Am I nuts to consider a Boxster?

[bullwinkle]

New here. Nice Forum. I particularly appreciate the civil and informative tone.

That said, I have been considering buying a used Honda S2000. I was at a dealer that had one and had a Boxster, so I drove both. And the Boxster was really speaking to me.

Since I have one kid in college and am soon to have another, I started looking around to see what owners thought about reliability, costs, etc.

So having read all the horror stories about IMS and RMS failures I thought I would ask for a reality check: Am I nuts for considering a Boxster in the same breath as an S2000.

I presently drive an Acura RSX-type S. So the S2000 type of driving (high revs to go fast) is nothing new to me. These cars live to dart in and out of traffic at 6500 RPM, and I am OK with that. SImilarly, I am very comfortable with the ride and handling of the S2000. And it even has the same seats and the same transmission.

From a reliability and service standpoint, it's a Honda. While not bulletproof, they are very predictable. My Acura has 110,000 miles on it. It is on it's second set of brakes and third set of tires. Still has the original Clutch, Cv joints, Struts, exhaust, etc. Still Revs to 8,250 --rev limiter--with ease. The only major thing that ever went wrong is that the Airbag computer failed at about 70,000. That was a $900 part. Acura paid for it--though I paid to install it, which with an oil and filter (Oil, Air, Pollen, etc) change cost a total of $150. The only unusual thing about the RSX is it eats left side headlights at the rate of about 1 every 15,000 miles or so.

With the S2000, I was expecting that my costs for tires would go up, and that my mileage would drop a little bit (I average about 29 in the RSX). I also expect that the S2000 would be a bit louder (the RSX is not quiet).

But I would never think to buy an extended warranty for any Honda-Acura, or worry about anything remotely similar to an RMS or IMS failures. Those things just don't happen to Hondas.

But the S2000 does not talk to me like a Boxster does. And I have always wanted a Porsche.

One more thing: If I get either an S2000 or a Boxster, it would be my daily driver, getting about 1,200 miles a month of suburban/country driving for about 9 months a year. I would keep the RSX as my "inclement weather" car.

SO I have a couple of questions for the group:

My price range seems to buy either a 2004 vintage s2000 or a 2002 vintage Boxster around these parts. Which would you go for?

Is there an extended warranty or insurance policy that would cover an IMS or RMS? How much do they cost and who sells them?

Is the boxster so risky that I would be better off looking at something like a 1980s vintage 911SC or 911 Carerra, which seem to be more reliable?

Thanks for the input.

[BoxsterS21]

If you are looking for performance, the question is a boxster or S2000. If you want to beat them both get a Boxster S. I love mine.

It is a Porsche so repairs can get costly. Do your research before buying. Look for all of the quirks.

I have an '02 Boxster S. I love it. I bought it 6 months ago. It has been great. Thank god I bought the extended warrenty for it. Or I would be in a world of hurt. 5500.00 in repair bills paid for by the Warrenty company. I bought the Warrenty for 4000.00 I would say that it has been a great buy. I still have at least 2 years and 50 thousand miles left on it. The company is Century. Look into it. The internals are all covered. The dealership added it into my loan for the car and I am very glad that I have it.

My buddy has an S2000, It is quick. The S walks all over it, but He definately has the Honda Reliability. I love driving that car up to 9000 RPM. But you have to wait until 6000 RPM to feel any power. The Boxster has it right off the bat. Especially the S. He can keep up with me a bit on the track, but his rear end slides out very easily. He can't push it as fast on the track. If he ever turbos it though, I will eat his exhaust everytime we take off.


Honda S2000 is a great car, but there is nothing like driving that Porsche.


Happy Hunting. :dance:

[BoxsterS21]

You are also asking the wrong forum if you are nuts to buy a Boxster. We are all NUTS for the Boxster, we all love them.


When you get the Boxster venom in your blood, it tends to stay very loyal.

I hooked my buddy in one test drive. Now he wants one.

Just look around and feel it out.

Also, Perks of driving a Porsche. They let you test drive almost everything.

[Topless]

Choose the one you like. They are both great cars. If either has been well cared for it will serve you well.

Reports of major engine failure with the Porsche are all over the internet but represent less than 1/10th of 1% of cars built. Put in perspective your odds are pretty good. My 11 yr old Boxster is nearly as reliable as my fleet of Toyotas.

[Perfectlap]

The older 911's require way more maintenance than a Boxster which is way more reliable. Those old cars were 'hand made', the Boxster and new Carrera were Japan style assembly line cars. If something goes wrong with either the costs are not cheap but way more costly with the old cars. Also, Boxsters are more "water tight" than old Porsches on build. You're not coming home to another mysterious puddle under your car or something coming loose under the hood.

You have think about it within the Porsche world. The Boxsters/Cayman is the most reliable option from a used stand point. Older Porsches are not meant to be driven high miles in all types of weather unless you can wrench your own cars. The Boxster is as close to a low maintenance as your going to get.

Now the S2000 is a whole other ball game but the'yre generic. If you want more character you're going to have to take on some risk with a Porsche. No way around it. The risk goes up the more you drive it and it sounds like you'll be doing plenty. But a modern Porsche can handle it just be prepared to pay for repairs.
The maintenance aspect isn't so bad, not worlds different than a Honda.
Personally I don't think a Boxster is a good daily driver unless you live in a easy climate with nice roads and little traffic.

unrelated, the S2000s race against the base Boxster in my local autocross clubs. The BoxsterS and the second gen Boxsters are in the class above with the standard 3.6 Carreras. I've matched or beaten many standard Carreras. I'm sure the 3.4 Boxster would have an even easier time of it.

[mylamb]

bullwinkle

That's a lot of questions! All of the answers (opinions) can be found on this forum by searching many of the keywords that are in your post. I will give you my opinion, which you should not take as fact.

You are unlikely to experience such little maintenance on a Boxster as you did on your RSX. A set of high quality rear tires will last you at least 10,000, but probably no more than 20,000 miles. Be ready. It's not fun once the tires are past their wear indicators! You could easily have the same type of repair history on a 986 as you did on your RSX, or you could have a repair history like that on a semi-annual basis. There is no guide for you on this one. Just be prepared.

At 7 years of age, you will find a warranty difficult. Many warranty companies have a cut off of 5 years of age at the time of purchase. Porsche will not CPO a 2002 today. They may, however, sell you an aftermarket warranty at your dealership. There are many warranty stories on this forum (search 'warranty.') Some are awesome & confidence inspiring. Many are not. Porsche's OEM warranty on cars with less than the maximum age/mileage seems to be great, however, and they tend to replace whatever breaks without question. You would be looking at a 2005 (987) car at the oldest, though, and they are definitely more expensive (initially) than a 2002. Maybe that's out of your $$$ range?

IMO an S2000 & a Box are only similar by the facts that they are 2 seat convertibles, and (unmodified) they should produce "similar" lap times on a track. One has a classic look, the other doesn't. One has an insanely buzzy, cacophonous motor, the other was once described by Car & Driver magazine as "sounding like God's own organ music," which it does! You will have to drive them both (drive different ones too - try at least 2 or 3 of each - why not?) Many S2000 have been slightly tuned & tweaked so one may be stock and the other may have belonged to a boy racer who doesn't mind bleeding eardrums or porridge for kidneys. To put it simply, I drove both, have had plenty of service woes, and still agree that I didn't want an S2000. I would not rule out entertaining an eventual replacement, but it just seems like that car hasn't shown up on my radar yet. The 370Z is as close as anything has come (but a CPO Cayman S is more appealing.)

Do as much research as you can on this forum & buy a few Porsche magazines. There are numerous articles on Boxsters. Most of the posters will respond to your questions right away if it hasn't already been answered often. Before you make the purchase, spend a good month on the forum if you can. This will help you to know what to look for and the proper procedure to purchasing a pre-owned Boxster.

[QUOTE=bullwinkle]Since I have one kid in college and am soon to have another, I started looking around to see what owners thought about reliability, costs, etc.QUOTE]

Because of this statement alone, I say wait. Don't get the Boxster, unless you can pay cash, and have the college savings accounts fully funded. I am in the minority here with this opinion, but this is what I would (have) do (done).

[Perfectlap]

p.s.
my last car was a Miata with a ton of mods (should have never sold that car...grr). I was planning on moving into the S2000 because I wasn't crazy about the size of the Miata for highway driving. I'm pretty sure that if I had gone with the S2000 I never would have switched to the BoxsterS, which would have been very sad!
btw, waiting will only help because the prices of ALL used cars is going to fall quicker than ever. The resale market is so bad that I don't think selling my car is worth it. With the money I'll get I simply will not be able to replace it with something that will provide the same level of gratifcation. Which makes me think I need to average in with a four wheel drive Carrera at some point. If I'm a loser as a seller maybe I can be a winner as a buyer on Porsche #2.

[E Kaplan]

I purchased my 2000 base Boxster about 15 months ago. It is not my DD, but I have put about 11,000 miles on the car (currently at 45,000) and have had absolutely no problems. Nothing. Very reliable and alot of fun. Even though the car is not an "S" , it is fast when you get about 4,000 rpm's.

[bullwinkle]

Thanks to all of you.

As to why an s2000 or a Boxster, one of you nailed it with the two-seat convertible remark. I would only add that I take driving seriously, and I do not fit in a Miata.

What intrigues me is that the S2000 and the Boxster offer such different experiences. At this point I am leaning Boxster if I can find the right one, because it would be so different from the RSX.

Originally Posted by bullwinkle

and I do not fit in a Miata.

Bullwinkle, also consider the 987 (MY 2005 and newer) then, since this has more leg and head room vs. the 986.

Having 2 trunks should be an advantage over the Honda too.

Look at the classified section of the Chicago PCA (www.pca-chicago.org/scene/SceneJune09.pdf). There was a 2007 987S (tip tranny) listed for $35 IIRC.

[mikefocke]

In my youth, I drove Alfa Roadsters and a Porsche 914. Then I settled down, bought a BMW 2002, got married and had children.

After the house was paid for, the college bills paid, and the retirement secure, then, and only then, did I buy a Boxster.

Looking, I drove every roadster imaginable. Corvette, Jag, Honda, BMW, other P-cars etc.

My impression of the Honda was that I felt confined in the cockpit (I was 6" 230 at the time) and didn't like the buzz of the engine. It also lacked trunk space for the trip to the beach/mountains with my wife I had envisioned.

I wasn't pro-Porsche as my 914 experience was not good in the quality of car or dealer service areas.

My first drive in a Boxster had me inside of 10 minutes. I drove it to an interstate, up to the next exit, dropped the top, drove back and began negotiating hard. Lots of room in the cockpit, luggage space fore and aft, and would pull from 1k easily. Quiet cruiser. Enough car so that it was better than I was a driver.

I bought a '99 base Boxster. 2.5 and 4 months later totaled it through inattention ...actually I was busy admiring another Boxster in a parking lot by the side of the road. When I got the insurance settlement, I immediately set out to replace the car (and since the settlement was more than I had paid for the car and it was a model year later, I decided to sample the S model). I found an '01 S, got a Pre-Purchase Inspection and bought it. I could have had the 3 years more extended warranty and paid $3k or the seller could turn in her warranty, get a refund and charge me $3k less. I'm one of those people who self insures because I don't like the odds of doing better on an insurance policy when its cost has to cover so many selling and administrative expenses (and payout from such policies averages ~20%). I declined the warranty. Now 4+ years later, I came out way ahead. In unscheduled maintenance, my costs have been less than $15 a month on average and the car has never left me stranded. (I had no repairs at all on my first Boxster in 4 months of use as a daily driver.) My second isn't a daily driver any more simply because on the average day I don't drive a car. But my wife doesn't have to ask me twice to go to the store and she knows I'll take the longest way possible. I even take the trash to the dump in it (and I have a CRV I could do it in but...). I love the car.

Both my cars were 2 owner cars when I bought them. Both I knew the maintenance history from paper records the owners had.

I buy the best tires and battery and such for the car. Have 15k on the rear tires and can see another 3-4k before I have to replace them but, when I do, that will be ~$550 for the rears alone. I could buy cheaper tires but I want the best between me and the road and I can afford them. I do perhaps 1/2 of the maintenance on the car, 1/3 at some random mechanic's place that has a lift and the dealer sees the car every 2-3 years.

I could have bought newer cars, never felt the need to. I can have 98.3% of the fun for well less than 1/2 the price buying used.

Porsche people are fun people and I've been to local get togethers and national ones. I don't track or AX.

Do some cars fail..yes. P-cars do too. But I could tell you the story of my unreliable rust bucket Honda Civic. You hear lots from those whose cars failed, and I think louder because of the intensity of feelings we have for the car.

In this uncertain economic climate, if I were in your shoes (having to be concerned over a repair bill, as you said) I'd buy neither car. I'd hunker down and save my money and drive the car I had. Once the college bills have been paid, then give yourself the treat. But I'm a conservative with money sort and that may not suit you.

Whatever you do, I hope you enjoy the result.

You may find this site helpful

[Dave S.]

I looked at an S2000, Boxster S and a 3.0L BMW Z4. All were pretty nice cars and I drove them all back to back from dealerships right next door to each other.
My impressions of the S2000 almost immediately dropped it from the possible choices as I drove it right after driving a Boxster. The S2000 ride was very harsh on rough roads and I felt like if I gained a couple more pounds I wouldn't fit in it anymore (6'1" 210lbs). The motor was kind of fun over 6,000 rpm , but was lifeless below 6,000 rpm and who drives like that all the time?
I think your right that the S2000 will ultimately be more reliable and cheaper to own in the long run, but for me it came down to a choice between the BMW Z4 3.0L and a Boxster S.
I ended up getting a 2003 Boxster S with 14,400 miles on it last October and I have no regrets. My other cars include a Lexus and Toyota so I get the whole reliability thing, but driving the Porsche...there is no substitute.

Dave S.

[CRCGuy]

I currently have a MY08 S2000. The shifter is perfect, build quality is perfect, ergonomics perfect, and I have no doubt it will go a couple of hundred thousand miles without needing a single repair. But I've had it 8 months and am going to switch to a Boxster S. The first 3-4 months it was a blast to drive...but the high revving, raw nature wore on me. Driving on the interstate even for 30mins sucks. The engine note is not beautiful---one might say harsh at high RPMs. And the S2000 does have a dark side as any owner will tell you. I lost the back end suddenly once in a decreasing radius turn that blew all my confidence in the car--stability control just barely saved my butt. it was not fun. It did not break progressively---was sudden (snap oversteer). Beware of pre-stability control (VSA) models since it's up to your fantastic driving skills (or a tree) to keep you from going over a cliff. The car was made to enjoy on a track, not mountain twisties. and buy lots of ear plugs.

The Boxster S (987) I test drove was much more balanced, seems to break at the limit progressively and predictably, has a heavenly exhaust/engine note and is 100x more fun to drive in my opinion. I agree with comments to go for 987 vs 986. Go for the S. Life is short. At the end of the day, what is a few thousand bucks for the difference? So what if it needs some repairs? One day you will be 6ft underground or in a vase on someone's mantle. That's it--game over. As my grandfather said before he died--buy the best, because you'll always be happy with it. it's true. Money is no object. If you want something bad enough, you will find a way to pay for it (maybe by foregoing something else). For me, the 987S is that thing.

Just my $0.02

[Gougoushu]

I loved my '02 RSX base model -- great looks, fun to drive, 7000 miles with $0 in repairs, awesome website [clubrsx.com]. But I let it go after just one year after I drove a few 986 Boxsters. The Boxster is superior in only one way, but it's a big one: fun.

Unfortunately it's been very hard to find a repair shop that doesn't want to charge extra for it being a Porsche. With kids in school, control costs by doing your own repairs with help from the many Boxster websites; having the RSX on hand will allow you to take your time doing them. :dance:

[GT_YellowJacket]

I'd like to give a whole-hearted vote for the Boxster (get an S please) and make a correction to mylamb's post. You don't need to be looking '05 or newer to get CPO.

You can get a CPO Boxster from a Porsche dealer probably near your price range. Just a month ago, I picked up a low mileage CPO '03 Boxster S for decent price (especially compared to my local market). Got exactly the year, color, and options I wanted. Just be willing to shop around and travel to a less expensive market to pick up your car. Because I have the warranty, I already had a few picky things repaired, and Porsche replaced entire assemblies without question.

[mylamb]

Right - my apologies - I was thinking the original 48 mos based on the factory warranty. CPO qualification is indeed up to 6 years old (up to 100K miles total.)

[clickman]

Originally Posted by Topless

Reports of major engine failure with the Porsche are all over the internet but represent less than 1/10th of 1% of cars built.

I would love to believe that. How did you arrive at that statistic?

[mts]

Originally Posted by CRCGuy

I currently have a MY08 S2000. The shifter is perfect, build quality is perfect, ergonomics perfect, and I have no doubt it will go a couple of hundred thousand miles without needing a single repair. But I've had it 8 months and am going to switch to a Boxster S. The first 3-4 months it was a blast to drive...but the high revving, raw nature wore on me. Driving on the interstate even for 30mins sucks. The engine note is not beautiful---one might say harsh at high RPMs. And the S2000 does have a dark side as any owner will tell you. I lost the back end suddenly once in a decreasing radius turn that blew all my confidence in the car--stability control just barely saved my butt. it was not fun. It did not break progressively---was sudden (snap oversteer). Beware of pre-stability control (VSA) models since it's up to your fantastic driving skills (or a tree) to keep you from going over a cliff. The car was made to enjoy on a track, not mountain twisties. and buy lots of ear plugs.

I agree with this post. I had a 2005 S2000 and got rid of it for a 2004 Boxster S and could not be more pleased. Don't get me wrong I thought the S2000 was a fantastic car though I can honestly say I wouldn't own one again with out VSA (MY 2006-on).

The Boxster S is just a different experience for me and I really enjoy it a lot more than the S2000, especially for mostly street driving.

All that being said, and even though I've not had 1 minute of problems with my Porsche, I am well aware of the fact that there will be more repairs needed to the Boxster S than the S2000 probably 95 times out of 100. Along with that, they will be more costly when they are needed.

I'm lucky enough to have the ability to cover those higher costs if they happen. However, if I had any real concerns in that area I would get the S2000.

[schnellman]

In my humble opinion, if you test drive a Porsche and the question is still an intellectual one, maybe you should go with the Honda. Porsche ownership isn't dollars and cents, it's your gut and your senses. Although my Boxster has not been a money pit, routine maintenance and parts are expensive and the price of admission. The car has to pay you back in more ways than transportation. I've owned and driven Porsches for over 25 years and if it were a balance sheet decision, I'd be driving something else. I just love Dr Porsche's cars.