Worth it to 'check' IMS bearing during clutch? Clutch recommendations?

[tonythetiger]

Originally Posted by piper6909

Many companies offer lifetime warranties for items costing much less than that. Snap-on tools, Delta faucets, Raybestos brakes, ect. etc.

When they charge $1850 for a kit that cost them less than $100 to manufacture (yes, I understand a percentage goes for R&D, but not THAT much), and call it a "permanent solution" they should put their money where their mouth is.

If they won't ever fail then it wouldn't be a bad business decision, would it? They already pre-qualify the health of the engine before the "solution" gets installed, and only honor their current warranty if it is installed by an authorized mechanic, so DIYers are shut out. After all that, why would it be a bad business decision to offer a lifetime warranty?

EPS offers the same warranty as LN, but their product is less than 1/3 the cost of the LN "solution." And they don't void the warranty if an DIYer installs it.

I actually believe that the LN Solution may be a better product, so I'm not here to argue which is better. But at more than 3 times the cost, they should offer much, much better warranty, IMO.

I think Im right there with you Piper. Do the math and the numbers for revenue with LN, RND, IMSolution (same people?) around this bearing and its staggering. R & D really isnt an issue. They are modifying a flange that has already been engineered. A buddy (career car engineer but still) in Detroit sourced 25 dollar bearings (yep, 25 dollars for the double row, or 70 for ceramic doublerow) and would make modified flanges on a lathe to fix a few race cars back in the day. None of them failed. His words: "Its a simple problem, mounting a bearing, please."
The power of volume makes the cost of manufacture for these kits against the retail price LN et. al. charges opportunistic. IMHO, they took advantage of the community and should be fabulously wealthy from it. Im not mad about it, but dont like to see folks taken advantage of either by fear that has in part been propagated by those with the most to gain. and gain they did. They could have insured the solution with underwriting for pennies.

[maytag]

Originally Posted by tonythetiger

Im not mad about it, but dont like to see folks taken advantage of either by fear that has in part been propagated by those with the most to gain. and gain they did. They could have insured the solution with underwriting for pennies.

This is so well-stated. Some have bristled when I've suggested there's an agenda behind most of the "help" they offer to the community, even when seemingly unrelated to their products. This is a more overt example.

Personally, I find it offensive that they continue to suggest that "they" (their little circle) are the only ones qualified to work on these cars, or modify, or tune. And those who aren't in that circle but who've "bought into the myth" remind me of the lambs in the back yard who follow my wife around everywhere just hoping she'll pat them on the head.

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[tonythetiger]

Originally Posted by maytag

This is so well-stated. Some have bristled when I've suggested there's an agenda behind most of the "help" they offer to the community, even when seemingly unrelated to their products. This is a more overt example.

Personally, I find it offensive that they continue to suggest that "they" (their little circle) are the only ones qualified to work on these cars, or modify, or tune. And those who aren't in that circle but who've "bought into the myth" remind me of the lambs in the back yard who follow my wife around everywhere just hoping she'll pat them on the head.

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and do the math...30K plus units at 900 - 1900 dollars? Add it up! Ive wondered if one of them would pop up and try to defend themselves with stories of research and development costs, but that is fiction. This wasn't solution development, it's an adjustment to existing engineering.

JFP, I speak for everyone cool, we appreciate your weigh-in, intellect, experience and time. Thanks. BTL

[piper6909]

Originally Posted by tonythetiger

I think Im right there with you Piper. Do the math and the numbers for revenue with LN, RND, IMSolution (same people?) around this bearing and its staggering. R & D really isnt an issue. They are modifying a flange that has already been engineered. A buddy (career car engineer but still) in Detroit sourced 25 dollar bearings (yep, 25 dollars for the double row, or 70 for ceramic doublerow) and would make modified flanges on a lathe to fix a few race cars back in the day. None of them failed. His words: "Its a simple problem, mounting a bearing, please."
The power of volume makes the cost of manufacture for these kits against the retail price LN et. al. charges opportunistic. IMHO, they took advantage of the community and should be fabulously wealthy from it. Im not mad about it, but dont like to see folks taken advantage of either by fear that has in part been propagated by those with the most to gain. and gain they did. They could have insured the solution with underwriting for pennies.

Yes, I've found quality Japanese bearings for under $20 (single row). They're not special, they are actually quite common in size. I haven't found the ceramic ones yet, but if Burner did, they're out there.

But to give LN some credit, they made (At least I don't think they source) a plain bearing which is far better than a ball or cylindrical bearing. And I have no doubt it's a quality product. But damn, at that price, stand behind it for more than 5 years.

Besides, everyone says that the real problem is lubrication, anyway. Even LN says that. So it really doesn't matter if it's a ball, cylindrical or plain bearing, because the loads on it are well below their ratings.

Either way, when I can source a replacement motor for around $4,000, I doubt I'd buy the "Solution" at that price even if they guaranteed it for life. Because chances are something else could blow up my engine. It's a crap shoot.

If you want us to believe it's the permanent solution, warranty it as such. It's just the principle of the thing, you know?