Worst PPI

[Dosverde]

Hi all,

I'm a new Boxster S (Black on black 2003) owner and a forum lurker. I have found an abundance of information here to help me buying a my first Porsche.

So when I found the one I wanted, I got emotional and did the deal straight after a test drive, ignoring the standard mantra on here of getting a PPI done first.

So after 500 kilometres of ownership I learnt first hand how to change a water pump in a farmers machinary shed out in the country. A totally worthwhile and enjoyable experience, got to know the car a lot better, and had an adventure at the same time

But it got me thinking, how many of you out there rejected a Boxster because of a bad PPI, and whats the worst problem a PPI uncovered?

[tomc88]

I'd like to know also, who has had a PPI - got a clean bill of health, bought the car,
just to find a major problem what the Inspector missed

[Timco]

Bought mine right after test drive. Someone else was waiting to test drive the car. No PPI.

AOS, and a year later WP. Needed tires, brakes, rear bearing.

Smooth and trouble free since. (Needed oxy sensor)

[recycledsixtie]

Good question. I looked at two Boxster bases - one a 2000 yellow one and the second a black 2001. I rejected the yellow one before a PPI coz it was yellow.

The second one had only 30k miles. What could possibly go wrong?! However I did have a PPI done on it. Spoiler locked down(obviously inop), minor mist/leak from rms.
Needed CV joints to be done. By doing PPI I got $3K knocked off the asking price.

Records showed that it had a minor accident by first owner. This manual car driven by an executive type's wife. Yep she was good looking too like the car.

Our first meeting everybody was happy and smiling. When I left with the car and having paid for it they were not smiling. Sheesh. It's not like I stole it!

A couple of comments to add. 1. I cannot understand why anybody would risk buying one of these cars unless a PPI was done.

2. There is a temptation to go ahead and buy it anyway even though there are several things wrong. Ironically on my PPI I am sure the mechanic never checked the oil filter for metal which I would now insist on. However my Box has been metal free since backed up by the install of the IMS Guardian.

I trust you all would have/have not done something differently if you had to do it again?
Cheers, Guy

[CoBeerToad]

I didn't know any better. It was 2011. First P-car. Had a choice between two 97's, similar price and mileage. I couldn't get together with one of them. The one that I did get a hold of, I checked it out, gave it a test drive. Needed tires. Clutch hadn't been replaced. Car had 65k on it. I could tell tell that the owner took care of it and he had every service record from the past 10 years. Mostly standard stuff. Ignition switch, starter, regular service intervals.

I negotiated a price right there (11k. I'm not a good negotiator) and picked it up two days later.

Replaced the tires, changed the brake pads, and the clutch went out in 14 months. All was expected.

In three years, I've had the alternator go bad, the belt tensioner fell off (I know. What the hell?) When doing the clutch, I noticed the transmission mounts were both bad. I'm having lots of issues with the top not moving electrically, but I think I bent something and it is jamming up no matter what parts I replace. And now with 92k on the car, it is up in the air right now with suspension issues. (I haven't determined if it is tie rods, or control arms or both yet)

If I would have had a PPI done, I think they would have told me that I would need tires and the clutch was due.

I'm not politicking for not doing a PPI. I didn't know better and I got lucky.

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by Dosverde

Hi all,

I'm a new Boxster S (Black on black 2003) owner and a forum lurker. I have found an abundance of information here to help me buying a my first Porsche.

So when I found the one I wanted, I got emotional and did the deal straight after a test drive, ignoring the standard mantra on here of getting a PPI done first.

So after 500 kilometres of ownership I learnt first hand how to change a water pump in a farmers machinary shed out in the country. A totally worthwhile and enjoyable experience, got to know the car a lot better, and had an adventure at the same time

But it got me thinking, how many of you out there rejected a Boxster because of a bad PPI, and whats the worst problem a PPI uncovered?

We have "thumbs downed" cars for everything from cracked bulkheads (running 19" wheels on very early cars), 2.7L Boxster engine in a pristine and fully loaded Carrera 4S, enough metallic grit in the oil system to build a spare flywheel, cam deviation values approaching 12 degrees, DME over rev range values that would make an F1 engineer cringe, and a car that needed just about one of everything to make it road worthy.

Most cars do fairly well, with only a small number of issues that became price negotiation leverage items. But every once in a while, we get one in that is actually scary............

[BruceH]

Looked at several cars that I didn't even get to the PPI. Then I found one that looked like "the one". I drove it and it felt perfect. Took it for a PPI, and, it turns out it had coolant/oil mix While I had it in for the PPI, the seller coincidently sold it on eBay. I told the seller about the results of the PPI. I don't know what happened with the buyer. The car I ended up buying was long distance from a Cadillac dealer. I was able to speak with the shop that had cared for it for the previous 7 years(I found the nam from CARFAX), including having done the 60k mile maintenance the previous month. I was happy with that conversation and bought the car after flying out to drive and see it in person. It exceeded my expectations. In two years, I have replaced the front brakes and rotors(knew about it), one leaky spark plug tube and some DIY oil changes. YMMV

[Gforrest2]

Bought my '03 base w/88k miles sight unseen on Ebay in 2010. Crossed my fingers and did a p ppi (post pre-purchase inspection). Luckily, clean bill of health except for a torn CV boot, which I have yet to fix. They say set aside $2k a year for repairs. Well, I guess I'm do for an $8k repair this year because other than oil changes, the only thing I've done is replace the front motor mount (and don't get me started on what a PITA that was).

[Perfectlap]

Here's another angle, when my Porsche hit the 10 year mark and 60k miles it was time to decide to keep or sell. I took it to the expensive dealer to do a full diagnostic. They came back with the typical big stuff quoting an outrageous estimate but hey its the dealer.
Next stop was my independent specialist. They largely concurred. Well not long after a slew of unexpected failures came in costly waves. And the shocks had way less life in them than either shop had initially figured. Put it this way a full overhaul would be in order ($$$$).

So even with the PPI you've got to budget in the expensive items that are known to go on these cars as well as the out of the blue stuff. These cars are reliable but they aren't durable, especially in areas of extreme heat or cold.

[Joe B]

I bought a 2003 S, with 88,000 miles, 2 years ago. I decided not to get a PPI when I found out the owner had recently replaced the brake pads and rotors, clutch and flywheel, windshield, rims and tires, trunk and frunk struts, full suspension (Row MO30), spark plugs, and all fluids, including engine oil every 3,000 mi/6 months (Motul 300V). Since then, I've had my cup holder go bad, and the intermittent windshield knob doesn't work. That's it. Sometimes you get lucky...

P.S. Perfectlap, how can a car be reliable if it's not durable ?

[BIGJake111]

The question is, if you were selling your car and someone did a PPI, offering much less than asking price, would you sell it to them, or wait until someone came by that wouldn't think to do a PPI?

[Tucker2]

Ugh....I paid $300 for a PPI from my local Porsche dealership. Pretty much everything they told me was crap. As a whole...the car got a clean bill of health minus leaking valve cover gaskets and the need for a 60K service. In total....close to $6K of work from the dealer. The dealership (none Porsche) selling me the car agreed to pay for half of the valve cover gasket replacement.

*But*

In the end...I tracked down the Independent that had been servicing the car for 3+ years. The 60K had already been done a month before. The Independent was FLOORED about the gasket issue...having never seen a drop of oil leaking out of the motor in the years they serviced it. I took the car to a local Indy who gave me a *FREE* PPI and immediately told me the leaks were spark plug tubes, not gaskets. So....I ended up installing new spark plug tubes and that fixed the leaks. Plus no extra $$$ for the '60K' the Porsche dealer wanted to charge.

I love Indy's.

[Dosverde]

Some interesting stories there guys, thanks. I probably should go for a Post PPI just to know where I stand, once I find the right Indy.

I must say that she is running great at the moment and feels lovely on the road. (knock on wood)

[recycledsixtie]

Originally Posted by BIGJake111

The question is, if you were selling your car and someone did a PPI, offering much less than asking price, would you sell it to them, or wait until someone came by that wouldn't think to do a PPI?

I would not want to be lowballed and would not accept a lowball offer.
I would wait till a decent offer came up from somebody else. I would want my car to be in decent shape when I sold it. Tires would be decent and car would be mechanically sound.

I would encourage a prospective buyer to do a PPI but if they did not want to then fine.
G.

[Drphil]

first car i looked at was in texas, set up a PPI at an independant shop, passed on the car as there were too many small issues, and wondered what big onese were not caught, ; . a month later a friend called and said he saw one listed on craig's list, which i never use- tooka a look at it then called the guy - this was 2 years ago- it was a speed yellow 2000S , listed for $14k, had 60k miles. He was the #2 owner and had only put 35k miles on it in 10 years. I was able to talk to the shop that did all the work on it for him - full service records. He had the 60k service done and had new tires. car has $12k in extras/upgrades-base price of $50k! car was/is spotless, other than some stone chips not one dent or scratch
- what i've done in 2 years- rear tires, OA separator, new ignition upgrade(did these myself) , bought a hard top(black) for$1500, and i am getting ready to replace the headers and exhaust with new SS sport cats and catless mid-pipes. that is because the one cat is going bad and had to do something;, put in new O2 sensors, P.O. did the CV boots right before i bought it. I have a local shop that will do my clutch and i will do the IMS upgrade(ceramic) when we do that this fall. - oil tests so far show no indication of an IMS break down. top is in perfect condition, car almost never saw rain, -- I think the way to go on these is to always get a car from someone who has all the records, well cared for and documented. in the end i got the car for $12k, -
Take the car to a respected shop that your other local PCA members or friends have used and can vouch for. I will have to do brakes and rotors soon but i can do all this myself, i will be doing the exhaust as well, if i could not i probably would not have a Porsche because i could not afford to always pay someone else to do those things for me( and i'm too cheap)

good luck, you will enjoy the car i am sure.

[Timco]

Originally Posted by recycledsixtie

I would not want to be lowballed and would not accept a lowball offer.
I would wait till a decent offer came up from somebody else. I would want my car to be in decent shape when I sold it. Tires would be decent and car would be mechanically sound.

I would encourage a prospective buyer to do a PPI but if they did not want to then fine.
G.

Totally agree. My car is never neglected to the point any common component that wears was neglected. If a PPI found anything, it would be news to me. Thus, unless the PPI said needs brakes and rotors and tires and all fluids are old, there's no reason to reduce the asking price whatsoever based on that. Prices are negotiated every day (I insisted on $500 off to sit down and sign that minute with someone else standing there wanting to drive it) but not based on any "might need" items. I knew a brake job and bearing were needed but I had already planned on refreshing everything anyway.