Is it possible to get 330 HP from a 2003 3.2L Engine?
 

Is it possible to get 330 HP from a 2003 3.2L Engine?

I know that's pretty high, but is it possible?

Tear the engine down totally send the cylinder halves to LN Engineering for a sleeve upgrade to 3.8. Upgrade the rod. Buy 987 air box and 90MM MAF 74 MM Throttle body and 996 tune.

Leaving the engine at 3.2L?

What he said and bring lots of $$$.

Hi,

steel sleeves have some disadvantages, because of the open deck engine design and the aluminium block.

If you rebuildt the engine and have the opportuninity to change internal components you can add a 2 KKK turbo chargers. Than the 3.2 should be able to reach realistic 330 HP and more. For example Gemballa put out 350 HP and 450 Nm out of the 3.2 engine with a Bi-Turbo conversion. This engine also had sport cats and reached Euro 3 emission controls.

As a non aspirated engine it might be possible by removing cats completely and use a lot of expensive components so you can raise the rev limit around 1.000 to 1.500 RPMs. Think the stock block and crankshaft can handle that, but there are a lot of components that have to be improved, lightend and optimized. Cooling has to be optimized. Also you will need an individual ecu remapping… i'm not shure if you will get real 330 HP. 300+ HP should be realsitic.

TechArt offered a 3.6 litre upgrade and reached 325 HP and 375 Nm with full emission controls able engines.

So leaving the engine stock and modifying the intake and exhaust along with a tune, you can't get another 72 HP out of it?

I would say no. But it depends on how long the engine should last. If you add NOS injection and use very high octane fuel, maybe you can get 330-350 HP out of it - for 5-10 minutes. :D ;)

Anything is possible but how much do you want to spend? I did simple intake and exhaust mods and a remap and dyno'd 20-25bhp more. I did it on a budget and for a bit of fun rather than ultimate numbers but you are dreaming if you think you can triple that extra output by doing the same sort of mods. On the same dyno my 550 already makes more than those numbers of my old car from exhaust mods only with 100 cell cats, sports manifolds and modified exhaust (not that this adds any power, done for the sound).

Horsepower potential is somewhat independant of displacement size, as higher RPMs provide additional airflow "as a replacement for displacement". All you have to do is supply ideal amount of fuel at the right time & you produce HP. Problem is torque is what gets you to higher rpm's quickly & this is where there's no replacement for displacement!

72hp? Realistically, if everything is done right, you might get 35hp (and 50% of the 35hp will be at >5000 rpm).

Intake: +5hp
Exhaust: +15hp (near redline)
Tune: +15hp

NOS... for about 20 seconds. :)

Flat6 gets 300+ but that is with darn near everything in the engine replaced with a strengthened part and a big displacement increase. Takes some time, shipping and more $$$ than twice what your car is worth. Go look at their site and their descriptions of their various engines and you'll get a hint of what it takes.

Can you get to 300+ for a reasonable amount of cash and still have a driveable, reliable engine that will last for 100k miles and 10 years? Or are your mods going to make the car so peaky that it will be a pain to drive in traffic, overheat, use ridiculous amounts of gas and flunk smog inspection?

This question has been asked over and over. And there is no cheap easy way it has ever been answered or we'd all be doing it. Bolt-ons won't do it, it takes some serious engineering.

Yes, but 30 Secs to 1 minute with 330-350 HP and complete engine rebuilt after the dyno test. :D

So a 987 air box with K&N air filter, 76mm TB and 997 Distribution T is only going to net me 5HP?

Based on my experience testing mods myself on a dyno, I discount what advertisers claim.

Here is the data from IPD's website. They claim a 15hp increase for $1,125. My thinking is that 15hp is the ABSOLUTE best that someone could ever hope to achieve with their system. Who knows how many changes, pulls, and waiting for the right conditions they did just to get 15hp.

To my somewhat skeptical mind, that means more like 5-10hp in the real world and most of it will come at the very high end of the RPM range.

Boxster's (and most Porsche's) breath pretty well (in and out) straight from the factory. The low hanging fruit has already been picked. Thus, most mod's to intake and exhaust only yield small marginal increases. This is why the only way to add big hp is through forced injection or more displacement.

986 Boxster/S | IPD Plenums

http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/...pshu4jhxk5.jpg

Those numbers are based off of using the stock 986 air box. I don't think 15HP is out of reach and from what I have read the larger TB helps in the lower rpm range. Look at the Torque numbers. That's what gets you off the line and into the increased HP range.

So being on the generous side. Using your other numbers.

Intake: +15hp
Exhaust: +15hp (near redline)
Tune: +15hp

That's a 45HP increase. That puts the car into the 303HP range.

With disassembling, or without?

With disassembly I can turn that engine into a 4 liter and get over 400HP from it. Its routine around here.

You're making my mouth water. Can a Tiptronic trans handle that much power?

You left out taking a loan out against your home :cheers:

625hp from 2.6l. There is a lot of horsepower hiding under the sofa. You just have to coax it out of there.

Legends: the Porsche 962 and 918 face off at Indy

Yes. The tip will handle more power than a manual.

Finally got all my parts in and installed. Just got done with a test drive with the 987 air box, K&N air filter, 76mm TB and 997 Distribution T. Oh my goodness the car pulls sooooo much harder. I bet there is a 20HP gain with the way she pulls. Also have a little done to the exhaust. Car sounds like a beast too.

After all that work I thought I was going to be disappointed, not one bit . It's not just high RPM either, it's all the way through the power band.

I couldn't be happier. :dance:

Pics!!! Got all my parts but the silicone bits, hopefully going in end of this week. Wanna see your set up!
Mine's the 2.7, so I think I'm fine with the 986 airbox. But from there it will be 996 TB and 997 T. Probably do the K&N filter, I know there's tons of back and forth on them but they seem to do fine unless over-oiled. As per some older threads around here, I got some gold foil for cheap enough to wrap some of it up and keep intake temps down. Might as well if I'm messing with it anyways.

and this is all w/o a tune?? wow...

I'll get some pics up soon. Right now my back is saying no more leaning over.

No tune. I have some favorites twisties I love to run through. I was hitting them so hard I now know I need to get better brakes. Coming out of the corners is just a joy with the way she pulls.

Hey KRAM36,
Where did you get your silicone couplers, particularly the 90 degree? I read to use a 3.25" to 3" 90 degree reducer, can't seem to find one (silicone intakes.com, etc). Are you using something else?

I used this to the TB, never mind what the picture says. The tube is 80mm.

Racing Silicone Hose Elbow Coupler Pipe 3 15" to 3 15" 90 Degree ID 80 mm Black | eBay

I used the end of my stock air pipping and that has the same O/D as the TB, but it is very thin, so I ordered in these, using 2 of them to strengthen the end of the pipping. One of them you will have to sand down a bit (put it in first), then the other one goes right on top of it and seals perfectly to the stock pipping. I also have the plastic welder that TRK mentioned and bonded them to the pipping.

One Set of 4 Hub Centric Rings Size 71 5mm to 75mm | eBay

Plastic Welder, man this thing comes in handy.

80 Watt Iron Plastic Welding Kit TPO TEO PP Rod Mesh Auto Car Welder Repair Kit | eBay

I got the same one from Harbor Freight. If you have a Harbor Freight I would get it from there. They are not of the best quality and if it breaks, just take it back for an exchange.

80 Watt Iron Plastic Welding Kit

I also used this to go from the stock MAF housing to the stock pipping, but since you're using the stock air box, you may want to use a 90° coupler there.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/251554367827

and I also used a 75mm honeycomb air straightener at the MAF housing so the MAF sensor gets a better reading.

http://www.saxonpc.com/100mm-cells-for-100.html

I molded my stock MAF housing into the 987 MAF housing. This keeps the car from running lean and when I'm ready to open up to the 987 MAF housing size, I just unclip the stock MAF house and clip in the 987 MAF housing.

That will wait until I have my exhaust mods done, then I go get a tune done on her.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2moqzxl.jpg
http://i60.tinypic.com/s2z720.jpg

Wow, eBay has so much more than I found anywhere else. Thanks, guys.

I'm not sure how you plan on doing the pipping. If it was me, I would cut the end towards the TB. Get the plastic welder, wrap the wire that comes with it and melt it into the pipping, then use the plastic strips that are included and melt that to the area with the wire. This will strengthen up the pipping so you can get a good seal on it.

TRK may have a better idea. I have a Tiptronic trans so my pipping is different then the manual trans.

You all know this has been covered before right? http://986forum.com/forums/performance-technical-chat/32074-987-v-986-air-box-7.html I have done this mod as well as a few others. The IPD helps most when our variocam kicks in. If you are planning on doing all these mods you have to get your car to a tuner or have the ability to tune it yourself in someway. When you are done and all tuned up, you will not believe the transformation in your car. I don't recommend a K&N filter. Stay stock. I was advised to do this myself by one of the the best builders/racers around for good reasons. Stock is best.

You don't have to get a tune done when using the stock MAF housing. K&N filters have better air flow then a stock air filter, you just need to rid the filter of excess oil before installing it.

I do plan a tune, but that will be done after my exhaust upgrades and I'll be changing over to the 987 MAF housing and larger pipping then.

KRAM, yes the K&N will flow better for a little while. If you change the location of the MAF you will most likely need a tune.

K&N will flow better then 5 new stock air filters before it needs a cleaning. It's the diameter of the MAF housing that matters, not location, although some say closer to the TB the better. The car runs soooo good right now I wouldn't think of doing a tune.

http://i61.tinypic.com/et64vk.jpg

Enjoy your car. I was just offering my experience. I must have been misinformed.

I just check my AFR's using this method with fully warm engine.

Bank 1 Idle 0.98 = 14.406 AFR @ 4k RPM 1.01 = 14.847 AFR

Bank 2 Idle 0.96 = 14.259 AFR @ 4k RPM 1.02 = 14.994 AFR

Not bad, a tune would help or the computer needs more miles put into it, less then 100 miles since the upgrade, but like I said, the tune will be done after my exhaust upgrades and I'll be changing over to the 987 MAF housing and larger pipping.

Those are also closed loop figures. How do you plan on checking open?

EDIT: Please explain to me the best way to get my AFR's for closed and open loop. I thought closed loop was most important?


.

Another thing I'm thinking about changing is where the venturi tube for my Tiptronic trans connects into the pipping. Right now it connects into the pipping after the MAF sensor. So it's pulling air out of the system that the MAF sensor did not account for.

http://i58.tinypic.com/16c191c.jpg

So I'm thinking about moving that connection to the air box before the MAF sensor. What do you think about that?

Move it to here? This would also allow me to use larger pipping and not worry about putting that connection into it.

http://i60.tinypic.com/rvbpds.jpg

Yeah, you are absolutely missinformed. :D :D :D ;)
K&N has designed these oil-saturated air filters definitely for injector engines. LOL!

@KRAM:
Sometimes it's better not to think too much. :D ;)
Life is complicated enough. :D ;)