Can you really have fun driving a Tiptronic Porsche?

[986_inquiry]

when my manual 986 died I bought a manual 987. I can't imagine buying a Porsche with an automatic, just seems so poser soccer mom-ish

Yes I know the new GT3 isn't available as a manual which just seems so wrong to me. I find it hard to believe manual GT3 sales were so poor in previous years that Porsche felt they could offer automatic only

That said the only automatic Porsche I've driven was a Cayenne. It was a awful experience that I would only want to wish on a soccer mom. Shifts were slow and sluggish, only a Camry driver could appreciate a tiptronic Cayenne

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by 986_inquiry

when my manual 986 died I bought a manual 987. I can't imagine buying a Porsche with an automatic, just seems so poser soccer mom-ish

Yes I know the new GT3 isn't available as a manual which just seems so wrong to me. I find it hard to believe manual GT3 sales were so poor in previous years that Porsche felt they could offer automatic only

I don't think the move to automatic Porsches like the GT3 are entirely about sales.
That car has a limited production and in good times (like now) for the wealthy Porsche have no problem selling those small numbers. Dr. P's decision to go with a PDK only GT3 seems to be more about pace. The rear engine Porsche has been taken to its performance limit, it needs the quicker gear changes to squeeze every split second it can muster. Ditto for the four wheel steering which would not be necessary on a shorter car like the Cayman/Boxster but the swollen proportions of the Carrera have created those weirly abrubpt handling quirks.

People say that the an automatic GT3 will open up the car to more buyers but It seems like a stretch to me. If you're not into sports cars I doubt you're going to spend $150K on a GT3 (PDK or not) over a Panamera, Jag or Aston. I would think a big plush grand touring like the 991 Turbo would be a more likely choice than the GT3.

The other thing is engine maintenance/longevity. With that much power I think Porsche's engineers have deduced that keeping the gear shifting out of the hands of the deep-pocketed but not really experienced driver will result in much more reliable Porsches. Or conversely, as Porsche have themselves complained "some people only buy this car to use it on the track, that's not what we intended, this isn't a racing car, it's a racing car for the street". In other words it only costs like a racing car and if people are going to punish it on the track then PDK will make that harder. It's a win win for Porsche on possible reliablity. Some of the track junkies complain that the GT3 should be manual but track junkies are only a small part of the small part of Carrera buyers. If anything the manual transmission super sports car was on borrowed time, Ferrari dumped the the lever long ago. The bottom line is that as these sports cars need to go faster to outdo the other brand, the less they will allow the drivrer to mess up. With the engine in the rear, the Carrera is already on the back foot agains the midengine cars like the 458 and R8. Case in point, Porsche reclaims the N-Ring lap record and it wasn't a rear engine car that did it and by the margin that the 918 Spyder laid down, I doubt it will ever be anything but midengine going forward. That's was a game-change momment for the brand.

[cfos]

Originally Posted by 986_inquiry

when my manual 986 died I bought a manual 987. I can't imagine buying a Porsche with an automatic, just seems so poser soccer mom-ish

Yes I know the new GT3 isn't available as a manual which just seems so wrong to me. I find it hard to believe manual GT3 sales were so poor in previous years that Porsche felt they could offer automatic only

That said the only automatic Porsche I've driven was a Cayenne. It was a awful experience that I would only want to wish on a soccer mom. Shifts were slow and sluggish, only a Camry driver could appreciate a tiptronic Cayenne

Poser soccer mom-ish? Ouch. Your opinion to which you're entitled. I mean it must be tough for to find situations where a Boxster driver can sound tough, right? I mean it is the Porsche for girls, right? Even with a manual?

Frankly, I similarly devalue the opinions of those that buy used, non-classic cars. It's only money, right? Just make more (if you need to) and build your own car, if what you like isn't on the lot. Why waste all that time and effort looking for someone else's throw-away, or sloppy seconds, thirds, or fourths?

I mean hey, if you don't like something, that's fine. Personally, I think that there is no uglier feature than the fried egg lights on 986, 996, etc., and I have yet to see conversion kits that allow 987, 997, etc., the option of retrofitting them. Actually, I spend all my extra time NOT looking at used cars trying to find a positive thread about the fried egg lights, and haven't yet.

Disclaimer: I have not driven a manual Porsche or one with fried egg lights, but willingly drive all tips and pdks. By choice, by choice.

Say Anything -- by choice - YouTube

For those scoring at home: I should say I'm also joking/sarcastic in my words above, much like I'm sure the other poster was joking/sarcastic.

[Perfectlap]

^Dude fried eggs are the coolest... The last Porsche to take the overall at LeMans over a decade ago had them and not the beetle lights.

[Allen K. Littlefield]

[QUOTE=986_inquiry;369844]when my manual 986 died I bought a manual 987. I can't imagine buying a Porsche with an automatic, just seems so poser soccer mom-ish



Gee 986, sure sure don't feel like a soccer mom driving my tip! Maybe because I am having too much fun??? Do you think denigrating you by calling you a name would make you run out an buy at TIP? You have fun driving a manual and a lot of us have fun driving a TIP. End of story.

AKL

[cfos]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

^Dude fried eggs are the coolest... The last Porsche to take the overall at LeMans over a decade ago had them and not the beetle lights.

Hey, it's your choice, man. Enjoy 'em fried or over-easy (de-ambered) -- I'm not a registered Republican so I really don't care what other people choose in terms of headlights -- it really doesn't affect me -- even if Alex Jones says it does.

Personally, I don't check the LeMans results before making a car purchase or what all the monks in Belgium are doing before buying a beer, but admittedly, I am a much more simple being who can't even find time for soccer (pardon my ignorance, too, but what little I know of soccer... why does a mom need an SUV? Has shin guard technology progressed so much that that all the space of an SUV is required? Do parents provide their own goals? When did soccer necessitate an SUV and who really plays this "sport" -- if you call it that? I (with my soccer-wife) took my 4-year-old daughter to soccer once. Registered her and everything. After watching the swarm move up and down the field, I really don't understand the appeal (or how this is a sport for kids) After 1 game, we didn't go back -- even at 4, my daughter knew that she didn't want my Wife (or me) to ever have that nasty "soccer-stigma" associated with our parenthood for swarm-related, non-directed activities that the kids really don't understand, especially since no one wins or loses.)

[Perfectlap]

I think it at the time the term soccer mom was coined, soccer, or more correctly football, was resurgent as a favored organized sport of suburban families. The term was whipped up by one of these political pollsters. I've personally seen these surveys and they're pretty amusing. NASCAR dads, Soccer mom, joe six packs, etc.
It really has nothing to do with soccer or the van. That's just what people in that specific demographic like to do with their kid-hauler, and they target political (aka corruption) TV ads accordingly.

[rondocap]

The Boxster, regardless of year, is definitely a low production car compared to many, and I'm not sure that the older ones are really soccer mom material - they are definitely in the camp of enthusiasts.

I think we may have become spoiled with PDK/DSG and how good it has gotten recently. I drove a C55 AMG fairly recently - 5 speed auto. The response was really very bad in manual mode. I was quite surprised. It's great how far cars have come recently though, especially the 8 Speed autos in the BMWs.

[Nine8Six]

Originally Posted by Allen K. Littlefield

Gee 986, sure sure don't feel like a soccer mom driving my tip! Maybe because I am having too much fun??? Do you think denigrating you by calling you a name would make you run out an buy at TIP? You have fun driving a manual and a lot of us have fun driving a TIP. End of story.

AKL

Bah give him a break... he is just back from a $2,320 clutch change job, got stuck in heavy traffic, his knee, heal and wrist hurts bad, and then he saw this succer-mum freely passing in the emergency lane with her super aftermarket paddle'd steering wheel mimicking the revs of an F1 car with her lips

That, is enough to make anyone jealous believe me

[Muzzle of Bees]

I love mine. I drive very often in the manual mode though. Incidentally, Fifth Gear just did a story on the cayman pdk vs the standard. The pdk did very well against the standard. Neck and neck very often. It seemed it could simply be the driver and not the transmission.

[rondocap]

Do you mean the episode they did 4 years ago, or was there one more recently again?

Originally Posted by Muzzle of Bees

I love mine. I drive very often in the manual mode though. Incidentally, Fifth Gear just did a story on the cayman pdk vs the standard. The pdk did very well against the standard. Neck and neck very often. It seemed it could simply be the driver and not the transmission.

[Muzzle of Bees]

Originally Posted by rondocap

Do you mean the episode they did 4 years ago, or was there one more recently again?

I recorded it about a month ago and watched it recently.
I don't recall the car year or the year they showed the episode. I just remember taking away them comparing the transmissions.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by rondocap

I think we may have become spoiled with PDK/DSG and how good it has gotten recently. I drove a C55 AMG fairly recently - 5 speed auto. The response was really very bad in manual mode. I was quite surprised..

I have friends that only buy Mercs, a 30+ year tradition but I've yet to drive a a single modern Merc that I thought was remotely worth buying at full boat. That brand is the epitome of a brand having so many models that they can no longer maintain quality to the standards they were once known for. I'm not sure why Porsche gets all the abuse, there are far worse. And I don't if its just me but having a Merc just doesn't get the sort of attention it once did. In that respect Porsche has all other German brands beat....if that's important to the buyer. I just find it interesting that in the midst of all this mind-boggling over-production Porsche has still managed to hold onto a bit of that novelty. I can't remember how many time someone said "wow you have a Porsche". Whereas I've never heard that said to my friends that have Audis, Bimmers, Range Rovers, etc.

I like to tell my friends that if weren't for the Boxster I probably would have moved on away from Porsche long ago. My cars can't just be garage queens, I don't have the space or time for it. I need a car that can be driven year round, isn't going to leave me stranded, nor comes with costly engine rebuilds as a part of standard long haul ownership. The Boxster has checked all those boxes.

[southernstar]

Do your think it would be fun driving a current formula 1 car? Well, for the same reason that Porsche has made only the PDK available in the new GT3 - computers can shift and match revs more quickly and accurately than any human, they don't have manual transmissions either.

Don't get me wrong - I own and prefer a manual transmission. Ultimate lap times/performance don't matter to me and frankly, I have always considered the skill of being able to properly use a manual transmission, including double-clutching downshifts, etc. to be one of the things that defined being a good performance driver. I take pride in my abilities at matching revs and driving a manual transmission smoothly and quickly - that it is I and not a computer that is accurately blipping the throttle on downshifts. And even though this skill is clearly on the way to becoming a 'lost art', I suspect that I will always take pride in it.

I guess it is somewhat akin to the prevalence now of autotune for singers - they no longer need to sing on key as a computer can make the adjustments for them prior to the sound being amplified, or recorded. So, if perfect pitch no longer requires any skill, who cares if anyone has it? Some artists do. And some audiences. I, for one, would far rather listen to a recordning of Frank Sinatra, occasional errors and all, singing a song, than an auto-tuned and computer-corrected Michael Buble singing the same song. IMO, the former is true artistry - flubs and human foibles and all, whereas the latter is a homogenized and sterile imitation of artistry.

Now. does Micheal Buble enjoy singing before thousands of screaming and adoring fans without worrying about singing in tune? Count on it!

Brad

[rondocap]

I test drove an Boxster S with tiptronic today, 987. I was actually very surprised - it's a pretty good transmission and very sporty; in auto it held the gear when I was really on it, and it seemed to shift pretty well with the buttons. You have to time it correctly, but in general it was not as slow as I was fearing - actually pretty usable as a fun shifting transmission.

It was a 2005 S - would a base 2007 Cayman have the same transmission? Sporty and hold gears, etc?

[RBrummer]

I do! Several times a week

[Steveinsouthborough]

I've got an '00 Boxster S with Tiptronic, and love it. Sure, I would've preferred a full manual tranny, but I got the car from a very good friend for only $4000.00, regularly maintained by Porsche mechanics. At 121,000 miles, it runs like a champ.
I've seen 125mph indicated on the highway in 4th gear/5500rm, still pulling hard.

I ran a Carfax on it, and retail came bach at $10,790

[piper6909]

Absolutely, YES!

[azlvr]

Originally Posted by piper6909

Absolutely, YES!

Agreed! My thumb is faster and with less work than a manual. I don't use it on the track so don't need a manual. I stopped using a manual trans 30 years ago and have been happy with the choice ever since, so is my left leg.
I drive in manual mode 100% of the time.

[Finnegan]

I drove my brother's E46 M3 with an auto once and was shocked at how awful it was.