Thanks Trump

[Starter986]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

Correction 263k jobs. which puts the Trump average at 205k new jobs per month. For context, the average in Obama's entire second term was 207k new jobs per month. Yes.. we are creating LESS jobs now. And I took a look at that jobs report of 263k jobs in April. It was high because February only had 56k jobs!! Flip to the page in the jobs report about manufacturing jobs and it says only 1.5% came from new factory jobs. Let me repeat that for the guys in the back, in a month with 263k new jobs less than 2% of the total came from blue collar factory jobs. And it's the same 1-2% figure we had during.....Obama. The report also listed a loss of 12k jobs in retail. I guess the extra $20 bucks in each flyover country paycheck is resulting in fewer shopping bags at JC Penney than new Wraiths at the Rolls Royce dealer near Mar-A-Lago.


let's move on to GDP. So far under the professor of putting out fires of 800 year old historic landmarks, we've averaged about 3% GDP. That's not a booming economy by any measure. It would NOT put the professor in the top five Presidents on GDP. Even Jimmy Carter had above 3% GDP. The top five were all at 4-5%. Yep Jimmy was in the top five. Let me restate the obvious: GDP doesn't go up or down because of who is in the White House. Repeating this misnomer is one of the stupider things we do as Americans.

Let's discuss this "historic unemployment". When Obama walked into the White House with the FDIC and money market accounts two days from a total meltdown the unemployment rate was 7.8%. When Mr. "I didnt know a KGB agent (yeah, like an actual Soviet era spy) was at the Trump Tower meeting on "adoptions"" was inaugurated in January 2017 the unemployment rate was at 4.8%. Anything below 5% for just about any functional economy in the world is considered full employment. After two years of the proffesor/mentor to "Tim Apple"', the unemployment rate dropped a whopping 0.5 - 0.6% per year. The best analogy of Trump taking credit for "fuller full employment" is like a marathon runner jumping into a race in the last mile, crossing the finish first and immediately proceeding to take credit for the previous 25 miles he didn't even run.

Now let's look at "the longest lasting expansion in history "... We've had 119 consecutive months of positive job creation. Trump's been in office 26 of those 119 months. By my mathematical analysis... 93 of 119 months came under the previous administration. (showing my work: 119 - 26 = 93). That means that Obama accounted for 75% of the history-making total. Thus if we subscribe to the fallacy Presidents "create jobs" then how isn't Obama getting 75% of the credit??

Point of irony: fear of rising interest rates that had previously been at near 0% for an eternity are largely what motivated businesses to take out loans for expenditures that they'd been putting off for years And pushed home buyers to take out mortgages after sitting on the sidelines all during the recovery. Basically like shaking the last of the apples out of the tree. This rise in borrowing lit a fire under the economy's butt long before the corporate tax cut went from possible to a narrow victory in the Senate. And who took to Twitter to slam the Fed's decision to raise rates? The same guy now taking credit for increased lending activity and its resulting GDP growth. Yeah Mr. "I will not repeat my own words under oath" Trump ...but everyone else who has testified under oath are the ones lying. Okay Got it.

Meanwhile a year after the corporate tax cut passed and we had our first negative year in the stock market since the crash a decade earlier and are only now back on the same same curve that we were on since the 2012 deflationary spiral in materials and fuel prices. But more importantly if you look at actual corporate earnings growth today we're not really any higher since 2012 we're just paying a lot more in our IRAs and 401Ks for the same S&P 500 stocks. Back in NJ when you pay more for the same with no added value we call that a bubble.

Those are great sound-bites and talking points.

What's your position on illegal alien immigration law violations?

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Starter986

Those are great sound-bites and talking points.

What's your position on illegal alien immigration law violations?

talking points? those are basic macroeconoic figures that any analyst can cite off the top of his head proving that this is NOT a "booming" economy..
The easiest way to debunk the myths that Trump spews about "the greatest economy ever" is to simply point out that the Labor Force Participation rate was 62% when Trump came down the escalator to announce his candidacy at Trump Tower in 2016. He said 62% under Obama was "terrible ". After two years of Trump's corporate tax cuts, trade war tariffs and historic deficit spending where is the labor force participation rate today? the same!!! The percentage of Americans working for a living has not improved a lick... nearly 40% of this country are NOT working for a living. When an economy is actually booming that number is going UP not waffling a tenth of a point here and there, up and down. The number of hours in a workweek is another revealing figure, that's also stuck at 35 hours since Trump took over. Wage increases similarly are stagnant, nothing more than 0.1% movement. Some raise! And for all his talk of trade wars the ISM manufacturing index is LOWER today than when Obama was in office. Have you been following the cratering of auto sales? Down 6-8% depending on who is reporting. A sudden drop in auto sales is NOT a sign of a booming economy. I'd be hard pressed to come up with a single leading or lagging indicator that has shown robust and continuous improvement consistent with what we usually seen in an expanding boom economy like in the Reagan and Bill Clinton eras.

so what about immigration? WE NEED MORE!! There are close to 80 million baby boomers who are ageing out of the workforce that are not being replaced with new workers at anything near the level needed to sustain even our lackluster 2-3% GDP growth. If Trump woke up tomorrow and said "you know what screw ICE let's just give every single undocumented worker legal status with working papers and approve another 10 million waiting to come in".... the country would still be short of replacing all the manual labor that has aged out of the workforce by tens of millions. But are we making it easier and not absurdly expensive to bring in these workers? Heck no. The GOP has blocked every single immigration reform bill that has hit the floor of Congress since the 1965 Immigration Act. Every last one. Even when Reagan and Bush tried to move the needle forward their own Republican party blocked them. The only immigration reform the GOP is interested is lowering legal immigration and making it next to impossible financially.

There has not been a single period of economic expansion in this country's history without a significant increase in low skills immigrant workers. What most don't realize is that we only permit 300k to 400k legal work visas per year when U.S. employers need to hire several million per year. After a decade of obstructing immigration reform that deficit has piled up so high that the typical wait for a low skills worker is several decades long and costs the equivalent of a year's wages just for the privilege of waiting decades for an answer one way or another. Another thing people don't understand is that each country no matter how many people we illegally hire from that country receive the same share of work visas under the current absurdly low caps. Mexico and the rest of Latin America will get the same percentage of visas of the total available as a wealthy country with few if any citizens looking for work in America. Basically if you don't already have an immediate relative who is not already a naturalized citizen (lawful permanent resident is not good enough) you can't even get on the line to wait 20 years. Those people hopping fences would need to wait nearly 60 to 80 years under the current backlog that perpetuates itself with such small numbers or work visas granted.

But let's not fix the immigration system let's spend $40 billion on a wall a.k.a. the symptom of the immigration problem instead of addressing the root cause. And by the way the number of illegal crossings are still at decades lows even with the recent spike. When the Reagan and Bill Clinton economies were surging at 7-8% GDP growth in their best quarters and we were short of workers again the undocumented were pouring over the border at 1.6 million a year. Today we're only at a quarter of those figures. We allowed it to hit a million illegal crossings in the 80's and 90's because the economy was so on fire that we needed the workers no matter what. They made it only a misdemeanor to cross illegal for a reason. So that employers wouldn't be hiring felons which would put the employer in serious legal jeopardy. And no neither Trump nor the GOP for all their anti-immigration propaganda have yet to propose making illegal crossing a felony THE FIRST TIME and not just for re-entry after formal deportation. Why? because the biggest employers of undocumented workers are Republicans!! Look at how many of the Republican farming states have backed a federal mandate to require e-verify for all workers statewide. Zero. With that system in place an undocumented worker is discovered within days. But the loss of agricultural, restaurant and hospitality workers would be severe to these low population states. It's so easy to call B.S. on all this immigration hysteria. Simply ask why their Republican senator has not introduced a bill to both raise illegal crossing to a felony and pushed for universal e-verify. But build that $40 billion dollar wall!!

[Starter986]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

talking points? those are basic macroeconoic figures that any analyst can cite off the top of his head proving that this is NOT a "booming" economy..
The easiest way to debunk the myths that Trump spews about "the greatest economy ever" is to simply point out that the Labor Force Participation rate was 62% when Trump came down the escalator to announce his candidacy at Trump Tower in 2016. He said 62% under Obama was "terrible ". After two years of Trump's corporate tax cuts, trade war tariffs and historic deficit spending where is the labor force participation rate today? the same!!! The percentage of Americans working for a living has not improved a lick... nearly 40% of this country are NOT working for a living. When an economy is actually booming that number is going UP not waffling a tenth of a point here and there, up and down. The number of hours in a workweek is another revealing figure, that's also stuck at 35 hours since Trump took over. Wage increases similarly are stagnant, nothing more than 0.1% movement. Some raise! And for all his talk of trade wars the ISM manufacturing index is LOWER today than when Obama was in office. Have you been following the cratering of auto sales? Down 6-8% depending on who is reporting. A sudden drop in auto sales is NOT a sign of a booming economy. I'd be hard pressed to come up with a single leading or lagging indicator that has shown robust and continuous improvement consistent with what we usually seen in an expanding boom economy like in the Reagan and Bill Clinton eras.

so what about immigration? WE NEED MORE!! There are close to 80 million baby boomers who are ageing out of the workforce that are not being replaced with new workers at anything near the level needed to sustain even our lackluster 2-3% GDP growth. If Trump woke up tomorrow and said "you know what screw ICE let's just give every single undocumented worker legal status with working papers and approve another 10 million waiting to come in".... the country would still be short of replacing all the manual labor that has aged out of the workforce by tens of millions. But are we making it easier and not absurdly expensive to bring in these workers? Heck no. The GOP has blocked every single immigration reform bill that has hit the floor of Congress since the 1965 Immigration Act. Every last one. Even when Reagan and Bush tried to move the needle forward their own Republican party blocked them. The only immigration reform the GOP is interested is lowering legal immigration and making it next to impossible financially.

There has not been a single period of economic expansion in this country's history without a significant increase in low skills immigrant workers. What most don't realize is that we only permit 300k to 400k legal work visas per year when U.S. employers need to hire several million per year. After a decade of obstructing immigration reform that deficit has piled up so high that the typical wait for a low skills worker is several decades long and costs the equivalent of a year's wages just for the privilege of waiting decades for an answer one way or another. Another thing people don't understand is that each country no matter how many people we illegally hire from that country receive the same share of work visas under the current absurdly low caps. Mexico and the rest of Latin America will get the same percentage of visas of the total available as a wealthy country with few if any citizens looking for work in America. Basically if you don't already have an immediate relative who is not already a naturalized citizen (lawful permanent resident is not good enough) you can't even get on the line to wait 20 years. Those people hopping fences would need to wait nearly 60 to 80 years under the current backlog that perpetuates itself with such small numbers or work visas granted.

But let's not fix the immigration system let's spend $40 billion on a wall a.k.a. the symptom of the immigration problem instead of addressing the root cause. And by the way the number of illegal crossings are still at decades lows even with the recent spike. When the Reagan and Bill Clinton economies were surging at 7-8% GDP growth in their best quarters and we were short of workers again the undocumented were pouring over the border at 1.6 million a year. Today we're only at a quarter of those figures. We allowed it to hit a million illegal crossings in the 80's and 90's because the economy was so on fire that we needed the workers no matter what. They made it only a misdemeanor to cross illegal for a reason. So that employers wouldn't be hiring felons which would put the employer in serious legal jeopardy. And no neither Trump nor the GOP for all their anti-immigration propaganda have yet to propose making illegal crossing a felony THE FIRST TIME and not just for re-entry after formal deportation. Why? because the biggest employers of undocumented workers are Republicans!! Look at how many of the Republican farming states have backed a federal mandate to require e-verify for all workers statewide. Zero. With that system in place an undocumented worker is discovered within days. But the loss of agricultural, restaurant and hospitality workers would be severe to these low population states. It's so easy to call B.S. on all this immigration hysteria. Simply ask why their Republican senator has not introduced a bill to both raise illegal crossing to a felony and pushed for universal e-verify. But build that $40 billion dollar wall!!

Thanks, Man. Nothing you shared seems extraordinarily out of order and, even to this political plebe, makes sense. I appreciate your candor (even though I may yank your chain on occasion).

So... why do you believe the American public is enamored with Trump? I don't agree with his every position... but I admire his tell it like it is, no BS, approach... I think Dems call it lying

Cheers!

[Blackcloud]

I did not even read the posts on this topic. Political discussion does not belong here. There are plenty of other places to opine. I am surprised the moderator didn’t nip this in the bud. I respect others opinions, but not here when it comes to personal political views. Please address this someplace else where it is welcomed. Thanks.

[maytag]

Originally Posted by Blackcloud

I did not even read the posts on this topic. Political discussion does not belong here. There are plenty of other places to opine. I am surprised the moderator didn’t nip this in the bud. I respect others opinions, but not here when it comes to personal political views. Please address this someplace else where it is welcomed. Thanks.

Perhaps you missed that there is an entire subsection of this forum dedicated to PRECISELY this kind of topic. (Easy to miss if you're using the app on your mobile device)

Nobody is calling anybody out to the flagpole. Everybody seems to know when to take a breather. We all seem to remember what brings us here.

I don't see the problem.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

[Starter986]

Originally Posted by Blackcloud

I did not even read the posts on this topic. Political discussion does not belong here. There are plenty of other places to opine. I am surprised the moderator didn’t nip this in the bud. I respect others opinions, but not here when it comes to personal political views. Please address this someplace else where it is welcomed. Thanks.

Then go somewhere else. This is the general discussion part of the forum.

Yeah, moderators, lol. They're more interested in selling cheap watches and allowing spam posts.

Next time: Read.

[Blackcloud]

Originally Posted by Starter986

Then go somewhere else. This is the general discussion part of the forum.

Yeah, moderators, lol. They're more interested in selling cheap watches and allowing spam posts.

Next time: Read.

General discussions of the Porsche Boxster.

[JBauer]

Originally Posted by maytag

Piper6909, American English is my 2nd language. Would you like me to go through and start red-lining your posts? You have plenty, PLENTY of grammatical and spelling errors.
Don't throw rocks when you're in a glass house.
In today's age of voice to text, and predictive text, you should give much more allowance for minor spelling errors.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by Blackcloud

General discussions of the Porsche Boxster.

Actually it doesn't say that. Current events is mentioned tho ��

This is an off topic forum. Jokes, current events, sports etc...

[Starter986]

Originally Posted by Blackcloud

General discussions of the Porsche Boxster.

That's it? That's all you've got to offer? Put on your big boy pants and take a position. Knees?

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Starter986

Thanks, Man. Nothing you shared seems extraordinarily out of order and, even to this political plebe, makes sense. I appreciate your candor (even though I may yank your chain on occasion).

So... why do you believe the American public is enamored with Trump? I don't agree with his every position... but I admire his tell it like it is, no BS, approach... I think Dems call it lying

Cheers!

I have a secretary at work who lives in a part of the city that's dangerous and she's not from there originally. She ended up there in late middle age. She's got serious health problems and is not yet old enough to qualify for Medicare so she needs to keep working through her illnesses to keep her health insurance. She lives alone and from what I hear her ex-husband left her deep in debt without any financial support before he died. She is a rabid Trump supporter. She drives cross country to his rallies. Shes not a racist, bigot, homophobic or any of that ignorance. but shes also not very informed. She is big on infowars, Alex Jones, Qanon aka the deep state conspiracy and believes every single word out of Trump's mouth. When he's caught lying like with paying off the porno stars she says it wasn't a lie.

So I dont argue with her. You're never going to get a believer to question their choices. My one coworker is like why does she believe him? I said do you remember the OJ Simpson verdict and how people cheered the acquittal of an obvious killer? Those people weren't cheering for him they were cheering that a bad guy got one over on a bad system. They are angry about "the rigged system" and never question their own life's choices. Even years later many still will not admit that OJ was an ego driven sociopath that killed two people and destroyed the families. Doing so would force them to doubt themselves and maybe realize they had a lot to do with their own failures and how they put their faith in a lying con artist. like Mark Twain said famously "it's easier to fool someone than to convince them that they have been fooled."

At this point the only people who dont think Trump is a con artist who has been living off his father's trust fund for 50 years are the 30% of stone cold believers. The other 7% simply see him as a necessary evil because without those 30% of the voters they'd never win an election for President. Since 1988 the GOP have scored only a single 51% majority of the vote. The 2018 midterms was an 8% defeat of the national vote the biggest margin in midterm election history. It's Trump it or leave it.

[piper6909]

Originally Posted by Starter986

Thanks, Man. Nothing you shared seems extraordinarily out of order and, even to this political plebe, makes sense. I appreciate your candor (even though I may yank your chain on occasion).

So... why do you believe the American public is enamored with Trump? I don't agree with his every position... but I admire his tell it like it is, no BS, approach... I think Dems call it lying

Cheers!

"No BS approach"?? HAHA! Every other word out of his mouth is BS!

Over 10,000 documented lies and counting since taking office.

He makes Joe Isuzu like Honest Abe!

Remember Joe Isuzu or am I showing my age?

[Starter986]

Originally Posted by piper6909

"No BS approach"?? HAHA! Every other word out of his mouth is BS!

Over 10,000 documented lies and counting since taking office.

He makes Joe Isuzu like Honest Abe!

Remember Joe Isuzu or am I showing my age?

Yeah, you're showing your age. I said illegal aliens. Illegal. Aliens. Scourge and scum.

10,000 lies is nothing compareed to the blues. You know what they say: How can you tell an attorney is lying? His mouth is open.

What? You only count in red?

Cheers!

[piper6909]

Originally Posted by Starter986

Yeah, you're showing your age. I said illegal aliens. Illegal. Aliens. Scourge and scum.

10,000 lies is nothing compareed to the blues. You know what they say: How can you tell an attorney is lying? His mouth is open.

What? You only count in red?

Cheers!

Scourge & Scum? You really shouldn't talk about the first family that way, but I agree with you!

Seriously, dehumanizing a group of people seeking refuge from hunger, violence, or just seeking a better life for their families doesn't help anyone, especially your own argument.

Unless you're native American, we're all aliens and our founders were illegal aliens.

Besides, aliens legal or otherwise, as Perfectlap so eloquently pointed out, are good for our economy. They do the work we refuse to do.

Yes, politicians lie. But Rumpy is in a class all his own. He's a con-man and there were warning signs everywhere. The stories of the contractors he stiffed, and as a contractor, that hits home for me. The fake university, the real estate deals where he stiffed investors of millions, and so on and so on. And last, but not least, the MAGA dunce caps he sells that are MADE IN CHINA!

Blues lie? How many times did Obama lie to you? But we already went through that. Scroll down.

[Starter986]

Originally Posted by piper6909

Seriously, dehumanizing a group of people seeking refuge from hunger, violence, or just seeking a better life for their families doesn't help anyone, especially your own argument.

LOL. Dehumanizing? Are you blind? ILLEGAL aliens. You know, it's in the news. I'm fine with the proper-channel applicants.

LOL. The jobs we don't want to do? You're still buying that narrative? Absent that scourge you just watch how many Americans would step to the plate.

I suppose a program to employ the chronic homeless couldn't fill those "jobs Americans don't want to do" isn't in the cards.

I hear Venezuala is nice this time of year.

[JBauer]

Originally Posted by piper6909

"No BS approach"?? HAHA! Every other word out of his mouth is BS!

Over 10,000 documented lies and counting since taking office.

He makes Joe Isuzu like Honest Abe!

Remember Joe Isuzu or am I showing my age?

Actually I think your showing your IQ 🙄

[piper6909]

Originally Posted by JBauer

Actually I think your showing your IQ 🙄

Says the guy who doesn't know the difference between "you're" and "your" LMAO!

[maytag]

Originally Posted by piper6909

Says the guy who doesn't know the difference between "you're" and "your" LMAO!

Piper6909, American English is my 2nd language. Would you like me to go through and start red-lining your posts? You have plenty, PLENTY of grammatical and spelling errors.
Don't throw rocks when you're in a glass house.
In today's age of voice to text, and predictive text, you should give much more allowance for minor spelling errors.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk