Mobil 1 0W-40?

[Gelbster]

There seem to be 3 types of recommendations:
1.What I m already using -the engine will still run with the most inappropriate oil. Which is what some people choose and then they state "El cheapo oil X is great for the M96. "
2. What the smart people who read the M96 R&D use (JGDT40) or similar.
3. The tribology geeks find the tech charts that compare any candidate oil suggested according to the unusual lubrication needs of the M96:
- anti-foaming additives
- high shear resistance
- high thermal stability
- ? others
Sadly most responses say more about psychology & feelings(!) than tribology.
The question seldom asked is : "How much longer would you like the engine to last?"

[Smallblock454]

Hello Gelbster,

that is true, and there are so many oil discussions on the internet. But i also don't have a clue for that, because i can't tell how much longer the engine will live or if there is a difference in the end. Also the oil compositions change from time to time. And some believe in that brand and some in the other brand.

There are some technical and logical factors that can be brought into the discussion, but that's it.

For example:
The engine is mostly made from aluminium. Mineralic oil tends to generate aggressive acid if you use the car only on short distances, because it contains sulfur. So in the case a full synthetic oils is better. But on the other side sulfur is a good lubricant additive.

Viscosity. Some say you need a 0W oil, because it is very thin and will oil everything immediately. But if we look a little bit closer we will see that the xW factor is defined by the norm SAE J 300. This norm says that the has to be pumpable at these temperatures:
SAE 0W −40 °C
SAE 5W −35 °C
SAE 10W −30 °C
SAE 15W −25 °C
SAE 20W −20 °C
SAE 25W −15 °C

So i think in normal climates or if you don't have cold winters or if you only drive your car in summer season a SAE 5W or 10W oil will also be good. Also you can hear the difference when you start a cold engine and the hydros are quite o quieter – which means more oil pressure or that the oil didn't run out of the hydros because it's to thin. And in general the engines we have are not new and have some wear.

Longlife oils: Longlife oils are not designed for short distance driving. So if you only drive short distances it is better to use a standard full synth oil.

And there are oils on the market that are different from standard oils. For example ester based oils.

Tribology:
Motor oil in general: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_oil
Kinematic viscosity at low and high temperatures - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viscosity
Viscosity index: which is mostly declared in norms - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viscosity_index For example ASTM - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASTM_International
Dynamic viscosity - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viscosity#Dynamic_viscosity
Density - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Density
flashpoint: the higher the better – also depends on upper viscosity value - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_point
Pour point: Indicates the temperature when a fluid is barely fluid - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pour_point
HTHS: high-temperature, high-shear
Additives: that is an endless discussion

And still i can't tell you which is the right oil that will make your engine last longer.

Regards, Markus

[imon_2nd]

Another data point on Porsche oil:

The only Porsche dealership, Niello, in our metro area of 2 million people services a lot of Porsches of all types. I took my "new" Boxster in for an oil change knowing they would search the car for anything broken or worn out so they could propose repairs. I was surprised they used Mobil 1, 0-40W on my 100K-miles car. When I questioned the wisdom of this choice, the service manager said that was what they use on every Porsche, new, low-miles, or old, high miles. They've been doing this since 1981 and claim "no problems."

0-40W is not what I'd have selected, but on the other hand, I haven't noticed any camshaft chain noise or valve clatter at start-up.

[BirdDog]

After Flat-6 rebuilt my engine I use only Joe Gibbs Racing DT40. It's the oil they recommended so that's all I use.

I also use a Napa Gold (or the Wix branded equivalent) spin-on filter. An LNE spin on adapter came as part of the IMS Solution. It's slightly different than the normal LNE spin on adapter and uses a different oil filter.

I buy the oil from Summit Racing for about $110 a case (they give a discount for a case) with free shipping (but i usually drive down to pick it up at the store because that place is a religious experience!) I get the filters at my local O'Reilly's.

[Brockmeister]

I've been using 0w40 Mobil for 5 years and 40,000 miles on my '99 box. I bought it in 2011 with 66k on the clock and now it has 106. Hasn't blowed up yet! (KNOCK ON WOOD).

[911monty]

I'm of the fit for purpose crowd. My 98 came filled with M1 and of course has the ad in the trunk. SO when I changed the first time I used the recommendation and filled with the M1 0W-40. When I inspected the filter there was a lot of brown and some green paddle pieces. With the new M1 there was still a lot of startup rattle. I figured had to be something better. So started research. I live in sunny Cali where temps in the dead of winter rarely get below 20 deg f. Obviously 0W is not required and by the startup noise it was time for a change. To minimize tensioner bleed down and reduce viscosity modifiers a 20W fit the bill but 10W-40 was good. Switched to Castrol Edge 10W-40. Immediately noticed FAR less startup rattle even after 2 weeks sitting. First pic is of some of the filter debris after M1 at 88.9k. Second pic is filter debris after CE 10W-40 at 93k. Both changes at 4100 mi. Much less paddle debris now. I found total of 4 pieces. Oh and NO metal on Mag plug or filtermag. I was happy with the CE but was considering the JGDT 40. Due to availability issues I switched to JGDT40. I'd be happier if it was 10W but who knows maybe I'll find myself in Colorado again at 30 below. Next change will be on JGDT40.






Personally if you never try anything else, How can you know what's best?

[Gelbster]

To the Mobil 1 enthusiasts:
You do know that Mobil 1 is a significantly different formulation now than when that sticker was attached don't you? Check BITOG for details.
And since that sticker was attached as a joint marketing enterprise between Porsche and Mobil, many new ,different & better(?) oils have been introduced.
And the long term lubrication issues of the M96 are better understood than they were 15 years ago .
So sticking with such an old recommendation may not be the optimum choice?

[Ciao]

Originally Posted by 78F350

I'm pretty sure that this decal was paid for by Mobil at a cost of many times the price of the decal:



My 2001 owner's manual does not have ANY recommendation of a 0 weight oil:



0 weight Mobil1 oil? I put in in one of mine because it was on sale. Next 6 month change I think it's going to 10W-40 Castrol Edge, if the engine hasn't had a catastrophic failure by then. :dance:

Why is 0-40W used by many dealers, mechanics, and individuals? I plan on using Liqui Moly 5-40W

[kk2002s]

Ok Here we go
I have been using M1 0-40 since I bought 4 years ago. I had a 3 year power train warranty and only wanted to use recommended while under.
Changed every 6 months = 3 - 5k miles.
Car never leaked.
This spring I did my change, drove a couple hour drives over a couple weeks (Not using car much these days).
Low and behold a small 1-1/2 inch stain on my garage floor each time.
Get under the car and "MOIST" between engine and bell housing with a drip hanging off that notorious area. Cleaned it up well for observation
Took it on a 700 mile road trip and a few more drives and now it's dry again. At least no more drips.
I'm thinking RMS and that new 0-40 is so thin it leaks. Then drive a 1000 miles, the oil thickens up
I think it's time to ween off M1

[Wangta]

Has anyone else used Amsoil 5W-40 in their Boxster?

[Oldcarguy]

Originally Posted by Ciao

Why is 0-40W used by many dealers, mechanics, and individuals? I plan on using Liqui Moly 5-40W

Porsche changed their recommendation to 0w-40 after the owners manuals were printed. I don’t have the links but I came across this while doing research to decide which oil I was going to use just after I bought the 986 (I chose to use Castrol Edge ‘European’ Formula). The Castrol is on the latest Porsche ‘approved for use’ list I found.

[p3230]

I also used Amsoil 5W-40

[Wangta]

Originally Posted by p3230

I also used Amsoil 5W-40

Everything good? No issues?


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[p3230]

No nothing wrong with it I think it's just as good as Mobil 1.

[Wangta]

Originally Posted by p3230

No nothing wrong with it I think it's just as good as Mobil 1.

I think better. Mobile 1 isn’t what it used to be.


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[Ciao]

Oldcarguy, after a year of using LiquiMoly, I also discovered Mobile 1 0-40 W had the required A40 requirements. I changed to M1 0-40 W for storage and will see how it does in 2018 Spring, summer, and Fall. I've been thinking about trying Amsoil next year but don't know if its worth the significant increase in $

[Oldcarguy]

Originally Posted by Ciao

Oldcarguy, after a year of using LiquiMoly, I also discovered Mobile 1 0-40 W had the required A40 requirements. I changed to M1 0-40 W for storage and will see how it does in 2018 Spring, summer, and Fall. I've been thinking about trying Amsoil next year but don't know if its worth the significant increase in $

I don’t know either. I went with Castrol because I have a long history with them from my motorcycles and I read something about a change to Mobil 1 formulation that some of the Porsche forums were not happy about (don’t remember what it was - I’m old ). Maybe someone can comment regarding the change (if any) to Mobil 1.

[Mig]

I remember seeing a list of Porsche approved oils sometime ago. Does anyone have a current list?

Porsche built the car and know it better than anyone else. I'll go with their latest recommendation for my engine.

[paulofto]

Originally Posted by Mig

I remember seeing a list of Porsche approved oils sometime ago. Does anyone have a current list?

Porsche built the car and know it better than anyone else. I'll go with their latest recommendation for my engine.

Any oil with an A40 designation is Porsche approved. Including Canadian Tire Motomaster Formula 1 Synthetic 5W-40

Here is the list as of 2016

[paulofto]

Apparently my attachment failed