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Old 03-20-2008, 10:35 AM   #1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lil bastard
WOW! Very passionate arguements!

But, really, it's only academic or philosophical because too many assumptions are being made for the stated arguement to have any real world relevance.

Nothing is noted about the type of lubrication - not all motor oils provide the same level of lubrication and protection under high RPM use.

Nothing is noted about the filtration system (filter) used or whether different filters change the equation - they do - see: Barris, M.A. (1995). "Total Filtration: The Influence of Filter Selection on Engine Wear, Emissions and Performance". SAE Fuels and Lubricants (Paper 952557)

Nothing is noted about the lubrication system flow capability and variances under differing RPM ranges.

Nothing is noted about the ambient operating temperatures or temperature ranges for this high rpm operation.

Nothing is noted about the cooling system efficiencies at high RPMs or whether the levels of coolant pump cavitation at varying RPMs have an effect on wear - they do.

Nothing is noted about the varying valvetrains and their contributions to increased wear at high RPMs.

Fuel Quality, Gen'l Engine condition, Driving Habits, Load, and on and on...

As I read this, there are simply too many unmentioned or unquantified variables to produce a soletary conclusion to this arguement.

Each side will continue to produce out-of-context or non-relevant technical data or references to try and eek some further validation of their expressed view and ample, endless, tidbits exist out there to prolong the arguement indefinitely with no chance of reaching a reasonable conclusion.

Nor does it seem, are the parties involved capable of being swayed by the arguements made by the other side. People it seems will go away believing pretty much what they did as they entered this discussion.

I mean, there is not even a concensus on this issue among qualified experts, how could we possibly hope to produce one here?

So, really, IMHO, it's time to slap the lock on this thread - I mean 87 replies over 5 pages and no end in sight!

Time to get back to Boxstering - at whatever RPM Floats your Boat.
Again, we are just having a theoretical disussion, there is no argument per se.

The assertion made was that running the Boxster engine at high rpms (to red line every day) is GOOD for the engine. Cleans out carbon etc. The implied converse is, the engine is built for high RPMs so NOT running at high RPMs is bad for the engine.

I assert this is not and cannot be true.

There are tons of mitigating factors. However, I would like someone to explain how heat, friction, stress and wear are all not HIGHER at higher RPMs and piston speeds. I think this would take a repeal of the laws of physics and engineering.

BTW- I used to set my oil temp gauge on the C5 and when I ran it at high RPMs, the oil got hot and quickly. The cooling system kept the car OK, but the innards of the engine were getting quite toasty.

I may be wrong but when an engine is designed to run high horsepower, high RPMS, they always beef it up in design. If RPMS were GOOD for the engine, they would not need to do this.

When an engine is designed for high RPMs, I don't think they look for a cheap grade oil, they spec synthetic etc. In other words, they try to accomodate the high RPM, piston speeds, etc. They must do this for a reason, no?

My point is, it is fun to run your engine hard, how fun is a track day! :
However, just be honest, this fun comes with a risk. To deny this seems disingenuous.


D
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Old 03-20-2008, 11:07 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brucelee
Again, we are just having a theoretical disussion, there is no argument per se.

The assertion made was that running the Boxster engine at high rpms (to red line every day) is GOOD for the engine. Cleans out carbon etc. The implied converse is, the engine is built for high RPMs so NOT running at high RPMs is bad for the engine.

I assert this is not and cannot be true.

There are tons of mitigating factors. However, I would like someone to explain how heat, friction, stress and wear are all not HIGHER at higher RPMs and piston speeds. I think this would take a repeal of the laws of physics and engineering.

BTW- I used to set my oil temp gauge on the C5 and when I ran it at high RPMs, the oil got hot and quickly. The cooling system kept the car OK, but the innards of the engine were getting quite toasty.

I may be wrong but when an engine is designed to run high horsepower, high RPMS, they always beef it up in design. If RPMS were GOOD for the engine, they would not need to do this.

When an engine is designed for high RPMs, I don't think they look for a cheap grade oil, they spec synthetic etc. In other words, they try to accomodate the high RPM, piston speeds, etc. They must do this for a reason, no?

My point is, it is fun to run your engine hard, how fun is a track day! :
However, just be honest, this fun comes with a risk. To deny this seems disingenuous.


D
Well, I don't want to get sucked into this Black Hole, so I'll just posit this thought and be done with it.

I'm not sure I agree that High RPM engines are 'overbuilt'. Typically, if anything, they are 'underbuilt' to lighten the reciprocating mass in order to facilitate the high RPMs.

High HP motors may be another story.

Further still, High RPM/High HP Production motors also meant to meet a certain reliability criteria may be yet another entirely different story altogether.

My own personal belief system says that higher stress equates to accelerated wear, but I'm no self-proclaimed expert on the subject.
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Old 03-20-2008, 11:34 AM   #3
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LOL who dug this old thread up? And are people seriously trying to argue that driving at higher average rpms will extend the life of your engine?!?!
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Old 04-12-2008, 04:27 PM   #4
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great posts

wow, I didn't think that my little post would cause such a debate!
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