IMS Guardian Pre-order

[landrovered]

At least this will cut down on the amount of hand holding that goes on when the new Boxster owner inevitably learns of the frailties inherent in their new investment/toy.

So it is now...

Spend $400 for a warning light
Spend $800 and DIY
Spend a few grand and let Jake do it for you.
Spend nothing and drive your car knowing that all things in life are temporary and that the 105k on the odo is telling you to not sweat the little things.

The idea is good the "Hot line" is a bad idea, makes the normal service seem second rate although I can understand the profit motive.

[Steve Tinker]

I guessed that this is some form of vibration monitor as used by many maintenance engineers for diagnosing critical bearings on some (very) expensive machinery. It has been used for many years in preventative maintenance and is very cost affective when checking even slight anomolies in rotating machinery.
Of course, I could be wrong (again).
My question is will you still need the Guardian if you have already fitted the upgraded IMS assembly considering that no failures of the ceramic bearing have been reported by either Flat 6 or LN Engineering??

[san rensho]

Originally Posted by Steve Tinker

I guessed that this is some form of vibration monitor as used by many maintenance engineers for diagnosing critical bearings on some (very) expensive machinery. It has been used for many years in preventative maintenance and is very cost affective when checking even slight anomolies in rotating machinery.
Of course, I could be wrong (again).
My question is will you still need the Guardian if you have already fitted the upgraded IMS assembly considering that no failures of the ceramic bearing have been reported by either Flat 6 or LN Engineering??

It also probably has a sensor that senses cam timing. Variations in cam timing are also a sign the IMS is on its way out.

[Jake Raby]

Please PM your guesses to me and if you hit the nail on the head and you will be given a unit... Too bad you guys started guessing out loud.

With the diminishing values of the M96 powered cars, more and more people can't justify the expense of an IMSR..

Also, the IMSR costs a lot more than the bearing, don't forget that installation of the IMSR is a 12 hour job+. The procedure costs a minimum of 1500 bucks, even from the shops that are starving to death and doing the work cheaper than they should be (and generally half ass doing it) just to stay afloat. Charles and I should have employed minimum costs for doing these procedures to all dealers, because the price wars are taking away from the technology.

The IMS Guardian can be installed as a stand alone system in less than 1.5 hours as a DIY. The integration into the dash is seamless, you can't even tell the system is installed. The cst of the IMSG is exactly 389.00 for the DIY installer, no shop labor, inconvenience or hassles. The system provides instant sense of security for the cost of admission, plus 1.5 hours of install time with the DIY DVD that is included for free.

See this video on the IMS Guardian teaser.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35o5r1HUMuI

The system was primarily developed for early warnings of IMS failures, but it will also alert the driver of 10 more internal engine related failures that can be just as damaging as an IMSBF.

The system can bes used in parallel with an IMS Retrofit, in fact we are carrying out testing right now with one vehicle that has an IMSR with the LN Ceramic Bearing. we are not employing the system to monitor that IMS bearing, but more to collect data from the retrofitted engine concerning operational characteristics of the system.

Don't look at the cost of the IMS bearinga nd the cost of the IMS Guardian as a comparative. Look more at the fact that the IMS Guardian retails for 389.95 and can be installed as a DIY in less than 1.5 hours with only a Leatherman multi-tool and one adjustable wrench. The system is that simple, I can now install one start to finish in 30 minutes flat, try that with an IMSR.

If you guys want to play the guessing game like we did on Rennlist, we can do that.. Delete your guesses here and PM them to me. Anyone who guesses correct will get a free system as long as the guess is PM'd to us. We will let the winners know in late July when we unveil the system in a huge ad campaign. Excellence will be doing a Tech Forum on the technology very soon, but we haven't even divulged to them how it works!

Oh, and you won't even find anything about this on our website. I have been trying to perfect it for 3 years and we are finally done.

As far as the Hotline goes: The purchase of the Hotline gives the driver of the IMSG equipped vehicle a lifeline directly to Flat 6 Innovations 24-7/365. Guess who answers that line? Me. Thats priceless when one needs it on the side of the road at 0300 on a Sunday with zero help. Those who do not purchase the hotline will have a reference card that will tell them what should occur if they receive an IMS Alert. All units will be serialized for ID and authenticity, the Hotline serialized units will have a door jamb decal with the hotline phone number and a unique serial number, without that unique serial number we will not offer assistance if an IMS Alert occurs, the reference card would be utilized for this.

Lots has gone into EVERY aspect of this, making it simple and effective with seamless integration into the car was a royal ******************** to carry out.

[JoeFromPA]

Do we have any type of incidence or prevalence data on failure rates? We're talking about motors that are well aged at this point. You can weigh $400 against the likelihood of failure with that data and make an informed decision - without true failure data, we have no idea if this is a worthwhile investment. The online community tends to amplify problem incidence as well...

If this has happened to 3-5% of 1999 cars, I wouldn't consider it a worthwhile investment at a 20 to 1 hedge. If it's 20%, then mebbe.

[Jake Raby]

LOL- imagine trying to sell a used car w/ this IMSG doo-dad thing-a-majig whatyamacallit button in the dash.

Yep, it will be a selling point, just like an IMSR. It will automatically build the character of any car it is functioning on, because the engine is known to be operating safely and is being constantly monitored.

I probably feel more at ease w/ curb feelers installed on car.

Then buy a set.

Anyhow, just curious:

What's the transferable warranty on ISMG? Seems it should comes w/ a lifetime one, right?

Fully transferrable. Just re-register the serial number of the unit in your name as the purchaser and assume all the incentives. We are doing this so the IMSG does increase the value of vehicles it is installed into.

What's the "warning" duration?

It is continually visual and audible until the system is disarmed buy the driver manually.

What's the data logging capabilities?

Zero. This is not a data logging system. This is a pre-warning system.

What happens if engine implodes and IMSG doens't go off? Hmmmm... customer gets a free engine of their choice, right?

Pay attention. If a customer who buys the system directly from Flat 6 experiences an engine failure with the system employed and follows the procedures set forth by us they will receive a credit toward one of our engine solutions to equal 150% of the purchase price. This goes toward services offered by Flat Six Innovations only.

No questions asked.

Why an "extra" $30 beans for "hotline"? Should be included in core price otherwise, whats the BFD?

Thats what it cost to have the ability to link directly to me when you are on the side of the road with an IMS Alert and you are unsure of what to do, 24-7/365. Support at that level isn't free, but those who do not opt for the IMS Alert Hotline will still get free email and forum support.

What happens when engine implodes w/ IMSR and ISMG? Presume customer becomes SOL?

The 150% credit would still be applied toward what ever means of action is required as long as the system was purchased from Flat 6 Innovations directly, the owner was registered with a matching unit serial number.

How will this interfere with deer whistlers I bought from cover of JCWhitney last month????

If the IMS Alert audible alarm is sounding, you won't have any deer for a mile around your car. It is loud and gets attention.

Need steak to accompany sizzle . . . . . . . . . . . .

Nice sarcastic post. Here I was expecting people to appreciate what we have created. I find it funny that on Rennlist the thread has gone for 8 weeks with 28+ pages, 415 replies and over 18,000 views and not a single individual made these kinds of negative comments. Noted.

Remember, you don't have to buy one.

[Jake Raby]

Did I get this right? You pay $400 for a warning system which when it goes off (and who knows when or why) it convinces you to pay $2,000 to repair a failure that hasn't yet happened?

Perhaps you fail to realize that when a failure occurs the collateral damage exceeds what can be repaired without a complete engine disassembly or replacement?

With the number of people who are absolutely unwilling to electively replace their IMS Bearing until it shows signs of failure this system allows them to procrastinate as long as possible while they are afforded a sense of security, both visually and audibly.

This is an IMS Bearing that is not caught soon enough in the failure process.

The failure process is made up of four stages of bearing degradtion and ultimately failure. Collateral damage created by the lack of IMS support and alignment is more damaging to the engine than thew actual IMS bearing failure.

This bearing is at Stage 3 failure. It was caught in time and was extracted from the engine and replaced with an IMSR procedure. This person was lucky because the engine had a noise and a release of oil that was noted before the bearing completely fused together, seized and then snapped. Note the wear materials inside this bearing, it did not lose any balls or other major pieces at the time it was extracted, but it only had miles of use left in it before it failed completely.

The owner of the car is still driving it today.

So the key to being able to save an engine withoput complete replacement is advanced warning. Doing so enables the bearing to be extracted and replaced easily with no collateral damage occurring.

Here are some samples of collateral damage that occurred when the IMS bearing failed, valve timing was compromised and components began to collide with one another, stemming from some form of IMS related incident.




What people do not realize is once you hear a noise, notice a symptom or actually grasp the fact that something is happenning to you, the engine is often times past the point where it can be saved without complete disassembly and complete reconstruction.

Put simply: Once the full failure occurs, you don't have enough of an engine left to repair.

[thstone]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

Perhaps you fail to realize that when a failure occurs the collateral damage exceeds what can be repaired without a complete engine disassembly or replacement?

+1 for being a nice guy in response to my sarcasm.

Certainly, I understand the implications of a failed IMS. I still say that the IMS failure rate is 2%-3% and thus worrying about the IMS is over-hyped.

I replaced my clutch two weeks ago and didn't touch the IMS. With 94,000 miles, there are 20 other things that are just as likely to fail in the engine as the IMS. What about those? Where is the cam tensionor guide failure detector? And the cam chain failure detector? And the... well, you get the idea.

[Jake Raby]

+1 for being a nice guy in response to my sarcasm.

That was difficult to do. I have worked my ass off on this project over the past 6 months and its been in the works for 3 solid years. Making this work and making it fit the vehicle so seamlessly has been very difficult. Making the system simple while maintaining effectiveness was the biggest challenge. I take this seriously, else my ass wouldn't be here at 0140 AM still working on the supplemental items related to the system. Thats an 18 hour day for me. The sarcasm pissed me off, but so be it. Doing things outside the box breeds skepticism and sarcasm.

Certainly, I understand the implications of a failed IMS. I still say that the IMS failure rate is 2%-3% and thus worrying about the IMS is over-hyped.

The people who have experienced the failure would disagree with you. I am happy that you don't believe that you and your car will ever be in that 2-3% that you have stated. The lady that just sold her car today for 2750 bucks knew about this problem, didn't take action and ended up in your "2-3%" category. She didn't think that it could happen to her. See the attached pics of her oil sump plate.. See that little remnant? Thats all thats left of an IMS ball bearing.

I replaced my clutch two weeks ago and didn't touch the IMS. With 94,000 miles, there are 20 other things that are just as likely to fail in the engine as the IMS. What about those?

Absolutely.. In fact the actual number is 21 things and thats just what we have found as of today.

Where is the tension guide failure detector? And the cam chain failure detector? And the... well, you get the idea

Which cam chain, you have at least 3 of them and could have 5. They have a minimum of 44 links on them and could have as many as 136, which one will fail first?

The IMSG has the ability to detect 10 other modes of failure, all of which are significant and if caught in time the majority of them can be repaired before the engine experiences collateral damage.

The one thing that people call us about most, other than having an actual engine failure, is the ability to add a sense of security to their vehicle. Most of these people do not understand mechanical workings and they believe that a crystal ball exists here. We can't give them any sense of security without invasive procedures unless the IMSG is employed.

I hope you don't have any engine issues, but I will say that one of our biggest critics who believed much like you do had an experience last year that cost him an engine and his Porsche, because he could not afford to repair it. That person fought us tooth and nail for 4 solid years and then all of a sudden he disappeared and I'll be damned if the guy that bought his car didn't call us up to tell us the news- he actually found it funny because the guy admitted to him what he had been saying. He got a smoking deal on the car, I built him a new engine and lets just say that one went full circle.

I guess that Karma had a bit of a problem with him for some reason. He found out real quick that being in that "2-3%" really sucks. Thats the beautiful thing about America. I have the ability to design this system and sell it on the free market and you have the ability to doubt everything I say and express that to me. Neither one of us has to give a damn about what the other one thinks, it is truly awesome.

Okay, make that 0200 now.. I have to get some sleep, I have an engine to blow up on purpose tomorrow while under the watchful eye of the IMSG and I can't wait!

[keithl]

If this thing works like it's supposed to, it seems like a great innovative product. Not sure why some are ********************in. Pushing the button every time you start car seems a little monotonous though, I would prefer something automatic.