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Old 06-03-2006, 06:20 PM   #1
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new tires on the box and guess what...?

so, finally got the new set of tires (actually two - haven't figured that one out yet - since they told me three were defective when i started this journey a month ago...), one on the back, one of the front - the remaining two orig - had 5200 miles on them.

grossly, that obvious kind of out-of-balance, out-of-round vibration was gone. but as you might have figured, my annoying little shimmy is still there. car still feels unstable and you whip through a corner or, in fact, the best example is a a nice long freeway interchange (for me the I10 onto the 215S/91W - it's about 1/2-3/4 mile in length and 80 should be a piece of cake. in my car you feel like you're bouncing around and the car is being thrown around like a small dingy on the ocean. however, the shimmy is a constant phenomenon - very pronounced above 3500 (obvious to me at 4000rpm and >) and happens in a straight line. unfortunately, i know i'm wasting my time at Walter's - not too mention, its pretty obvious that i've been labelled the a-hole customer (although i've never raised my voice),but apparently it's too much to actually expect that they find something wrong with the car. sadly, if i have another dealer look at it, i'll end up driving the 80 miles to hoehn. or, i've got a private, certified porsche mechanic locally, but haven't come to terms with having to spend my own money on an issue that is clearly warranty related.

could it just be that this car doesn't like 19" wheels? do i have something defective in the suspension or motormounts? is it wrong to go to a dealer and ask that a tech or serv mgr who owns and drives a porsche regularly, inspect the car, rather than the guy who drives a honda or saturn?

the bmw 330 ci is looking pretty nice now. in fact, the 95 993 that i test drove yesterday may have a welcome home in my garage...

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Mach Schnell
05 Mini Cooper S
CR/W - AC Schnitzerz'd, Alta CAI, Cravenspeed SSK
Japanese Rising Sun roof graphic
De-ambered and nearly de-chromed!

Sold - 05 BMW 330CI ZHP M-tuned
Imola Red, 6spd, Alcantra & Carbon Fiber Interior

Sold - 05 Boxster Black/Black 5spd
19" Carrera S Wheels
Bose Audio System/Sport Chrono Pkg
Schnell Short Shifter
Yellow Calipers c/ carbon fiber Porsche lettering
De-Ambered

Sold - 03 VW Beetle Silver - way too modified!
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Old 06-03-2006, 06:33 PM   #2
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Goodbye 987- hello anything else....

I couldn't blame you a bit for getting out of that car. I really hoped the tires would solve your problem. I just can't believe they didn't replace ALL OF THE TIRES. The problem with not replacing all of them is that there is now the possibility that one or more of the old tires are still bad. It's basic problem solving 101. By replacing only 2 you still can't eliminate the tires as the source of the problem and therefore move on to other possibilities. Seriously, if you were here in Colorado I'd let you borrow my second set of rims and tires (17's) to see if that fixed the problem.

Stay Strong!
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Old 06-03-2006, 06:41 PM   #3
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denverpete - thanks! yeah, if i were in your area that would be a great way to explore if it is really a tire/wheel issue - i appreciate the offer.

i will keep the forum posted on what happens. i'm gonna email my salesman down in carlsbad/hoehn (its a more affluent area down there and seems like more of the people at that dealership drive porsche than at walter's) describe the problem to him and see if he can get the right service people at his dealership to investigate the prob!

i'm also gonna have this private porsche tech inspect the 95 993 this week (hopefully) and we'll go from there - the 330ci has the leading edge of being essentially brand new (2005, 13000 miles and CPO BMW thus, 100k warranty), the 95, if it gets stellar marks on the inspect, has the advantage of being a ********************in car that oh, by the way is both porsche and 911
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Mach Schnell
05 Mini Cooper S
CR/W - AC Schnitzerz'd, Alta CAI, Cravenspeed SSK
Japanese Rising Sun roof graphic
De-ambered and nearly de-chromed!

Sold - 05 BMW 330CI ZHP M-tuned
Imola Red, 6spd, Alcantra & Carbon Fiber Interior

Sold - 05 Boxster Black/Black 5spd
19" Carrera S Wheels
Bose Audio System/Sport Chrono Pkg
Schnell Short Shifter
Yellow Calipers c/ carbon fiber Porsche lettering
De-Ambered

Sold - 03 VW Beetle Silver - way too modified!
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Old 06-03-2006, 11:54 PM   #4
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Maybe you should try Circle Porsche in Long Beach. But if you are going to Walter's then you probably live in Riverside and Longbeach would be quite a hike for you. All the dealing I have had with Circle have been excellent. They really treat you right. Also there is Auto Gallery in Woodland Hills, but again quite a hike for you. I just hate to see you give up on your 987, but I understand your frustration. Maybe somebody here in SoCal has an extra set of wheels or track set the would let you use them to see if that fixes the problem (as denverpete suggested). Anyway, good luck.
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Old 06-04-2006, 07:06 AM   #5
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I haven't read all of the posts to this saga, so forgive me if I am repeating some advice. If you really want to know if it is the tires and wheels, it seems that smith above is on to something here in termporarily swapping out wheels and tires. My suggestion is the same but with a twist. Test drive another 987 or S , preferably an 05 from your dealer's lot or another dealer's. If no shimmy, ask to swap those wheels/tires onto your car and take it on the same test route, the same speed. If yours continues to shimmy, think about how far you want to chase this. I would be thinking about abandoning ship, and probably for a trade on that 987 you just tested.

In the alternative, you could keep your eyes pealed for another cpo 987 elsewhere for a swap or better yet, go totally into the financial red and look at a 996S or 997SCab. As good as a Bimmer 330 is, it's no Porsche. It's only cashflow. At the moment, I'm trying to talk my daughter into dropping out of college so I can head for a 997S Cab myself! .

Sorry to hear of this niggling ongoing problem. Owning any sports car should be fun. Owning a Porsche should be fantastic.

Good luck.
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Old 06-04-2006, 05:45 PM   #6
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i'm actually contacting the dealership where i bought the car and inquiring if the car had any damage or accidents before i bought it -(it had 70 miles on the odometer when i purchased). also gonna contact the service department at walter's (dealership i've been dealing with re: the vibration) and inquiring why, if 3 tires failed roadtest, only 2 new ones were put on the car, rather than all 4 (as denverpete put - problem solving 101)

by the end of this week i will either no longer be a boxster owner or the ultimate cause of my shimmy and shake will be discovered
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Mach Schnell
05 Mini Cooper S
CR/W - AC Schnitzerz'd, Alta CAI, Cravenspeed SSK
Japanese Rising Sun roof graphic
De-ambered and nearly de-chromed!

Sold - 05 BMW 330CI ZHP M-tuned
Imola Red, 6spd, Alcantra & Carbon Fiber Interior

Sold - 05 Boxster Black/Black 5spd
19" Carrera S Wheels
Bose Audio System/Sport Chrono Pkg
Schnell Short Shifter
Yellow Calipers c/ carbon fiber Porsche lettering
De-Ambered

Sold - 03 VW Beetle Silver - way too modified!
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Old 06-04-2006, 05:59 PM   #7
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MS, I was wondering if those 19's require spacers. Now, I don't know alot about spacers (except that they, well, space things) - but I do know that my wife's car had a shimmy at around 70-80 mph. She replaced the tires which helped. But, the guys who replaced the tires noticed that the aftermarket rims were supposed to have spacers. They ordered them, put them on, and TADA! Shimmy gone. I don't know why - but it worked.

Just another thought.
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Old 06-04-2006, 06:37 PM   #8
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Is it possible (along the lines of being wrecked) that one of your rims is bent? It might not even be noticeable until the tires are dismounted.

Even just hitting a pothole can dent, bend or loosen things up enough to cause a vibration.

Was the alignment checked?

Suspension looked over to make sure everything was tight?

I know these are basic things, but sometimes they don't get checked...for whatever reason.

Last edited by creseida; 06-04-2006 at 06:39 PM.
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Old 06-04-2006, 08:05 PM   #9
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denverpete - the wheel spacers suggested is a good one, and if these were aftmkt wheels rather than the factory carrera s wheels, i'd really consider that, as i've driven cars with poor wheel spacers that caused vibration. however, i'd hope (but am starting to doubt the all-knowing ability of porsche) that their factory wheels wouldn't need spacers or if they did, they'd put them on the car if they're gonna sell the car with the wheels.

creseida - all your suggestions are great! and again, the basics 101 rule, if it applied to porsche service, i think we'd be at a solution. however, with the dealership having the attitude of "we don't feel it or its normal" so, we're not going to look for anything.

a month after i bought the car i took it to walter's and complained of a machine like vibration in the gas pedal - so bad my foot would fall asleep. tech said he didn't feel anything, so he didn't look for anything. a month later i brought it in for this shimmy/vibration/wobbly thing - tech and service mgr both said, nothing wrong or its normal and didn't look for anything (they didn't even check the tires for balance probs). it was only after i said i wasn't leaving the dealership unless they looked for something that they actually road force tested the tires and determined 3 were defective - yet, i have no clear explanation yet, as to why only 2 new tires were put on the car. i've debated taking the car to a private certified porsche tech i know and have him investigate the problem, but not knowing if i'd get reimbursed the few hundred dollars i'd pay him to find the problem, i'm tentative to go that route. ya know, it's a brand new car, 5400 miles on it and under warranty, i shouldn't have to go pay a private guy to find and/or fix a warrantable issue - at least that's what i said to myself when i picked this car over some of the used 911's (that didn't have a warranty)
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Mach Schnell
05 Mini Cooper S
CR/W - AC Schnitzerz'd, Alta CAI, Cravenspeed SSK
Japanese Rising Sun roof graphic
De-ambered and nearly de-chromed!

Sold - 05 BMW 330CI ZHP M-tuned
Imola Red, 6spd, Alcantra & Carbon Fiber Interior

Sold - 05 Boxster Black/Black 5spd
19" Carrera S Wheels
Bose Audio System/Sport Chrono Pkg
Schnell Short Shifter
Yellow Calipers c/ carbon fiber Porsche lettering
De-Ambered

Sold - 03 VW Beetle Silver - way too modified!
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Old 06-06-2006, 09:13 PM   #10
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I think I've found your problem...

Mach Snell Boxster
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Old 06-06-2006, 09:35 PM   #11
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dude you are so right - no vibration when i'm driving it in the backyard on the patio but boy when i get that lil plastic sucker up to 60mph - holy crapy it's jiggling and wobbling all over the place!

good thing the 993 i'm looking at has more reinforced plastic!
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Mach Schnell
05 Mini Cooper S
CR/W - AC Schnitzerz'd, Alta CAI, Cravenspeed SSK
Japanese Rising Sun roof graphic
De-ambered and nearly de-chromed!

Sold - 05 BMW 330CI ZHP M-tuned
Imola Red, 6spd, Alcantra & Carbon Fiber Interior

Sold - 05 Boxster Black/Black 5spd
19" Carrera S Wheels
Bose Audio System/Sport Chrono Pkg
Schnell Short Shifter
Yellow Calipers c/ carbon fiber Porsche lettering
De-Ambered

Sold - 03 VW Beetle Silver - way too modified!
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Old 06-06-2006, 11:24 PM   #12
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Y'know, with as many times as I've visited my dealer about stupid ****************, I was positive that they thought I was some high-maintenance dickwad.

However, I've actually formed a really good relationship with my service advisor. He understands my issues and doesn't think I'm being a pain in the ass. I come in, we joke around a bit, talk about the issues and he does his best to address them. I'm really impressed.

I'm sorry to hear you haven't had as much luck with your guys up there, but perhaps it's just your perception. Maybe they don't see you as a pain in the ass. Think positive.
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Old 06-07-2006, 06:49 AM   #13
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maybe you have a bent rim? 19" wheels w/ low profile tires is a recipe for pothole damage. i'd also gripe to get the dealer to replace the other two tires. check your alignment, too. if something is out of whack, it could explain why the tires were 'defective' so soon after you bought the car. poor alignment can also cause vibrations and decreased drivability.
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Old 06-07-2006, 08:52 AM   #14
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i agree with all the suggestions - i just can't get the dealer to admit there is a problem (everyone else who drives my car will though), so b/c dealer thinks vibration is normal porsche phenom, they won't check anything. sure i could pay a private cert porsche mechanic to diagnose (and even fix the problem), but that goes against the principal of having a new car with a warranty.

i'm baffled as to how it's not just a courtesy, when a customer continues to complain about a problem that is so significant that in their (my) own words, if it's not diagnosed and fixed, the car will be sold, that the dealer will check the basics of vibration causes just to make sure everything is intact.
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Mach Schnell
05 Mini Cooper S
CR/W - AC Schnitzerz'd, Alta CAI, Cravenspeed SSK
Japanese Rising Sun roof graphic
De-ambered and nearly de-chromed!

Sold - 05 BMW 330CI ZHP M-tuned
Imola Red, 6spd, Alcantra & Carbon Fiber Interior

Sold - 05 Boxster Black/Black 5spd
19" Carrera S Wheels
Bose Audio System/Sport Chrono Pkg
Schnell Short Shifter
Yellow Calipers c/ carbon fiber Porsche lettering
De-Ambered

Sold - 03 VW Beetle Silver - way too modified!
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Old 06-07-2006, 10:59 AM   #15
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@ Mach Schnell,

If you're unhappy with the Dealer, take them out of the Loop! Call Porsche Cars North America - (800) 767-7243 and either select option #3 or stay on the line to contact the PCNA Service Rep for your area. This should help...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99
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Old 06-07-2006, 12:42 PM   #16
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leaving shortly to pick my car up from hoehn (dealer where i bought the car, 2nd dealer to have the car - now for a total of 4 times for vibration - 3 times at Walter's, 1 time at Hoehn). Unfortunately, nothing new - they deny anything abnormal - deny any reason to evaluate alignment or lug nut torque. when i asked what would explain 3 19" pilots with less than 4000 miles all being road force failure/defective at the same time (seems incredibly random to me), response was, it has nothing to do with the car. service mgr admited it was very suspicious, but his best guess was that my car must have got an entirely bad batch of tires (holy crap if i didn't just step into a frickin gm dealership in the backwoods of the deep south with that response). he did however offer that the regional serv mgr could evaluate the car on the 29th - i can't make it back in - no way to alter my schedule (orientation week for residency training) - so next available date is late july.

it may seem crazy, but there's something wrong with this car - i could understand if no one else noticed the problem - but other people have driven my car - these people drove it before the vibration (shortly after i purchased it) and then again recently - they all admit there's a huge difference. i could chalk it up to being the dynamic of the car if i only had the car for a week and was complaining about something no one else felt. but, since the car drove and felt one way for the first 4000 miles (although i've always had the vibration in the gas pedal), then developed this shimmy - i can't and won't accept that there's nothing wrong. furthermore, it is absolutely unacceptable to chalk up 3 defective $450 performance tires to random bad batch.

sad to say, i'm done (especially after installing the schnell short shifter - man that thing is nice - definitely if i buy the 993 - it will get short shifted soon)! i have two strong offers for both the boxster and vw and two different dealers and may move on something unless i decide to sell the car outright - only hesitation is that i'm now under 20 days before the start of residency and need all this wrapped up prior to beginning. selling the boxster outright should be easier than the vw, but may still take a few weeks.

i appreciate all the support on this forum and will stick around for color and commentary as welcomed no matter car newly occupies my garage. rondog had a strong suggestion about using the power of the forum to pursue representation for ongoing problems with any of our p-cars. - great idea and someone should take him up on that.

will keep everyone posted...
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Mach Schnell
05 Mini Cooper S
CR/W - AC Schnitzerz'd, Alta CAI, Cravenspeed SSK
Japanese Rising Sun roof graphic
De-ambered and nearly de-chromed!

Sold - 05 BMW 330CI ZHP M-tuned
Imola Red, 6spd, Alcantra & Carbon Fiber Interior

Sold - 05 Boxster Black/Black 5spd
19" Carrera S Wheels
Bose Audio System/Sport Chrono Pkg
Schnell Short Shifter
Yellow Calipers c/ carbon fiber Porsche lettering
De-Ambered

Sold - 03 VW Beetle Silver - way too modified!
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Old 06-07-2006, 01:24 PM   #17
creseida
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Ok, I do have a suggestion, to at least get confirmation that there might be a problem. Many Tire places, like Tire Kingdom will do a free alignment check for you, and can do a wheel balance for you for a nominal fee, like $30.00. They can also tell you if there is a problem with a tire or wheel, esp if it won't balance without excessive weights being applied. If they find something, you can then take it to your dealer and say, "Ok, I've had an independent 3rd party look the car over and they've found this. Are you going to fix it under warranty or not?"

Just a thought...and one that shouldn't cost you Porsche tech rates to try.

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