Upshifting and Downshifting - 986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners

SD987 · 09-13-2005, 03:48 PM

"...agree with everything you said except for positioning of the driver.

I was at an autocross and was having significant trouble keeping the car stable during downshifts. I was rev matching very well, I was holding the shifter correctly... I couldn't figure out what the problem was. I had someone ride with me and they said the problem was I was sitting too far away from the wheel and pedals. The guy who rode with me, a very experienced road racer and autocrosser, said that the optimum position for the driver is the one where you can press the clutch pedal completely in with your RIGHT foot. I adjusted my seat accordingly and have found driving on the street as well as the track much easier. By moving my seat that one position forward, it put everything where Porsche designed it to be. The shifter was more accessible and easier to operate as were all 3 of the pedals. "

Wombat, I tried what you said and although it took a bit to get used to I like it alot, although still maintaining good torso distance.

On another note, regarding rev matching, I've lately been using the technique where I match revs (blip) on a downshift on the way out of the higher gear and it works superbly.

To clarify:

Previously:

Brake
Clutch-in
Shift 4-N (or whatever)
Blip gas
Shift N-3
Clutch-out / gas

Currently:

Brake
Clutch-in
Shift 4-3 / Blip gas while performing full shift, somewhere between 4-N
Clutch-out / gas

Another case of no-duh to some of y'all, but it was new to me. And I feel quite Schumacher when doing it.
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wombat7 · 09-14-2005, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SD987

Wombat, I tried what you said and although it took a bit to get used to I like it alot, although still maintaining good torso distance.

The more you do it... the more you'll like it...

limoncello · 09-14-2005, 11:24 AM

I'm envious. My downshifting still needs work. My work-around is to, while standing on the brake, downshift at the closest point I can guess to minimize shaft loading. This does not provide max engine braking, but doesn't tear up the car either. I'm done with braking at turn in, in the right gear, and ready to get on the gas.
Fortunately, the Boxster has all kinds of brakes and loves to stop fast without relying on the heavy downshifting. Side note - my old Triumphs had lousy brakes, downshifting was a way of life, as was broken transmissions and diffs.
One of these days I'll get the heel/toe right...

pbadss · 08-31-2006, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SD987

On another note, regarding rev matching, I've lately been using the technique where I match revs (blip) on a downshift on the way out of the higher gear and it works superbly.

To clarify:

Previously:

Brake
Clutch-in
Shift 4-N (or whatever)
Blip gas
Shift N-3
Clutch-out / gas

Currently:

Brake
Clutch-in
Shift 4-3 / Blip gas while performing full shift, somewhere between 4-N
Clutch-out / gas

I'm trying to learn some better shifting habits...

I usually downshift this way..
Brake
Clutch-in
blip gas
shift 4-3 / sometimes still on gas if shifting 5 - 3
clutch out

Is this improper downshifting? I'm sure it's better to blip only when the gear is in neutral, but I feel like I might as well double-clutch if I'm waiting that long to rev-match.

comments appreciated!

z12358 · 08-31-2006, 02:25 PM

Just read this whole nice old thread...
I still can't believe people here (US) can get a driver's licence without passing the parallel parking and the incline start tests. To pass my driver's exam in Europe (among many other tests) in a very small car I had to stop on a very steep incline with three bulky inspectors on board. Going back even a tiny bit before driving off fails you on the test. And you HAVE to pass the test on a manual car regardless of whether you own an automatic or a manual.

There is no way with a manual shifter that you can avoid going back on a steep incline without the help of a hand brake. Theoretically it may be possible but it would be a very hectic endeavor and a very nasty lurch forward for sure. I have always used the hand brake and I have never rolled back. It takes a while to master the three moving parts (two feet + hand) but it's the proper technique and it's definitely worth practicing and learning.

denverpete · 08-31-2006, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by z12358

Just read this whole nice old thread...
I still can't believe people here (US) can get a driver's licence without passing the parallel parking and the incline start tests. To pass my driver's exam in Europe (among many other tests) in a very small car I had to stop on a very steep incline with three bulky inspectors on board. Going back even a tiny bit before driving off fails you on the test. And you HAVE to pass the test on a manual car regardless of whether you own an automatic or a manual.

There is no way with a manual shifter that you can avoid going back on a steep incline without the help of a hand brake. Theoretically it may be possible but it would be a very hectic endeavor and a very nasty lurch forward for sure. I have always used the hand brake and I have never rolled back. It takes a while to master the three moving parts (two feet + hand) but it's the proper technique and it's definitely worth practicing and learning.

I still can't believe they let you use brakes in Europe. Why when I took my test we had to use our FEET to stop the car - we didn't have no fancy "brakes". Parallel parking involved getting out and pushing the car sideways into the spot (I failed this the first couple of times when I rolled the car instead of sliding it).

It's funny, I've managed to not go backwards on inclines for 25 years without the use of a handbrake or without riding the clutch. Of course, maybe it's different in Europe.

MNBoxster · 08-31-2006, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by z12358

Just read this whole nice old thread...
I still can't believe people here (US) can get a driver's licence without passing the parallel parking and the incline start tests. To pass my driver's exam in Europe (among many other tests) in a very small car I had to stop on a very steep incline with three bulky inspectors on board. Going back even a tiny bit before driving off fails you on the test. And you HAVE to pass the test on a manual car regardless of whether you own an automatic or a manual.

There is no way with a manual shifter that you can avoid going back on a steep incline without the help of a hand brake. Theoretically it may be possible but it would be a very hectic endeavor and a very nasty lurch forward for sure. I have always used the hand brake and I have never rolled back. It takes a while to master the three moving parts (two feet + hand) but it's the proper technique and it's definitely worth practicing and learning.

Hi,

Each State here in the US has a different Drivers Test. In my state - Minnesota, we had to both parallel park and start on an incline, Illinois too when I took their test in the '80's...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

z12358 · 08-31-2006, 03:45 PM

denverpete:
"I still can't believe they let you use brakes in Europe. Why when I took my test we had to use our FEET to stop the car - we didn't have no fancy "brakes". Parallel parking involved getting out and pushing the car sideways into the spot (I failed this the first couple of times when I rolled the car instead of sliding it).

It's funny, I've managed to not go backwards on inclines for 25 years without the use of a handbrake or without riding the clutch. Of course, maybe it's different in Europe."

Forget geography. From what little I know of physics, I fail to discern the force that would match the gravity's downward pull during the (very brief) time it takes your right foot to move from the brake to the gas pedal. I'm assuming you only have two feet and you're not using either of them to stop your car -- like they taught you during the Driver's Test.