidOHRR0519002short - YouTube[/QUOTE]

The EBC pads were awesome. Absolutely no fade.

My Cannon Elph 300 was purchased on sale at Best Buy for $130. It has high def video and image stabilization. I used a Gorilla Pod mount. It has three goofy legs that I used to wrap around my rear view mirror. The draw back is the video is up side down and you have to turn it using MS Movie Maker. I have my setting at 1080p which is too much as it would only allow 11 minute clips at a time. I'll do lower resolutions in August.
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:28 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by san rensho View Post
Again, spectacular driving, but I can't believe that the first time you were on the track, you passed everyone so decisively, and were never passed.
They were absolutely very slow bro. I'm not pulling your leg. If you don't believe me, watch the other video where I could not pass the Chumpcar ($500 GTI) race car.

Again, I got very comfortable in the afternoon because I pretty much knew where & when the rear tires will break loose and stayed on that limit. You can tell where I went past the limit and it broke loose near the end of the video when I had to let off and get back on the gas really quick.

Your unbelieving comments are stoking my ego right now......THANKS

What year is your Boxster?
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:40 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Boxster586 View Post
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Nice video, everything looked smooth. Some of your turn ins might have been a bit early but no large errors. How were the brakes?

One question on the camera--your Elph HS 300 worked well. What kind of mount did you use?

I've got an Elph 100HS and my videos have been fuzzy at various resolutions--like it was going in and out of focus. I've been forced to use an old camera--Canon A540--because the video on the elph is pretty much unwatchable even with a solid mount. What kind of settings on the camera are you using when recording? Resolution/tracking/ stabilization..????

Would appreciate an suggestions on getting my Elph 100 providing better in-car video.

Here's a link to a couple of mine in car videos using the A540; the WG video was with a loose chase cam mount which I fixedby taking out the extension.

MidOHRR0519002short - YouTube
The EBC pads were awesome. Absolutely no fade.

My Cannon Elph 300 was purchased on sale at Best Buy for $130. It has high def video and image stabilization. I used a Gorilla Pod mount. It has three goofy legs that I used to wrap around my rear view mirror. The draw back is the video is up side down and you have to turn it using MS Movie Maker. I have my setting at 1080p which is too much as it would only allow 11 minute clips at a time. I'll do lower resolutions in August.[/QUOTE]
---------------------------------------------------------


It's wrapped around your rear view mirror? Wow--the guys in tech didn't have a problem with that?

Did you leave it on auto or did you dabble with the settings?
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Old 07-01-2012, 05:58 PM   #9
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Ok. I apologize. I saw those spec race cars and said, no way this guy is this fast, especially on a first track day when its usually forbidden to pass in the corners.

So like I said before, great driving, you were hitting the apexes very well and then getting back on the gas. Once or twice you started to skid but were able to recover with no drama. Good work.
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1973 Opel Manta
1969(?) Fiat 850 Convertible
1979 Lancia Beta Coupe
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1985 Porsche 944
1989 Porsche 944
1981 Triumph TR7
1989 (?) Alfa Romeo Milano
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Old 07-01-2012, 06:38 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikenOH View Post
The EBC pads were awesome. Absolutely no fade.

My Cannon Elph 300 was purchased on sale at Best Buy for $130. It has high def video and image stabilization. I used a Gorilla Pod mount. It has three goofy legs that I used to wrap around my rear view mirror. The draw back is the video is up side down and you have to turn it using MS Movie Maker. I have my setting at 1080p which is too much as it would only allow 11 minute clips at a time. I'll do lower resolutions in August.
---------------------------------------------------------


It's wrapped around your rear view mirror? Wow--the guys in tech didn't have a problem with that?

Did you leave it on auto or did you dabble with the settings?[/QUOTE]


There wasn't a tech inspection. The instructor saw it and didn't say anything. They did make us take everything else out including the floor mats and the glove compartment contents.

The camera was set to auto. It's a great little camera, IMO.
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Old 07-01-2012, 06:46 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by san rensho View Post
Ok. I apologize. I saw those spec race cars and said, no way this guy is this fast, especially on a first track day when its usually forbidden to pass in the corners.

So like I said before, great driving, you were hitting the apexes very well and then getting back on the gas. Once or twice you started to skid but were able to recover with no drama. Good work.
Thanks bud. I didn't post the video where I came out of turn 13 too fast (after the bridge) and drove in the grass for a short bit

I was in the novice group and there were only two passing zone. The one after the bridge is the easiest place to pass so that's where I made the passes.

At BIR, you are a novice for the first two track days and then you MAY move up to the intermediate group IF you'd like.

My shifting still sucks. At times, I did not shift until I've already entered the corners. I also need to learn/practice heel toe shifting!
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Old 07-02-2012, 08:13 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Boxster586 View Post
Thanks bud. I didn't post the video where I came out of turn 13 too fast (after the bridge) and drove in the grass for a short bit

I was in the novice group and there were only two passing zone. The one after the bridge is the easiest place to pass so that's where I made the passes.

At BIR, you are a novice for the first two track days and then you MAY move up to the intermediate group IF you'd like.

My shifting still sucks. At times, I did not shift until I've already entered the corners. I also need to learn/practice heel toe shifting!
------------------------------------------------------------------

Just as a suggestion regarding the video, I use it to check my lines, where I am on the turn in and how smooth my steering inputs are.

If you turn the camera on your self occasionally, or move it back between the seats--I have mine mounted on the roll bar--you can record your steering inputs and get a feel for how smooth you are. Smooth steering inputs--same for brakes and gas--make a big difference on how settled the car is at any one moment, especially in the curves.

Finally, think about a data logger (smartphone), GPS receiver and a program to record track data--I use Race Chrono. You can compare your lap times and actually retrace your lap to see where you were on the course, what your speed was and where your breaking point was; I went back through a session and compared laps with similar times but found different lines through a curve/sector and found out just how much more time I was loosing or gaining by taking a particular line. A great educational tool.
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Old 07-02-2012, 09:52 AM   #13
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MikenOH,

That is SUPER advice. I will do that for my August 6 track day.

Thank you.
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Old 07-02-2012, 02:01 PM   #14
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The data logger setup was a cheap investment:
1 MOT Q9c that I no longer used as a phone
1 Qstarz 818xt gps receiver--$70
1 Race Chrono software----free


The GPS receiver and phone communicate via a bluetooth connection; supposedly there are OBDII readers out there that will work with the Porsche ECM to pull in engine data to this mix.

To do the data overlay on the video I bought a program on line for $25--race render--which is a simple plug and play setup to match your video with the track data; very simple to synchronize and I highly recommend it.

Putting all that technical stuff aside, it's critical to remember that we're all out there for fun, not making our living at this so we need to be courteous drivers--giving and taking point overs when needed and not letting our egos get in the way of having of having a good time.
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Old 07-03-2012, 04:33 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by MikenOH View Post
The data logger setup was a cheap investment:
1 MOT Q9c that I no longer used as a phone
1 Qstarz 818xt gps receiver--$70
1 Race Chrono software----free


The GPS receiver and phone communicate via a bluetooth connection; supposedly there are OBDII readers out there that will work with the Porsche ECM to pull in engine data to this mix.

To do the data overlay on the video I bought a program on line for $25--race render--which is a simple plug and play setup to match your video with the track data; very simple to synchronize and I highly recommend it.

Putting all that technical stuff aside, it's critical to remember that we're all out there for fun, not making our living at this so we need to be courteous drivers--giving and taking point overs when needed and not letting our egos get in the way of having of having a good time.
Thanks again Mike. I'll likely have more questions for you when I begin this process but why is the Qstarz 818xt gps receiver needed? If my Android phone already has navigation, do I still need the receiver?
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Old 07-03-2012, 06:13 AM   #16
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Thanks again Mike. I'll likely have more questions for you when I begin this process but why is the Qstarz 818xt gps receiver needed? If my Android phone already has navigation, do I still need the receiver?
To get an accurate position on where you are on the track at a given point in time, you need to get numerous position reports/second because of the speeds involved.

818xt is capable of providing position reports at 10Hz--10 reports/ second. I usually have mine locked at 5hz--5 reports/second because of limitations on my phone. Your generic android phone GPS usually runs at 1Hz--1 position report/second.

At 60mph, you're covering 88 feet/second; with a GPS running 1 position report/second going down the interstate this is no big deal--accurate enough for your purposes. On a race track at twice that speed--say 180'/second--your position reports can be off by nearly 60 yards at those speeds, which will compromise your track data as far as how fast you were going at what point on the track.
If you look at some youtube posters using an iPhone/harry's lap timer--assuming they are just using the phone's internal gps--this lag in speed vs. the video is very apparent; you know the guy is accelerating but the indicated speed seems to move slowly--then boom, it's +20mph faster than it was a second ago.

So, to put it simply, because of the speeds on the track, you need something faster than 1hz reporting if you want accurate speeds at a given location. 10 Hz would be great but a 5hz gps device seems to work fine for me.

Hope this helps; BTW Qstarz also sells a complete data logger--does the function of the RC software--besides records position reports-- for about $170.
Here's a link to Qstarz:
Shop QSTARZ | QSTARZ Q1000eX GPS Lap Timer
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Old 07-03-2012, 07:23 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by MikenOH View Post
To get an accurate position on where you are on the track at a given point in time, you need to get numerous position reports/second because of the speeds involved.

818xt is capable of providing position reports at 10Hz--10 reports/ second. I usually have mine locked at 5hz--5 reports/second because of limitations on my phone. Your generic android phone GPS usually runs at 1Hz--1 position report/second.

At 60mph, you're covering 88 feet/second; with a GPS running 1 position report/second going down the interstate this is no big deal--accurate enough for your purposes. On a race track at twice that speed--say 180'/second--your position reports can be off by nearly 60 yards at those speeds, which will compromise your track data as far as how fast you were going at what point on the track.
If you look at some youtube posters using an iPhone/harry's lap timer--assuming they are just using the phone's internal gps--this lag in speed vs. the video is very apparent; you know the guy is accelerating but the indicated speed seems to move slowly--then boom, it's +20mph faster than it was a second ago.

So, to put it simply, because of the speeds on the track, you need something faster than 1hz reporting if you want accurate speeds at a given location. 10 Hz would be great but a 5hz gps device seems to work fine for me.

Hope this helps; BTW Qstarz also sells a complete data logger--does the function of the RC software--besides records position reports-- for about $170.
Here's a link to Qstarz:
Shop QSTARZ | QSTARZ Q1000eX GPS Lap Timer
A quick clarification on this...
I am a fan of RaceChrono software and use a 5hz Qstarz GPS receiver with it but... You can still get very high positional accuracy and lap times within 5/100s of a second using a 1hz external receiver and Harry's software (internal phone GPS receivers are very low resolution). We run a pair of matched Spec Boxsters and I use RC while my brother runs Harry's Laptimer. Harry's uses interpolation to give highly accurate sector times and positional data. The timing and data results are very close between the two GPS products. I still prefer RaceChrono for lap analysis but both systems work very well and both are within 5/100ths of our transponder lap times. It's not quite as simple as just comparing GPS sample rate in Hz.
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Old 07-03-2012, 07:48 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Boxster586 View Post

I would welcome any and all constructive critique or questions. Thanks in advance.
Very nice smooth laps, good tire loading and generally good racing line.

Suggestions for next time:

*Be patient and drive your own line when behind a slower car in a no-passing zone. Those guys in the "track cars" were driving down the middle of the road and I was truly embarrassed for them . It's a good time to cool down your brakes.

*I am never real comfortable sharing a corner with a novice driver I don't know who clearly doesn't know the racing line. Too much opportunity for paint swapping. In this case I prefer to get my passing done in the straights. Food for thought.
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Old 07-03-2012, 09:27 AM   #19
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A quick clarification on this...
I am a fan of RaceChrono software and use a 5hz Qstarz GPS receiver with it but... You can still get very high positional accuracy and lap times within 5/100s of a second using a 1hz external receiver and Harry's software (internal phone GPS receivers are very low resolution). We run a pair of matched Spec Boxsters and I use RC while my brother runs Harry's Laptimer. Harry's uses interpolation to give highly accurate sector times and positional data. The timing and data results are very close between the two GPS products. I still prefer RaceChrono for lap analysis but both systems work very well and both are within 5/100ths of our transponder lap times. It's not quite as simple as just comparing GPS sample rate in Hz.
Topless
Thanks for the clarification; a question or two:

With Harry's, you use an external 1 hz GPS receiver and the software interpolation capability gives it the accuracy of a 5hz receiver? Which receiver was your brother running?

I guess my views on Harry's was colored by the guys I knew that used it running their iPhones for GPS data--good to know!

Just out of curiosity, what kind of analysis for harry's offer relative to RC?
Also, have they fixed that every other lap issue?
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Old 07-03-2012, 06:55 PM   #20
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Topless
Thanks for the clarification; a question or two:

With Harry's, you use an external 1 hz GPS receiver and the software interpolation capability gives it the accuracy of a 5hz receiver? Which receiver was your brother running?

I guess my views on Harry's was colored by the guys I knew that used it running their iPhones for GPS data--good to know!

Just out of curiosity, what kind of analysis for harry's offer relative to RC?
Also, have they fixed that every other lap issue?
My brother uses the Tom Tom mount with his iphone/Harry's which supplies a solid mount, power and a hi-res 1hz GPS receiver. Our cars run nearly identical lap times and we often compare between data loggers and our official posted transponder times. Harry's lap time/sector time accuracy is every bit as good as my 5hz w/RaceChrono. Positional accuracy mid corner is still a little better with the 5hz RC. There are now a few 5hz & 10hz receivers available for Harry's but I think they are $170ish.

The lap analysis feature with RC is a very intuitive tool where you can look at two laps running slightly different setups or strategies and compare corner entry/exit speeds with a graph and track overlay. I use this feature a lot and last I looked Harry's was not as good. HLT did just come out with a major software revision so it might be better now. Both apps are excellent learning tools once you get beyond the basics of performance driving and start chasing 1/10ths and TT championships.

More on GPS laptimer accuracy using Harry's. This is pretty consistent with what we see doing data comparisons:
http://gps-laptimer.de/GPS_and_Accuracy.html
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