Go Back   986 Forum - for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners > Porsche Boxster & Cayman Forums > Boxster General Discussions

View Poll Results: Show or Go?
Show. Body work first. Get a body kit and refresh that paint. 6 19.35%
Go. 3.6L engine first. Looks is nothing without performance. 25 80.65%
Voters: 31. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-24-2013, 12:53 PM   #1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 711
Show or Go?

Man, I'm halfway to my goal and I'm really torn between what to do first. The results will happen within a few months.

I currently have a base 2.5L 986 that has a very dated body. Despite upgrading the LED HID Projector headlights, the paint is quite faded and there are countless scratches and nicks all over the body. Not to mention a quarter of my rear back bumper was re-done by the previous owner with this cheap bondo crap (it looks like crap).

However, I also want more power, and have already sourced out a 3.2L engine from a 986S that will be re-sleeved into a 3.6. I drive pretty aggressively and believe that performance is the key to any car.

Both will happen eventually, and both cost about the same. It's just a matter of which one I want first. Show, or go.

I lean more towards go, but I have many with strong arguments for looks as well.
Thoughts?


Last edited by Crono0001; 04-24-2013 at 12:56 PM.
Crono0001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 01:01 PM   #2
Registered User
 
CoBeerToad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Peoria IL
Posts: 526
Garage
I can't remember the way my buddy used to phrase this, but I'll give it a shot.

First make sure the car can stop.
Then make it go faster.
Once you get the car to go as fast as you want it, then make it look good. Since it is very difficult to achieve, having a car you don't want to go any faster, how the car looks rarely becomes an issue.
CoBeerToad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 01:04 PM   #3
Registered User
 
The Radium King's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,923
driver or arriver?
The Radium King is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 01:08 PM   #4
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 711
Already have upgraded 986S brakes. Suspension and rubber is also upgraded. I'm a corners kind of guy.
Crono0001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 01:43 PM   #5
Registered User
 
AKnowles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Southern, CA
Posts: 460
Sounds to me like you've already decided to get the upgraded engine. And I understand as I too would like to do so, but rather than sink more money into my Boxster I've decided to just get another car. Just don't know if I want a Boxster S, Caymen S, or Carrera S so to speak.

I'm much more in favor of getting a second car just because of what happened today (water pump failure). The idea being I can always drive the other while fixing the first. If needed.

Besides, if I put a 3.2 or 3.6 in my car I'd also have to buy new rims (wider), tires, suspension improvements, etc. and I just can't see doing that when the same funds would buy another car that already has most of that in it.
__________________
1999 Boxster Zenith Blue Metallic/Savanna Beige
AKnowles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 01:47 PM   #6
Registered User
 
EssexPorsche's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Essex, England
Posts: 276
Garage
Crono,
My $0.02 worth. Do the mechanicals first - all of them.
Then body.

For me it's not about style over substance or power over looks. It's just logical. Mint the body work, then start wrenching on it will end in tears.

Panels will get scratched, nicked etc. It's enivitable when doing that kind of work on this kind of car.
So leave the cosmetics until last. Otherwise you'll find you'll be doing it twice.

EP
__________________
Don't care......was made to care! (my Mum)

Last edited by EssexPorsche; 04-24-2013 at 01:50 PM.
EssexPorsche is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 01:58 PM   #7
Registered User
 
woodsman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Land of naught
Posts: 1,302
I agree that the mechanical should be first, if only to save the pretty parts from damage. How about upgrading to a 996 TWIN TURBO(!!!!! AWD), then for similar money you've got both--a nice body with twice the power you've got now....
woodsman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 03:58 PM   #8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Houston
Posts: 366
I've had the same decision to make on my 914. Upgrade to a flat-six engine or make it look nicer - it needs a paint job.

Spending my money on the engine conversion first is a no brainer. The car is for myself and not to impress others - and I can't see the paint when I'm driving it.
__________________
DD summer/winter: 2000 Boxster S
DD spring/fall: 914-6 w/ 3.0L SC Dual Webers

http://imgur.com/a/k0Wtl - My 914-6 Build/Project Story
patssle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 04:36 PM   #9
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 711
You guys bring up another issue that I've been condemned for by many car enthusiasts and friends a like.

Why spend $20k when I could easily spend that money and get a 987 or something.

... and to be honest, I can't really give a good answer, other than the fact that I am completely in love with my 986. And I'd rather spend that money and have the best 986 on the street than just a regular 911. Besides, my brother already has a 996TT- I'd be a copycat if I got one, and I've been copying him my whole life
Crono0001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 05:03 PM   #10
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Houston
Posts: 366
Quote:
You guys bring up another issue that I've been condemned for by many car enthusiasts and friends a like.

Why spend $20k when I could easily spend that money and get a 987 or something.
Hah. Somebody told me the same thing when I was asking around about a 914/6 conversion 3-4 years ago. A well known Porsche mechanic in Texas told me to buy a Boxster instead. Thanks for the help. Took me 3-4 years to buy a Boxster - but that's long after I decided to do the 914/6 conversion anyways.
__________________
DD summer/winter: 2000 Boxster S
DD spring/fall: 914-6 w/ 3.0L SC Dual Webers

http://imgur.com/a/k0Wtl - My 914-6 Build/Project Story
patssle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 05:24 PM   #11
Registered User
 
Perfectlap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 8,696
Have you already spent the engine money?

If not I wouldn't do it. Performance mods are just a part of the mechanical investment you'll have to make. I'm assuming you're not making this sort of an investment into a car to only own short term? If you are looking to keep the car for more than 4 years, you're going to have to address quiet a few things other than the paint and bumpers. At the end of it all you'll have put a huge chunk of money into the car and have only a slight performance edge over a 9A1 987 S or Boxster Spyder. All of those mods are sunk money because if you sell it, the market will only pay you pennies on the dollar or maybe nickels. Or worse if an old lady smashes into the back of your car the insurance company might screw you and you'll have instantly taken a bath on all that mod money. A huge risk.

If you like the 986 and require more power, get an S model and enjoy the power it has in standard form. Take it to the track/autocross and you'll see its MORE than enough power to get you into a lot of trouble. Unless the engine upgrade is going to deliver north of 100 HP, the car is not going to be transformed. I'd almost say you'd be better off dumping a Corvette engine in it. Big power, low maintenance, low cost. The other options that mean staying with a Porsche engine are just not a lot of bang for the buck vs buying another Boxster/Cayman with a 3.4. Point is, you wont' be slaying any GT3's at your local track for all that change. And if you are you spent a boat load to do it. Enough to have put you into a Boxster SPyder, Cayman R, 996 GT3 or 996 Turbo.
__________________
GT3 Recaro Seats - Boxster Red
GT3 Aero / Carrera 18" 5 spoke / Potenza RE-11
Fabspeed Headers & Noise Maker
BORN: March 2000 - FINLAND
IMS#1 REPLACED: April 2010 - NEW JERSEY -- LNE DUAL ROW

Last edited by Perfectlap; 04-24-2013 at 05:32 PM.
Perfectlap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 05:41 PM   #12
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 711
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perfectlap View Post
Have you already spent the engine money?

If not I wouldn't do it. Performance mods are just a part of the mechanical investment you'll have to make. I'm assuming you're not making this sort of an investment into a car to only own short term? If you are looking to keep the car for more than 4 years, you're going to have to address quiet a few things other than the paint and bumpers. At the end of it all you'll have put a huge chunk of money into the car and have only a slight performance edge over a 9A1 987 S or Boxster Spyder. All of those mods are sunk money because if you sell it, the market will only pay you pennies on the dollar or maybe nickels. Or worse if an old lady smashes into the back of your car the insurance company might screw you and you'll have instantly taken a bath on all that mod money. A huge risk.

If you like the 986 and require more power, get an S model and enjoy the power it has in standard form. Take it to the track/autocross and you'll see its MORE than enough power to get you into a lot of trouble. Unless the engine upgrade is going to deliver north of 100 HP, the car is not going to be transformed. I'd almost say you'd be better off dumping a Corvette engine in it. Big power, low maintenance, low cost. The other options that mean staying with a Porsche engine are just not a lot of bang for the buck vs buying another Boxster/Cayman with a 3.4. Point is, you wont' be slaying any GT3's at your local track for all that change. And if you are you spent a boat load to do it. Enough to have put you into a Boxster SPyder, Cayman R, 996 GT3 or 996 Turbo.
I'm already somewhat invested into the Boxster engine. Bought a 3.2 from a wrecked S.
And it should be pushing somewhere in mid 300 hp (or, at least the shop claims).

I'm not doing this so much for an AutoX car I can destroy GT3s as I am doing it for myself because... well, again, I can't give a good reason. I just love this car. I've driven a 996TT, and I've driven an early 00's Z06 (I hated the Z06 btw). I've also driven a 987 Cayman S. And yes, they were fun to drive, and magnitudes better than my little base 2.5... But they're not what I want. I would rather have a personal, unique Boxster that has the kick I want than a GT3 that every other rich guy has. This route, the Boxster is everything I want it to. And I don't plan on selling it. It's because of that decision that I've decided to walk down this path.

And again, I can't give a good reason, other than the fact that I want it.
Crono0001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 05:43 PM   #13
Registered User
 
ccstud17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Denver, Colorado
Posts: 138
you dont like the 986 power...
you want to change the 986 look...

you will spend a GREAT amount to do what you have mentioned... why build on this platform? buy a newer S, you dont want to put the 3.6 kind of power behind a bunch of old parts meant to only withstand the 2.5!
If you say it must be a convertible, then instantly you are adding body roll by not having a roof.

I totally get what you want to do for i have the same dream. however I cannot afford a 3.6 engine, and if I could I would get a much newer Box with the style i like so I only have to put my money into performance and not looks!
__________________
Stop lights timed for 30 MPH, are also timed for 60 and 90 MPH!
ccstud17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 06:07 PM   #14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 711
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccstud17 View Post
you dont like the 986 power...
you want to change the 986 look...

you will spend a GREAT amount to do what you have mentioned... why build on this platform? buy a newer S, you dont want to put the 3.6 kind of power behind a bunch of old parts meant to only withstand the 2.5!
If you say it must be a convertible, then instantly you are adding body roll by not having a roof.

I totally get what you want to do for i have the same dream. however I cannot afford a 3.6 engine, and if I could I would get a much newer Box with the style i like so I only have to put my money into performance and not looks!
10k does not seem like a lot. I already have the third radiator, S brakes, and Bilsten PSS9s on the coming. What else does an S have that I don't? At this point, getting an S roller would cost even more money.

Let's put it this way. This decision of modding an old outdated platform was made after lots of time pondering. I don't believe I will be persuaded from it, although you are all welcome to try. But I'm glad that this community agrees with me (Go) and not with the companions I frequent (Show)

Last edited by Crono0001; 04-24-2013 at 06:34 PM.
Crono0001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 06:30 PM   #15
Registered User
 
ccstud17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Denver, Colorado
Posts: 138
Big part of newer, is everything has less wear and tear. every moving part has a lifespan, (bearings, joints, welds, etc etc) in buying newer to the look you like you will also get parts who have a longer life ahead of them plus better engineering. 10k + my car blue book would have me in an (under 75k mile) 04 S. and that is just one place I looked in the last 5 minutes.

Also the S has a beefier rear suspension IIRC

Like I said, that is just what I would do, but I fully support the concept of having the sexy boxer look while blasting by all the other noobs!
__________________
Stop lights timed for 30 MPH, are also timed for 60 and 90 MPH!
ccstud17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 06:58 PM   #16
Registered User
 
Johnny Danger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 4,809
Garage
It sounds like you've pretty much decided on keeping your 986. With that said, it's a win/win situation if you can make it go and also make it show. Personally, I would get all of the mechanicals out of the way, and then tackle the cosmetics.
__________________
Don't worry I've got the microfilm.
Johnny Danger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 07:18 PM   #17
Registered User
 
Skrapmot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Bay Area California
Posts: 415
Quote:
Originally Posted by EssexPorsche View Post
Crono,
My $0.02 worth. Do the mechanicals first - all of them.
Then body.

Panels will get scratched, nicked etc. It's enivitable when doing that kind of work on this kind of car.
So leave the cosmetics until last. Otherwise you'll find you'll be doing it twice.

EP
Essentially, don't put lipstick on a pig. It's still a pig.
Iron out the working parts, then apply the makeup.
Skrapmot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 08:26 PM   #18
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 711
I must admit, I am a product of my environment. And that is, I am a recent graduate who found himself a good career, yet still surround myself with the younger crowd of my college years.

And of course to them, looks are everything. Despite my arguments for why I want performance, they all maintain that looks should come first. I was near agreeing with them, as they present strong arguments, but you guys pretty much set it straight.

It's my car. I want power. All else can wait.

I'll keep you all posted.
Crono0001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2013, 08:40 PM   #19
Registered User
 
BYprodriver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: O.C. CA
Posts: 3,258
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoBeerToad View Post
I can't remember the way my buddy used to phrase this, but I'll give it a shot.

First make sure the car can stop.
Then make it go faster.
Once you get the car to go as fast as you want it, then make it look good. Since it is very difficult to achieve, having a car you don't want to go any faster, how the car looks rarely becomes an issue.
This has always been my formula.
Recently finished step #3 with my 3.6
Yesterday I washed & waxed it. Then vacuumed the top canvas. (only way I know to get the lint off) Original top still looks good so I just going to replace the plastic window
Now the cosmetic restoration begins.
Seems many don't realize the cosmetics & body can be taken from you anytime. ( ask Thstone) You would have to slam a utility pole really hard to damage a engine.
Otherwise you can take it with you to your next BOX.
BYprodriver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2013, 06:53 AM   #20
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Winnipeg MB
Posts: 2,486
First off, I totally get where you're coming from. What other cars I could have bought with the money I've spent on my 99 986 is irrelevant. I don't want those other cars - I want this one. And I don't have to have an explainable reason for that - it's just the way I feel and I don't have to justify that to anyone other than myself. Good for you for being up front about that rather than throwing out some lame reasoning to appease the peeps that don't get it.

That said, I don't think that mechanical and cosmetic considerations have to be mutually exclusive. The approach I have taken was to first get the car mechanically sound. In other words, no mods, but make sure the scheduled maintenance is up to date and that anything past its service life gets replaced. Then I went after the cosmetic issues that made the car look scabby - the worn top with the cracked plastic window, the cracked leather seats, cloudy headlights, body damage, that kind of thing. Now at this point I have a good platform to move forward with mods and upgrades. The car is sound and looks nice and I can proceed with my non-essential work at my own pace and in the order that most appeals to me.

__________________
'99 black 986
Mark_T is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page