Brake Upgrade Question - 986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners

aussieboxy · 05-02-2007, 05:20 PM

Hi guys,

I'm considering my options for brake upgrades to my 2.7. Have looked at the big brake upgrades and $3K+ seems just a bit much.

Does anyone know the difference between the stock brakes & the S. Are the calipers different or just the discs?

Am I better off just going for some high performance pads and to get my current capilers powder coated?

Thanks

[986] · 05-02-2007, 09:12 PM

Just out of curiosity which brake kits did you look at? I'd like to do something similar in future

blinkwatt · 05-02-2007, 09:31 PM

Does anyone know the difference between the stock brakes & the S. Are the calipers different or just the discs?

The disc and calipers are different.

Am I better off just going for some high performance pads and to get my current capilers powder coated?

Very few people upgrade their brakes on Boxsters due to the fact that they are great as is. Perhaps your brake rotors or pad are worn out,have you checked the specs of your rotors and pads to see if it's time for a replacement?

aussieboxy · 05-02-2007, 10:36 PM

986 It was the Brembo Big Brake Upgrade Kit. There are numerous sites I looked at, I think the links are on this site.

Blinkwatt. My brakes are fine and yes they do perform very well, it's just that I'm thinking about improvement. If I work on increasing performance I think it's appropriate to consider improving braking.

I drove a 987S the other day and I think the braking is better than my 986, but it's a bit hard to tell unless you drive them back to back along the same peice of road at the same pace. I wasn't able to do that.

Thanks for your comments. Does anyone know if there is significant difference between the brakes of the standard & the S?

blinkwatt · 05-02-2007, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussieboxy

Does anyone know if there is significant difference between the brakes of the standard & the S?

There isn't a big difference, only 5ft difference on the 60-0 from the Boxster S compared to the Boxster.

Now if the 987S that you drove had the ceramic brake option then I could see there being a difference.

humara · 05-02-2007, 11:02 PM

a common misconception that people have about BBK is that the stopping distances will be reduced by the kit. the main reason to upgrade to a BBK would actually be better pedal feel and a reduction in fade. the downside is the increase in unsprung weight.

aussieboxy · 05-02-2007, 11:54 PM

So there will be no significant difference in braking performance with an upgrade? So why do they put bigger brakes on faster cars? The brakes on a 997TT are huge when compared to a 997 Carrera.

insite · 05-03-2007, 04:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussieboxy

So there will be no significant difference in braking performance with an upgrade? So why do they put bigger brakes on faster cars? The brakes on a 997TT are huge when compared to a 997 Carrera.

i upgraded to S brakes on my car. HUGE difference. the only real differences up front are larger rotors & pads. in back, the difference is thicker rotors. the brakes are much easier to modulate, allowing consistently shorter stopping distances. at the track, my fade problems were solved.

for the upgrade, you can really skip the rear. just do the front calipers, pads and rotors. they bolt right up. buy cross vented rear rotors and you're all set.

aussieboxy · 05-03-2007, 04:15 AM

Thanks insite I'll start looking for the cailpers & rotors of an S

edevlin · 05-03-2007, 07:22 AM

IMO, it depends on what you are trying to do with the car, for me, weight, especially rotating mass makes a noticable difference in the performance of the car. I am not sure how much weight is added with the S-brakes, but if it is much, I dont think I would be interested, have fun,

Ed

insite · 05-03-2007, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edevlin

IMO, it depends on what you are trying to do with the car, for me, weight, especially rotating mass makes a noticable difference in the performance of the car. I am not sure how much weight is added with the S-brakes, but if it is much, I dont think I would be interested, have fun,

the calipers weigh the same. the rotors are a little bit heavier. not noticable when driving, imo. either way, the brake upgrade easily knocked 1.5sec off my lap times at TGPR. WAY more confidence in the pedal; easy to go very deep into the corners. one of the best upgrades i've done to the car (from a track perspective).

MNBoxster · 05-03-2007, 12:11 PM

Hi,

For the Track, it's a worthwhile upgrade, but unless Tracking the car regularly, it's a waste of money.

A Street Car doesn't have the constant ON/OFF of the brakes that a Track car does. There's plenty of time between Brake applications to cool things off.

The pads will wear more quickly and generally cost more (though not always).

Add to this that you adjust to your brakes, for better brakes, you will apply them later which essentially negates the miniscule distance advantage they have.

You could gain all the advantages and save the weight and expense by going to either a more agressive pad, or adding insulators to the pads you have. Then get a Paint Kit and paint them Red if you want the look...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

insite · 05-03-2007, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MNBoxster

For the Track, it's a worthwhile upgrade, but unless Tracking the car regularly, it's a waste of money.

i would have thought so. there are some things i really like about the upgrade, even on the street. particularly, i always felt with my base brakes that i had to push the pedal too hard to get the car to stop properly. in fact, under heavy braking, the brake pedal would dip below the throttle, making tough work of a clean heal and toe. the new setup cured this issue (which was NOT pad related; trust me).

Quote:

Originally Posted by MNBoxster

The pads will wear more quickly and generally cost more (though not always).

in many cases this is true. in the case of the 996 upgrade, the pads have a larger surface are AND are thicker, resulting in longer life. the downside is that the pads generally cost more, negating any real gain. i think in the long run i'll break even on pads.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MNBoxster

You could gain all the advantages and save the weight and expense by going to either a more agressive pad, or adding insulators to the pads you have. Then get a Paint Kit and paint them Red if you want the look...

this is true, but the more aggressive pads tend to suck in the cold and eat up your rotors. that's been my experience. unless you get a great deal on the upgrade calipers, jim's probably right that it's cheaper in the long run to just use aggressive pads. i still would have done the upgrade knowing what i know now. as for the paint, i have to do that anyway. bought mine off a 996, so they're black.

aussieboxy · 05-03-2007, 02:05 PM

Ok so now I'm leaning towards more agressive pads rather than a brake upgrade as I don't track the car.

Which pads are best and do they make a difference to rotor wear?

racer_d · 05-03-2007, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussieboxy

Ok so now I'm leaning towards more agressive pads rather than a brake upgrade as I don't track the car.

Which pads are best and do they make a difference to rotor wear?

Pads can make a huge difference in brake feel and grip. Usually the trade off is dust and squeaky noises. And yes, some can hurt rotors more than you might think.

What pads are you currently running?

insite · 05-03-2007, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussieboxy

Ok so now I'm leaning towards more agressive pads rather than a brake upgrade as I don't track the car.

Which pads are best and do they make a difference to rotor wear?

pads make a HUGE difference on the track. i cannot stress this enough. you will be truly amazed at the difference in feel & high temp torque. race pads are definitely tougher on your rotors, but it's a good trade off. racer_d is right that they'll squeak like hell. they also suck when it's cold.

for those reasons, i have a dedicated set of track pads. it's WAY cheaper in the long run, because race pads last long on the track, street pads last long on the street, and street pads are easier on your rotors.

i like pagid orange and hawk ht-10. i have the hawk right now. personally, i like them better than the pagid. next on my list to try is carbotech. i hear GREAT things about them. one positive of carbotech is this: most race pads are a ferrocarbon compound (carbon & iron). these mix with your rotors under heat to make a different crystilline metal out of your rotor surfaces (can't remember which one; austenite maybe?). anyway, carbotech are a carbon-carbon compound, so your rotors don't harden.

the hardening process is bad for the rotor for two reasons: first, it doesn't happen evenly, so you get high and low spots on the rotor leading to inconsistent pad contact. second, it has a lower friction coefficient (pad material doesn't stick as well to it, limiting adhesive friction forces).

i'm probably telling you WAY more than you needed to know about brakes, but here's more: there are two types of friction, basically, that brakes use. one is abrasive. this is where the pad material and rotor material actually experience broken chemical bonds from the process physically shearing away material. the other is adhesive friction. this is what race pads do. they actually stick a layer of pad material to the rotor. then, the pad is constantly forming and breaking bonds with this transfer layer. it's a chemical reaction that happens over and over at high temp. it's for this reason that race rotors are often thicker after a race than before it. i will shut up now.