purchase choice - 2003 S or 2005 2.7?

[peakpro]

Not to sound negative but I am having a hell of a time getting close to any of the recommended price ranges for cars mentioned in this thread.

I have been looking mostly at CPO'd cars from dealers. But my recent experience with three dealers suggest that the price ranges people are giving for 986s and 987 are not obtainable. At least not from a dealer. WHen I suggest to them that their prices are too high and make a counter offer they give me a line that they are having a great month and that is the best they can do. In a couple of cases I am looking at cars that have been on their lots at least 4-5 months!

When I check out privite sellers on online sites I find very few in my area. And those that I find also have the cars listed at high prices. Mid 30's for 03-04 986s.

Ideas?

[Sloan]

I agree with you peakpro, and wonder when mikefocke says there are "hundreds for sale", where he is looking. In a literal sense he may be correct, but add in my year restrictions, color choices, price & milegage preferences, and there are only a handful. The link provided by husker boxster is the first sub-$40k 987S I recall seeing, and that is from a private seller. While I'm o.k. with that in theory, in practice, interest rates are much higher when making a private purchase, and I'm already pre-approved at a great rate for a purchase from a dealer - over the life of the financing, the rate difference comes close to equalizing the higher initial price when buying from a dealer, and some would argue there is some greater peace of mind with a dealer purchase, particularly if I could find a CPO (which does not seem likely).

987 prices are much (much!) higher - another reason the 2003 or 2004 S is looking so appealing.

[fatmike]

I paid $10K under your "target" for my 986S. 11K miles. Litronics, PSM, rain sensing wipers, rear compartment, windstops, etc. Flawless exterior, barely even a mark on the skid plate underneath...

Private seller w/tail-end of a warranty.

Keep looking.






-

[racer_d]

Don't rush your purchase. Take your time. Test drive as many local ones as you can. Even if you don't intend on buying, it will allow you to filter out 1) Options you don't like or need - like maybe you really do like/want sport seats, or 18" wheels, or HIDs or... 2) Lets you see how Boxster owners maintain their cars (some do it well, some not so well) 3) Lets you see what wears out (interior wise) on the car 4) Will let you see how different models/options make the cars perform.

From recollection,
2005 2.7 has 240-245hp
2003 S has 258 hp

Thats only a 13-18hp difference.. Not much. Yes, the 3.2S should have more torque, which is nice, and it may weigh 100lbs or so less, but since you don't intend on tracking the car, the actual, "real world" performance difference may be immaterial.

You may also find, in your testing, that the interior of one model is preferred over the other which could sway your purchase.

As mentioned, yes, there are litterally hundreds of Boxsters on the market. Remember, more than 200,000 have been built and about 1/2 have come to the us. Sure, you may struggle to find a particular year, but the search can be nearly as much fun as the acqusition.

Be adventurous. Once you decide on the Model/year you want, look outside just South Florida, or Florida.. maybe the perfect one is sitting in Arizona, or Colorado. Traveling to buy a "new" car can be quite fun too.

Not to rain on all "550 Anniversary" fans, but it seems to me, over the years, the only Porsches that seem to "gain in value" in 20 years are those who have a genuine performance advantage vs the regular model.. and usually have a lighterweight (ie RSA, Clubsport, RS type models).

At this point in time, I would not buy ANY boxster with thoughts of value appreciation.

[mikefocke]

When I want to know what a reasonable price will be for a car (a question I get asked perhaps every other day as people read my guide to buying a Boxster) I immediately do the following...

I go to www.cars.com (only because it is both national and because it has a good search engine that allows me to locate only a specific model year).

I use their advanced search of used cars.

I pick my Porsche Boxster and model year and add that I want to see "all" miles from my zip code. I want to see the pricing all over the country to get the largest sample.

When I do that, I could get well over a thousand Boxsters of all model years or generally 100+ of any given year. So when I say there are hundreds available, there are many hundreds because cars.com is only one of the advertising sites, there must be a dozen others and, while there is some duplication, there are cars unique to each site.

So yes there are hundreds of Boxsters out there for sale right now.

I then throw out the 5 highest and the 5 lowest prices. That leaves me with a middle range...it omits the cars with the halo effect (its mine so it must be worth more), those where the dealer has too much invested in the car, and those with some history problem such that they are being dumped.

Once I figure out the mid range, I look at where a specific car is located. The prices posted are asking prices. But who pays asking price? You expect a bigger discount during a time when there will be no local buyers for convertibles because the weather is just too cold. But you always expect some discount...say 5 to 10% lower than asking. 15% in the winter unless that has already been priced in.

Porsche cars are ones most people own until their circumstances change. They get married, get divorced, have kids, lose their job, get deployed, etc. So there are always more cars for sale than other makes. Both of mine were 2-owner-before-me cars with the average ownership being 18 months. Both had been owned in multiple states. Both have been lots of fun and few problems.

One I bought in the first blush of spring. One I first saw when it was covered with snow and salt and I had to move the snow shovel to even sit in the passenger seat. Guess which one I got the better deal on.

I recommend stopping someone who owns one and asking them if they know of any cars or local sources. Look in the local classifieds or craigslist.org. Drive a few. Then decide.

[mikefocke]

There is a guy with a national reputation for his knowledge of Boxsters in Florida who is very wired into the scene and who has a business which, among other things, does an excellent PPI. He does everything from preparing a racing Boxster to producing products for Boxsters to conducting tech training sessions at national Boxster get-togethers.

Pedros PPIs

I highly recommend him based on reports from people who have used him. He is very well known on PPBB , another Boxster forum.

Get in touch, let him know what you are looking for and then use him for the PPI. He may know of a car that is just right. The site has a picture of his forms so you can see the type of inspections he does.

[Sloan]

TO: mikefocke. I appreciate your thoughtful responses, and I already did as you advised and expanded my search. I stand corrected, in that in a literal sense there are 'hundreds' of Boxsters for sale, however when I narrow back down to ones I would actually want, not so many. I think I have a decent idea of the price ranges - I've been searching for long enough now that I have a sense of what is 'right', the possible exception being the value of some of the more obscure options, and whether the 2004 550 special editions are worth the premium many of their sellers seem to think they should command.

Thank you as well for the information on Pedro's garage. He is very local to me, so that could be an excellent resource.

I am hoping to get out to look at at least two cars this coming weekend - the 2003 S with about 20k miles, 18" wheels w/ NEW tires, Tiptronic & Bose (but no PSM) that I mentioned a few posts ago, and a 2004 base with 8k, Bose, Tip. (again, no PSM) that looks absolutely spotless. Asking for the 2003 S is 32.5 (I got the sense they would take $30k) and asking for the 2004 is $28.6k. I will report back on my findings if I make it up to see both of them.

[hjkim550]

Originally Posted by racer_d

Not to rain on all "550 Anniversary" fans, but it seems to me, over the years, the only Porsches that seem to "gain in value" in 20 years are those who have a genuine performance advantage vs the regular model.. and usually have a lighterweight (ie RSA, Clubsport, RS type models).

At this point in time, I would not buy ANY boxster with thoughts of value appreciation.

I agree racer_d,

I do not think that my 550 Anniversary will hold its value any more than any other 04 Boxster S. As you know, over a thousand of these were sold in the US in 2004, out of a production run of 1953. (not a very limited limited edition ) The difference between the stock Boxster S and the 550 Anniversary is so miniscule. 6 HP difference, spacers for a wider stance, short shifter and lowered ride height. The main reason why I bought mine was due to meticulous maintenance and right price.

Sloan..... looks like you are getting excellent cars for very nice prices. You know what I paid for mine. Make your purchase, get out there and post some pictures.

[mdex]

A little late to the thread, but some of my thoughts;

-You are allways best to buy the newest car you can afford in good condition.
-In the real world the base boxster (espesially the 987) is very quick and unless your a hp junkie you will not feel let down
-Porsche never releases a worse version of a car, and the 987 is a step forward over the 986 in all areas

-all that said I would never trade my 986 's' for a base 987, but I am a track junkie and have done a lot of work to my car....

Marc

[Sloan]

Thank you all for your input. Let me briefly respond to a few specific comments (in no particular order).

Super66 - I did not mean to say the G35 and 987 interiors looked the same, only that, to my eye, the 986 felt/looked more Porsche, the 987 trending more to the Japanese style - not that there is anything inherently wrong with that, just that my preference was perhaps more 'old school'.

mikefocke - you have excellent options, almost all of which I agree with & would like to have (though I've used the heated seats in my current car only a handful of times - remember I'm in South Florida - the land of eternal heat). I had not heard that the Boxster's Bose system is so poor - the one in my current car is good (not great, but quite good) and I've learned from my own personal experiences that if I can avoid having to install a bunch of aftermarket stereo equipment, I'd like to. Is mikefocke's rather negative opinion of the Bose system widely held? Anyone else want to weigh-in on that?

racer_d - I would not buy the Anniversary edition with any fantasy that it would actually appreciate in value, I do like them though (asthetics and standard 'options') and would hope that if I did get one, it might not depreciate as much as a 'standard' car over the 6-8 years I am likely to own it. That said, I have not found any on the market right now that are under consideration, and neither car I want to see this coming weekend is the special edition.

Finally, a clarification addressing the price comments - I am not seriously looking at any 986 S' for $35k or more (they are all less - like asking $32k and change) I just said I would spend that much or a bit more for my 'perfect' car, and I guess I meant a really exceptional 986 S or a 987, but as I mentioned, I've only seen one 987 S under $40k, and as of yesterday, a day after husker boxster gave me that lead, it's gone ...