Start your box w/ no clutch...

[Stroked & Blown]

Originally Posted by blue2000s

...It reduces the stress on the crank while starting....

Can you explain that?
My thinking is that the the input shaft and other transmission components that are active while in neutral (trans pump?) would be a higher load than when the clutch is depressed. Though the difference is probably minimal.

[blue2000s]

Originally Posted by Stroked & Blown

Can you explain that?
My thinking is that the the input shaft and other transmission components that are active while in neutral (trans pump?) would be a higher load than when the clutch is depressed. Though the difference is probably minimal.

"The clutch sits in between the transmission and engine. It's bolted to the flywheel, and the flywheel is bolted to the crankshaft. Each time the clutch pedal is pushed in, the throw-out bearing pushes an amount of force on the pressure plate to dis-engage the clutch. This force applied to the pressure plate obviously puts an amount of force on the crankshaft."

"when starting the engine with the clutch pedal down, it's putting amount of force on the crank, and since the engine was off, there has not been any oil flow or oil pressure at all, possibly resulting in excessive wear on the thrust bearing. "

From: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/342560-crankwalk-depth-explanation.html

[Stroked & Blown]

Originally Posted by blue2000s

"The clutch sits in between the transmission and engine. It's bolted to the flywheel, and the flywheel is bolted to the crankshaft. Each time the clutch pedal is pushed in, the throw-out bearing pushes an amount of force on the pressure plate to dis-engage the clutch. This force applied to the pressure plate obviously puts an amount of force on the crankshaft."

"when starting the engine with the clutch pedal down, it's putting amount of force on the crank, and since the engine was off, there has not been any oil flow or oil pressure at all, possibly resulting in excessive wear on the thrust bearing. "

From: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/342560-crankwalk-depth-explanation.html

Ah, lateral crankshaft bearing load from the TO. Makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.

[blue2000s]

Originally Posted by Stroked & Blown

Ah, lateral crankshaft bearing load from the TO. Makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.

Play in the thrust bearing leads to play in the crank which can then cause wear on the other bearings. They refer to it as crank walk.

It does force the starter to spin the transmission when starting, which sits in tranny fluid and adds extra load to the starter. I had to press the clutch in to get my car to start one morning when it was -14F.

[Cloudsurfer]

Achieving this through a RoW flash is really a better solution, but either way, as long as you're not a moron (and don't let other morons drive your car), I don't see any practical safety compromise here.

Sitting at a stop in gear with the clutch pushed in isn't exactly ideal, but it's far better than having to push the clutch in during starting. Sure, there is oil film on things (especially with a good synthetic oil), but it's still a far cry from the level of lubrication you have once the engine is making oil pressure.

This issue becomes even more important for those of us who have stiffer than stock clutches. Crank walk is NOT a good thing.

[jaykay]

Ah just to help we are talking thrust load on the crank shaft (straight down the length if it) not a lateral or radial load..

What the best way to get hold of and install the ROW flash?

[jwade]

[QUOTE=What the best way to get hold of and install the ROW flash?[/QUOTE]

Have a friend that owns a PST2 or a dealer that is willing to do this for you....Which the later is almost unheard of....

[J Tinsby]

Originally Posted by blue2000s

"
"when starting the engine with the clutch pedal down, it's putting amount of force on the crank, and since the engine was off, there has not been any oil flow or oil pressure at all, possibly resulting in excessive wear on the thrust bearing. "

When starting there is minimal oil pressure while cranking, but any good oil will leave a microscopic film wherever it was. Otherwise we'd be replacing rings, bearings pistons cams etc all the time!

But I submit that the 'damage' to the thrust bearing caused by the short time it takes to fire the engine, is far worse when you sit at a traffic light with the car in gear and the clutch disengaged.

That's why when sitting a light I never have the car in gear, the clutch is engaged and my foot isn't resting on the pedal. When the light changes yellow for the oncoming traffic I slide into gear and am ready for the green.

Back in the day, British cars used a carbon release bearing, rather than a true bearing with balls in it. People used to come into the shop for a new clutch when all it needed was a new carbon bearing. In all my cars. over 40 of them, I have never replaced a clutch, release bearing or pressure plate or thrust bearing using the method I described above.

My 2 cents!

[blue2000s]

Originally Posted by J Tinsby

When starting there is minimal oil pressure while cranking, but any good oil will leave a microscopic film wherever it was. Otherwise we'd be replacing rings, bearings pistons cams etc all the time!

But I submit that the 'damage' to the thrust bearing caused by the short time it takes to fire the engine, is far worse when you sit at a traffic light with the car in gear and the clutch disengaged.

That's why when sitting a light I never have the car in gear, the clutch is engaged and my foot isn't resting on the pedal. When the light changes yellow for the oncoming traffic I slide into gear and am ready for the green.

Back in the day, British cars used a carbon release bearing, rather than a true bearing with balls in it. People used to come into the shop for a new clutch when all it needed was a new carbon bearing. In all my cars. over 40 of them, I have never replaced a clutch, release bearing or pressure plate or thrust bearing using the method I described above.

My 2 cents!

I guess I don't understand how the two are related? One is starting the car, the other is sitting at a stop light.