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Old 03-29-2007, 10:58 PM   #1
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hey bav, I'm not dumping for the record on spending 1000 for 10 horsepower, I would do it if it was supported by something.....I just don't like the fact that the maker of the chip I think came on here to debunk MN's theories.....

yet he tried to debunk them without any proof....its like this, I'm a sales guy, and my work doesn't necessarily believe I've done my work unless they have the dials and entries into our database to prove it.....so I just saw their add in a magazine claiming my boxster is going to produce 259 HP with their chip.....but no where does it show proof.....

one thing to think about, remember the Che (??) dude and the post where he gave away an exhaust system for exchange of running dyno reports....well there is the challenge, you said this guy puts his money were his mouth is right? have them set your ecu to factory, you go get the tests done to see what you're running....and then have him reprogram it and you pay for the tests again....if it comes out, everyone on the board will be believers of the gains and I'll fork over 600 bucks no problem to get 0 horses no problem
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Old 03-30-2007, 04:11 AM   #2
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"After reading all this I am still committed to purchasing a chip. I have the exhaust, the intake and I just lost 15 pounds."

If you have not already done so, you may want to go to a lightweight battery (25-30 lbs savings) and loose your spare (do 03's still have spares... for another 30 lbs savings) and the car will pick up a little zip, what fun......


Ed

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Old 03-30-2007, 12:41 PM   #3
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Interesting thread. After looking at the cayman forum where they have been doing alot of dyno testing on mods, it seems like you would be best served to go with a header+exhaust mod if you want to gain HP.

I am attaching a link with some of that information. The Miltek header and catback exhaust seem to be getting the best gains.

http://www.caymanclub.net/showthread.php?t=10011
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Old 03-30-2007, 03:18 PM   #4
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Hi,

The issue here is the use of the dyno to measure any effect.

It doesn't matter whether it's a Chassis or Inertial Dyno, the effects you're trying to measure are too close to the degree of error to really mean anything.

People wanna sluff these off, but there are so many ways to skew the testing, both consciously and inadvertently. These Dynos are for Tuning, not determining absolute values.

The error possible is just too great, and from little things such as electrical load, gear selection, corrections (either manually or software), etc.

Also, Drivetrain losses are often waay too under/over estimated. All testing s/b be recorded only in 4th gear as this is as close to 1:1 as possible and best measures only the flywheel output. The Frictional losses in the Tranny will only account for a 0.5%-1.0% parasitic loss - not the 18%-22% often just pulled out of the air. Most drivetrain loss occurs in the Tires and varies widely from Tire-to-Tire, so much so that no meaningful generalization can be made.

Each error, such as Temperature or Barometric Pressure, or insufficient cooling, etc. may only introduce errors of 1% or 2%, but these errors compound themselves and soon you have error of 10-15% when your measured gain is 8-10%, meaning that you cannot be sure of any gain at all.

You can try to eliminate errors, such as doing Baseline Runs when the engine is HOT (most don't do this), or have an accurate weather model, again, most don't or plug in regional data which can be very different than at the Dyno itself.

The only Dyno which is accurate for the engine is a Bench Dyno. It measures the flywheel specifically. Chassis or inertial Dynos are only useful in monitoring changes while tuning, and even then are subject to great error if the operator dosen't know what they're doing...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99
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Old 03-30-2007, 05:33 PM   #5
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I would agree with you that the dyno test can vary greatly dependent on a number of factors. Therefore, the actual numbers in the result are subject to debate. I wouldn't think it was smart to say I'm going to get xHP gain for this mod b/c someone's dyno said so (ie 22hp for Miltek header and exhaust)

However, if you review the many modification posts and related dynos you can start to get a pretty good read on what mods create the greatest impact. So if you have money to burn and specifically are looking for a HP gain, i think it is reasonable to say you will get the best results investing in a new header and exhaust versus the other mod options (with the exception of a new engine).

The point I was making in my earlier post was just that 'directionally' it seems the exhaust/header mod produces the best results.
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