Professional detailing

[Wintermute]

OK, so I've been trying to figure out the best way to get my 02 S detailed. I have access to an orbital polisher (don't have the $ right now to buy my own) but I don't have a swirl remover, polish, sealant, or the most important ingredient: Time. I got a quote on a professional detailer that can do the whole process for me. This includes:

1) Full wash and water spot removal.
2) Clay bar of entire car
3) Swirl remover with a product called Presta (Googled it and it seems pretty good)
4) Teflon paint sealant from a company called Car Brite (also seems like a quality product).

The price he quoted me is around $120. Their Web site has many pics of other cars they have done (including several restored 911s and some very nice Ferraris) and they seem to do good work.

Now I don't mind doing the washing and clay bar work myself, or even applying wax or sealant as needed. But I just don't have the time to do the full paint prep and decontamination required. So if I pay this guy to do the whole thing, how long would it be before I had to redo the swirl removal and decontamination part? I know sealants last 4-6 months, but does that mean that I need to repeat the entire process every 6 months or can I simply reapply the sealant after a good wash and clay bar? I would seem to me that a swirl remover is only needed when the swirls become noticeable.

Any thoughts/opinions would be apreciated.

[Perfectlap]

Too bad your're in Arizona I'd do it for half that.
Log onto Autopia and post a thread saying your looking for a proper paint cleaning and swirl removal in AZ. 100% sure you'll get answer fast.

As for your current offer...
Well it all depends on how many hours they are actually going to put into it.
I can easily spend 3 hours washing, claying and buffing out swirls, sealing, glazing. Not to mention the interior! Most places can't afford to spend this much time on a car so they give your car about an hour and a half. Not worth $120 in my opinion, your getting a hurry up job. You've got to make time for your baby!

this is how long it takes a newbie (at a minimum)
1. 15 minutes to wash and dry (twice)
2. 30-45 minutes to clay (most important step)
3. 1 hour to swirl remove (you have to go SLOW moving a couple of inches at a time left to right SLOWLY this CAN NOT be done properly going fast)
4. 20 minutes to polish by hand with Klasse All in One
5. 20 minutes to seal with orbital polisher Werkstat Acrylic Jett or Poorboys EX
6. 20 ninutes wax (natty's blue for dark, FK pink wax on light) and FK 425 as a dust repelling final step.


If I were you I would pass on this $120 and put that money towards your Detail Fund to invest in a Porter Cable Orbital polisher from Lowe's $140 or coastal Tool $120 . Paying another guy that much seems like a waste, detailing supplies are expensive and one time of $120 is only good for ONE TIME. Using the PC is time consuming but you'll get your money back on not having to pay some guy $100 to buff your car.

If you already have an orbital polisher see if it uses velcro pads and buy some that you can keep. Poorboys SSR 2.5 is my swirl remover and Klasse All in One my polish/cleaner wax, Poorboys EX to seal. Dark colored cars love Poorboy's Natty Blue. Buy that stuff now and you can maybe rent the PC for you pre-winter electric polishing. In between now and then you can use the product by hand.

p.s.
If you sign up for the newsletter at detailcity.com you'll get a 10% discount which is nice on an expensive order.

[Wintermute]

Hmmm...you raise some good points. I'd honestly rather do everything myself for $ and learning purposes. I wasn't sure if $120 was reasonable for that kind of service or not. I could buy a lot of Klasse and Jett Trigger for that $, that's for sure. The biggest hurdles to all of this is time and facilities coming in second. I live in an apartment complex that has covered parking (already invested in a nice Weathershield cover), but no good place to detail my car.

However, my GF's father has a nice garage and an orbital polisher, so I don't have to buy my own right away and it gives me a good place to work. Plus he's a car nut (and loves my S ), so he has tons of tools and car care stuff that I can use if I want (though I'm going to buy my own stuff).

So with your advice on time and process, I think I'm just going to do this myself. I've already got the basic washing and waxing materials, plus I got a Mother's clay bar this weekend. Man, clay works wonders! There was a spot on the passenger side headlight "hump" that was so rought to the touch that you could HEAR your hand glide over it. 10 minutes with the clay and it's smooth as glass. I'm also using Meguiar's NXT Tech wax and it looks GREAT on the Lapis blue.

So thanks for the advice (and if you're ever in Tucson, feel free to detail my car! ). Oh, one more thing that didn't get answered. How often is advisable for the swirl remover?

[Perfectlap]

$120 is about avearge around these parts for a 'buffing'. They use really cheap stuff, its very rare that you will find a professional detailer who uses high end stuff like Klasse, Poorboys, Zaino, Menzerma etc.

The swirl remover frequency depends on your washing techniques. This is 90% of where swirls are created. If you wash on weekly basis you'll have way more swirling than a car that is washed once a month and kept in a garage. Using halogen lights is the best method to determine when you need to remove swirls.
If you can see them in plain daylight under the sun or under parking lights then its bad. I never do swirl removal more than twice per year(max) because I am extremely cautious in washing methods. With a dark colored car I would completey refrain from dry dusting the surface and I would keep quick detailing between washes down to a minimum. If you must... spray each panel with a quick detailer (I use FK 146, bought it by the gallon) and wipe in the direction of the wind, flip towel. And don't use autostore Micro fiber towels. They are nothing more than janitorial towels repackaged for car lovers, horribly over priced and too rough for your paint and have to be washed several times to be particle free. Buy a 12 pack of towels (with silk binding or waffle weave) from Poorboysworld.com or detailcity.com and you'll find your paint will show dramatically fewer swirls.

If you live in an apartment (I just moved to a condo in gated community, no garage) I HIGHLY recommend two things:

1-Optimum No-Rinse (available at Detail City)
2-ditching the car cover or using it ONLY after you have washed the car (and the cover!). putting that cover on a dirty car will get the inside of the cover dirty and it will be running sand paper across your paint. If you have covered parking a cover seems more trouble than help.

Optimum No-Rinse and another product called QEW are must haves during winter and for those who don't have access to a hose on a regular basis. Buy a bottle of either (ONR is said to be better than QEW), get yourself two one gallon buckets, a sea sponge,a couple of wafle weave towels for paint and an absorber for the top and glass. I like to spray the almost dry car with FK 146 to reduce swirling during drying. ALso, You can go to Lowes or Home Improvement and get one gallon pesticide sprayers($8) to wash your wheels and top or simply go down to those coin operated places to rinse your top to lift the dust from the canvas.

here's a thread that outlines its use.

http://autopia.org/forum/showthread.php?t=32078

[Wintermute]

Good advice. The complex has a car washing station (that has some nice shade, no less) so I can wash the car anytime. Plus winter in Tucson or Phoenix means its about 60 degrees. So car washing is a year-round thing here. I have some quick detailer (Mother's I think) that seems to work really well. I really only use it to get bugs off in between washings. However I do need some better microfiber towels. Mine are plenty soft, but they just have a lot of lint and fuzz.

BUT I have to disagree with you on a few points. First, the car cover is a must for any car kept outside in the Arizona sun. Especially a ragtop. There's lots of convertibles running around here that are great in the spring and fall, but once summer hits those tops go up, the AC goes on and they don't come down again until October. So from May to August at least, you have your top up and getting hammered by the sun. Only takes a few good summers of sun beating down to turn your black top grey. Also, the heat and intense UV will fry UV protectants both in waxes and fabric protectants like Raggtop MUCH quicker than in milder climates. Everyone has a different opinion, but having lived here for almost 20 years this is what I have observed.

I know the dangers of A) covering a dirty car and B) using a car cover when it's windy. So I always make sure my car is clean and waxed when I cover it. And I use a California Car Duster every time I put on the cover. I've used those dusters for years on our old 68 Chevelle that has almost the exact same dark blue paint as my Boxster (it was repainted a few years ago with a metallic paint and clear coated) and have never had them cause a single scratch or swirl if used properly. And the covered parking does help, but it really only keeps the sun and rain off. The sides are open and allows all sorts of dust and dirt to blow all over.

The trick with a car cover in my experience is to get one with a soft, slick inner layer that won't scratch and won't trap grit. I don't like covers that have the fuzzy inner layer because they just grab any bit of passing dust and rub in onto your paint. I prefer the Covercraft Weathershield covers as the inner layer is extremely slick and smoth, but it's not fuzzy. They do warn you to only cover the car clean and waxed, however. I also make sure I wash the cover often.

[luxury1]

My car is only a few months old and I already have swirls. What am I doing wrong? I use a clean towel everytime and it is always damp. I have begun using microfiber towels also.

Does anyone have a step by step process for removing swirls?

[Wintermute]

Well the facts of life are that, unless you live in a bubble along with your car, swirls are a part of car ownership. Dust and dirt just contains particles that are harder than the clearcoat on the car, hence swirls.

But if you are simply wiping down your dusty car with a damp towel, all you are really doing is dragging dirt across your paint. Use a quick detailer like Mother's Showtime. These have lubricants in them that will help prevent swirls and scratches, and they will help clean off bugs and bird crap.

Washing is the only really safe way to remove dirt, but even then you have to be careful. First you need the right materials and proper washing techniques. Here is how to properly wash your car:

http://www.autogeek.net/exterior.html

The supplies you'll need will be partially based on personal preference. So here's a short list of good choices:

Buckets:
- 2 buckets: 1 for the wash water, and one for rinsing your wash tool in between dips into the soap
- 1 bucket with a GritGuard (mesh insert that keeps dirt and grit on the bottom)

Wash tool*:
- Sheepskin wash mit
- Microfiber wash mit
- Natural sea sponge
- Boar's hair brush

Drying tool*:
- Waffle-weave microfiber towels, such as Cobra's "The Guzzler" (should have 1 of these in any case)
- Natural or synthetic chamois (never been a fan)
- California Water Blade (basically a big squeegee made with medical-grade silicone. HIGHLY recomended in conjunction with The Guzzler)
- A leaf blower (hey, what's softer than air, eh?)

*Wash your wash tools and drying towels after EVERY wash. This will preven grit from getting trapped in the fibers and causing (you guessed it) swirls. Except the leaf blower of course.

Now that you have the basic washing and drying down, the next step is how to remove swirls. Paint detailing is a basically a 4 step process:
1) Decontamination (wash and clay bar)
2) Swirl removal
3) Polishing
4) Sealing (waxing after sealing is optional, some ppl just prefer the look)

So here's the basic process for swirl removal (thanks to Perfectlap and all the other swirlophobics out there ):

1) Wash your car with a degreasing dish soap like original blue Dawn. It will strip off old wax, grease, and anything else while not damaging the paint.
2) Dry the car.
3) Run your hand across the paint. Is is smooth as glass? If not, you need to use a clay bar to remove surface contaminants. Even if it feels smooth, you must do this step anyway, or you will be sealing contminants into your paint: http://www.autogeek.net/detailing-clay-bar.html
4) If, at this point, you have old waterspots on your car, there is an easy, cheap way to remove them: white vinegar. Just put some vinegar on a microfiber towel and wipe the spots off. Don't worry: It won't harm your clear coat. Most commercial water spot removal products (like Ducky) are mostly vinegar anway.
5) Wash and dry again with your favorite car wash (I prefer Meguiar's Gold Class).
6) Use a swirl remover, preferably with an orbital polisher. Poorboys 2.5 is a recommended product. Your paint may look dull after this step. This is normal, so don't worry. http://www.autogeek.net/dual-action-polisher.html
7) Polish by hand with a high-end polish like Klasse All-in-One, or Pinnacle Advanced Finishing Polish. This will restore your shine and gloss.
8) Finish up with a good paint sealant with the orbital polisher. The Poorboys EX or Werkstat Acrylic Jett are getting lots of praise. You can also use the Werkstat Acrylic Jett Trigger (spray form of the standard stuff) and do it by hand. Sealants last 6 months, so this is the best way to protect your paint.
9) (Optional step) Wax with your favorite wax. I like the Meguiar's NXT Tech wax (a synthetic non-carnauba), but it's really up to you. The Pinnacle Souverän wax is supposed to be excellent.

So there you go. Hope that helps. Others may have other tips that I might have missed (I'm still learning :P ), so read up as much as you can. If time is a factor for you (like me), check a few posts back from this one made by Perfectlap. He has some good time estimates on how long it should take.

[Keshari]

Hey there, I feel your pain! Juggling car care with a busy life is a struggle. It sounds like you've got a great handle on the situation with your 2002 S – smart move considering the Arizona sun can wreak havoc on a paint job.

Here's my take on the quote you got for the full detail:

$120 sounds pretty fair considering the work involved. Washing, clay barring, swirl removal, and sealing is a good chunk of work, especially for a pro who knows what they're doing. Plus, those before and after pics on their website are promising!

Focus on the Time Savings: You mentioned being short on time, and that's totally understandable. This detailer can free you up to enjoy your clean car instead of spending a weekend hunched over it.

Now, onto your questions:

Swirl Removal Frequency: This depends on the severity of the swirls and how you maintain the car wash routine. A good sealant helps protect the paint from future swirls, but it won't magically erase existing ones. If the detailer gets those swirls nice and buffed out, it could be a year or more before they become noticeable again, depending on your washing habits (touchless washes are your friend!).

Repeat Process vs. Reapplication: Spot on! You don't necessarily need the whole decontamination process every 6 months. After a good wash and clay bar (which removes surface contaminants), you can simply reapply the sealant to maintain that protection. Think of it like sunscreen – gotta reapply for continued protection, but a good base coat can last a while.

Here's what I would recommend:

Go for the professional detail. It'll save you time and get your car looking fantastic. In the future, you can maintain that showroom shine with regular washes, clay barring every few months, and reapplying the sealant as needed.

My friend actually recommended checking out azautodetailing.They seem to tick all the boxes - great reviews, in-shop or mobile options, and all the services I'm looking for.

Ask the detailer if they offer any recommendations for car wash soaps and techniques to minimize future swirls. Knowledge is power, especially when it comes to keeping your pride and joy looking sharp!