Faster and Cheaper than a 911

[wombat7]

I really think that since the Cayman is getting the rave reviews that it is Porsche is giong to have to do something to make the 997 really shine. I think this is going to pave the way for Porsche to bump up the displacement of the 911. I bet the 2007 or 2008 model will have either a 3.8 or 4.0 in it.

It is really sad that Porsche isn't going to come out with a clubsport version of the Cayman. It would easily be made into a total track monster. I'm sure that soon after its release, we will see many dedicated track Caymans.

If any of you have seen the new Motortrend, they say the same thing about the Cayman that Automobile does. I really think that this car is going to steal a lot of sales away from the 997 and we are going to see serious performance upgrades done to that car. Also I think that we are going to see the price of 996s and 997s fall even more quickly then they already are, which is good news for us poor college kids who are soon going to be not so poor college graduates

[tqtran]

I don't think the Caymen will steal sales away from 911 owners. Its like saying the 06 BMW Z4 coupe or the current Z3 M coupe will steal away sales from the M3. I think the Caymen will actually steal sales away from M3, Vette, NSX, etc.... other car maker owners.

Granted the Caymen is a better track car, but you won't see me trading in my new '05 GT3 for a Caymen.
Personally I think the additions of the Caymen and Panamera(4 door sedan) to the Porsche lineup will make Porsche more like BMW and Merc than steal away internal sales. Remember what the Cayenne did to X5 and ML sales?
Different cars for different target classes.

[wombat7]

While I don't think the Cayman's introduction will effect new 911 sales, I do think it will have a significant effect on used 911 sales. Not so much the older classice 911s up to 993s, but the 996 sales are going to be effected greatly. Who is going to want to buy a used 911, when you can get a new Cayman for relatively the same price and it will greatly outperform the 911.

[Perfectlap]

does the article say that the CaymanS is quicker than the 911 or the 997?
Big difference there,
that these magazines could be exploiting knowing that the average car enthusiast will just assume the 05 Cayman is already quicker than the 05 911.
I HIGLY doubt that the test driver would be allowed to produce a quicker time in the less expensive car and then disclose that data to the public.

The 911 is a car with a backseat. As long as that's the case it will be Porsche's best seller. The average 911 owner is not a young guy without a wife and kids and without a high paying job. The 911 is a compromise between a big checkbook and a family man looking for ponies and looking to realize a life long dream.
The 911 brand is powerful but Porsche knows that it can't continue to avoid the calls by purists forever.
A huge compliment to the Boxster. I can't recall the last time that a roadster was turned into coupe that could on performance become the flagship car of a legendary make.

[tqtran]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

I can't recall the last time that a roadster was turned into coupe that could on performance become the flagship car of a legendary make.

First Corvette in 1953 was a roadster. Its now Chevy's flagship car.

[wombat7]

Well... here we have the final answer as quoted from Excellence Magazine

“The ultimate measure of sports cars is Nürburgring lap times,” says Wahl. So how does the Cayman S stack up against the 997 Carrera? We put that question to Wolfgang Dürheimer. His response: “The Cayman S is eight seconds slower than the Carrera.” We’re confused, though, as Röhrl set a fast time of 7:59 in a Carrera S with 355 hp and the non-PASM Euro sport suspension — which would be only four seconds faster than the 8:03 lap time Dürheimer implies for the basic Carrera."

It seems that when put up against a basic 997 Carrera, the Cayman is only 4 seconds slower around the ring, but when put up against one with a Euro sport suspension, it is 8 seconds slower. I find this very interesting... 4 seconds is not a lot of time and for the $10K extra that you would pay for you basic C2, you could definately make the Cayman the superior car. Like I said this paves the way for the guys in Germany to put a 3.8 or 4.0 in an upcoming evolution of the car. Much like the Boxster S paved the way for the jump from 3.4 to 3.6 from 99 to 2000.

[Brucelee]

"While I don't think the Cayman's introduction will effect new 911 sales, I do think it will have a significant effect on used 911 sales. Not so much the older classice 911s up to 993s, but the 996 sales are going to be effected greatly. Who is going to want to buy a used 911, when you can get a new Cayman for relatively the same price and it will greatly outperform the 911."

I sell used 911s (a ton actually) and I predict that the Cayman will do nothing to the used 911 market (read 996) in the short run.

First off, the vast majority of my buyers want a Cab, not a coupe.

Secondly, a surprising number of them want and/or need a back seat. Yes, I know the back seat is kind of a joke but this comes up in conversation ALL THE TIME, ie, my son can fit back there!

Third-when I mention a Boxster to most of these buyers, I get a VERY negative reaction. In their minds, the Box is simply not an issue for them. I see the Cayman as still a Box and that is a good thing. But for my 911 buyers, the reaction is negative and almost visceral.

At least for the immediate future, I don't see a big movement from the 996 to a new Cayman.

In fact, I am going out on the limb here and say that the Cayman is a short term sales disappointment for Porsche. I believe MANY boxster owners do not want a coupe at all. I see very very few 911 owners moving downstream to a Cayman.

I could be wrong however, it is all speculation.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by wombat7

Well... here we have the final answer as quoted from Excellence Magazine

“The ultimate measure of sports cars is Nürburgring lap times,” says Wahl. So how does the Cayman S stack up against the 997 Carrera? We put that question to Wolfgang Dürheimer. His response: “The Cayman S is eight seconds slower than the Carrera.” We’re confused, though, as Röhrl set a fast time of 7:59 in a Carrera S with 355 hp and the non-PASM Euro sport suspension — which would be only four seconds faster than the 8:03 lap time Dürheimer implies for the basic Carrera."

It seems that when put up against a basic 997 Carrera, the Cayman is only 4 seconds slower around the ring, but when put up against one with a Euro sport suspension, it is 8 seconds slower. I find this very interesting... 4 seconds is not a lot of time and for the $10K extra that you would pay for you basic C2, you could definately make the Cayman the superior car. Like I said this paves the way for the guys in Germany to put a 3.8 or 4.0 in an upcoming evolution of the car. Much like the Boxster S paved the way for the jump from 3.4 to 3.6 from 99 to 2000.

4 seconds for only $10,000 is a HUGE gain. I'd have to see if both cars had the same rubber.