Shortlived Boxster engines survey

[Jager]

Originally Posted by globaldriver53

Good day, I'm new here;

I am due for new tires on my 2002 Boxster, I live in Southern Florida (hot year round), don't drive it much (30,000 miles in 9 years!), I don't take it to tracks either, but I do like to "open it up" from time to time, what tires do you recommend? I was looking at the Michelin Pilot Sport PS2.
Also on another subject, just replaced my battery for the second time, the car sits in my garage for weeks at the time, I work oversee, and the OEM batteries keep dying on me, won't recharge, so...I went to Costco and bought one of theirs, has a bit more cranking juice that the OEM, had to tape the vent tube to their venting port since it's oval, but apart from that it seems to work well. I have also ordered from Costco their 12V battery saver/charger/analyser, next time away I will plug it in the cigar lighter and see if it helps keeping the battery charged up. Do you have any experience or comment on that subject?

Thanks and happy driving

I'm not going to recommend any tires (someone will say I'm crazy) but I will be installing another set of Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric (Max Performance Summer) (made in Germany). I like the way these tires evenly wear across the tread especially on the rear set.

There are many good brands of tires out there; I will say you get what you pay for so avoid the inexpensive brands. On other cars I have owned (Corvette, Trans Am GTA) I had other brands of tires separate or prematurely ware-out but the Goodyear tires held-up well. There is nothing better than driving your car with a new set of tires on it... Enjoy!

Jager

[dmatz]

The original thread subject here was to report all premature Boxster engine failures. I'll dutifully report mine (from last week):

04 2.7L Boxster with 58-60K miles. Not particulary strenuously driven. Some extended (1-2 month) periods of disuse. Oil changes at 15K miles, 0W40 Mobil1. Possibly some bearing noise preceeding incident by a week or so. Engine failed at 5-10 mi/hr after a 20 mile commute (fwy+in town). Engine died, but re-started and fired on only a few cylinders, making horrendous clanking noises. Parked immediately. No smoke. All oil drained out when tilted onto flatbed towtruck. Metal debris in filter. Finally: IMS bearing stud seen to be snapped off when transmission removed.

Next step: crate engine for $18K. 2 yr warranty, but with >06 remanufacture date, IMS cannot be upgraded.

End of story.

[dbw]

I too have 2.7 2004 Boxster, 70,000km (45000 miles) with one month to go on my cpo warranty. Have tried to find a 2009 or newer but here in Winnipeg there is no selection on the local dealer. However, I have found a Europeon car repair centre that specializes in Poesche that does the IMS bearing replacement (along with the clutch). I'd like to buy a new 2012 but no word on when they might be available and a 2011 with the depreciation hit it'll take when the 2012 come out makes no sense. If I put the money into mine I'll keep it for a year or two. I was tempted to roll the dice and run it for a while but hearing stories like yours makes me shudder.
Dave

[Paul]

Porsche's sick sense of humor?

[Boxster_986]

Well I bought one....a 2001 Boxster with 34 K miles; I love it!! Unfortuenatly the lady who sold it to me moved up to a 2003 model with similar mileage.....hers just went BOOM! She also has a friend that has one similar year and mileage and seems to be holding together so far.

I'm scheduled to pay $2,300 for the IMS upgrade Monday, hopefully I make the 500 mile round trip to my brothers wedding over the weekend. I'll drive the piss out of her and maintain it for what it is; but fairly dissapointed. Sorry folks, one out of three isn't good odds IMHO. My next car might be another Bavarian product; the BMW M6 looks nice... I understand things happen but this is "clearly" something that has been swept under the rug.

Must admit my old man looks good playing in my new toy though...He has a BMW Z4; I think he secretly likes my Boxster better. :dance:

other points of interest...have had it up to 125MPH and carved some canyons...WOW, I might be a little pissy about the IMS issue but it "IS" a driving machine.

[Oaktown 986]

Originally Posted by Boxster_986

Well I bought one....a 2001 Boxster with 34 K miles; I love it!! Unfortuenatly the lady who sold it to me moved up to a 2003 model with similar mileage.....hers just went BOOM! She also has a friend that has one similar year and mileage and seems to be holding together so far.

I'm scheduled to pay $2,300 for the IMS upgrade Monday, hopefully I make the 500 mile round trip to my brothers wedding over the weekend. I'll drive the piss out of her and maintain it for what it is; but fairly dissapointed. Sorry folks, one out of three isn't good odds IMHO. My next car might be another Bavarian product; the BMW M6 looks nice... I understand things happen but this is "clearly" something that has been swept under the rug.

Must admit my old man looks good playing in my new toy though...He has a BMW Z4; I think he secretly likes my Boxster better. :dance:

other points of interest...have had it up to 125MPH and carved some canyons...WOW, I might be a little pissy about the IMS issue but it "IS" a driving machine.

That's a tad high a price to pay, no?

[Boxster_986]

Originally Posted by Oaktown 986

That's a tad high a price to pay, no?

Yes, a pinch I suppose. I live in a smaller area and only about three local indi shops. One didn't have all the tools the other said just drive it and don't worry about it....the third told me what I wanted to hear and sounded like he knew what he's doing. I'm not interested in looking for another high mileage used engine should it come to that cause this one runs so well.

My car has all the main concerns regarding IMS...low miles, gently driven or at least not driven like their meant to be etc... Sucks, but I don't want to always have the idea of a "probable" engine failure on my daily driver. Its a clean car that I got for a fair price and will be my daily driver so worth getting done I figure.

[mikefocke]

any car can go boom. Just got quoted $7800 to replace the trans in my wife's Acura. 7/70 warranty on a known defective trans and mine went at 10/72. So AAMCO fixed it for $4k less with a 3/36 warranty nationwide transferable.

So far my Boxster has been much cheaper to repair than either of my non-Porsche products of the same era. Too small a sample but at least it counters the sample of 3 posted above.

[mikefocke]

if it makes the car please you more and worry you less...then maintenance and continued ownership makes sense.

When it doesn't, sell (just did..age of driver and health of wife). EJ got a great car.

[Bobiam]

Originally Posted by mikefocke

any car can go boom. Just got quoted $7800 to replace the trans in my wife's Acura. 7/70 warranty on a known defective trans and mine went at 10/72. So AAMCO fixed it for $4k less with a 3/36 warranty nationwide transferable.

So far my Boxster has been much cheaper to repair than either of my non-Porsche products of the same era. Too small a sample but at least it counters the sample of 3 posted above.

An automatic trans is small change compared to an IMS crashed Porsche engine. This disaster is happening to people who's cars are only worth 50% +/- more that the repair cost.
Transmissions are almost expected to fail......maybe somewhere between 70,000 and 150,000 miles. And that's not too bad when you consider the cost of replacement with a warrantee as you have shared with us. An IMS failure can occur between 30K and never, and it can easily cost $12,000.

[Boxster_986]

Bearing not yet pulled from my 01 Boxster as garage is waiting on L&N kit and tools. However I can report RMS is dry at 34K miles, clutch pad ok but going to replace anyway, small leak or gasket on timing chain cam. Be interesting to see under the bearing seal on this car with it's lower mileage and gently driven history...also I believe sat in a garage in Seattle and figure moisture has had to have gotten in that bearing.....

All said feel good about getting the upgrade considering my friends Boxster blew up at 35K.

[Boxster_986]

Well, cost me about 3K in total for the L&N upgrade on my 2001 Boxster with 35K. The upgrade also included upgraded RMS and new clutch disk/bearing and some new cam seals (small leak). After buying the car about three months ago the lady that sold me mine had a catastrophic IMS failure on her newer model 2005 with only 23K miles..... I decided that the pain of looking for replacement engine (that could also fail) was not worth the worry and potential expense.

The mechanic said my bearing was good; and I only found small amounts of play if I really pushed hard from side to side or in and out, probably normal condition. I was unimpressed with how easily the seals can be popped off with a screwdriver and don't believe there was much grease in there after I did. All said the theory holds water with me that grease is leaking out in a hot environment the bearing was not designed for...although the inside of the bearing was lubricated it was more a mixture of some oil and residual grease (but I don't know about this particular grease viscosity)... I would be guessing, but could see the bearing failing at some point down the road...feel much better with ceramic balls, better race, and no seals in that each time I'm changing the oil it "REALLY" is doing some good! Now I will DRIVE is like it's REALLY stolen!!! :dance:

[derf]

June 22, 2011

I went to Rector Porsche in Burlingame, California. I talked to the service manager told them the intermediate shaft bearing went out and the engine is dead on my 2003 Boxster at 74,000 miles. He asked, “How do you know that the intermediate shaft went out?” I told him the car was making a strange sound and I took it to an independent shop. The mechanic observed a lot of metal in the oil, showing that the engine was ruined. He listened to the engine with a stethoscope and determined that the sound he was hearing was the intermediate shaft bearing going out. Then I said to the service manager, “What should I do? I understand a new engine is quite expensive.” He wrote a number down on a Post-it note and handed it to me. He said, “I’ve heard good things from customers about this company.” He gave me the name and phone number of an auto dismantler.

http://www.ladismantler.com/

I called the auto dismantler. He told me to take pictures of the car and email them to him. He would give me a price for which he would buy the car. He said the typical range was between $1,000 and $5,000 depending on the number of options the car had.


In summary:

• When discussing my options with the service manager, I was never encouraged to invest money in the car and was given a clear indication that the car wasn’t worth fixing and should be junked.

Porsche does not stand behind the quality of its products, although it claims to be a maker of high-end, high-quality vehicles. I had planned to keep my car for many more years. I would never have purchased it if I had known the engine contained a ticking time bomb that is essentially, a defect. This is a $40,000 car that is built to expire at 70,000 miles and become an instant candidate for the junkyard. The dealership itself acknowledged this fact. On one visit, I asked the service manager and another service employee at what point they would advise I sell the car. They both said 70,000 miles. My engine blew up at 74,000 miles.

[blue2000s]

Originally Posted by derf

June 22, 2011

I went to Rector Porsche in Burlingame, California. I talked to the service manager told them the intermediate shaft bearing went out and the engine is dead on my 2003 Boxster at 74,000 miles. He asked, “How do you know that the intermediate shaft went out?” I told him the car was making a strange sound and I took it to an independent shop. The mechanic observed a lot of metal in the oil, showing that the engine was ruined. He listened to the engine with a stethoscope and determined that the sound he was hearing was the intermediate shaft bearing going out. Then I said to the service manager, “What should I do? I understand a new engine is quite expensive.” He wrote a number down on a Post-it note and handed it to me. He said, “I’ve heard good things from customers about this company.” He gave me the name and phone number of an auto dismantler.

http://www.ladismantler.com/

I called the auto dismantler. He told me to take pictures of the car and email them to him. He would give me a price for which he would buy the car. He said the typical range was between $1,000 and $5,000 depending on the number of options the car had.


In summary:

• When discussing my options with the service manager, I was never encouraged to invest money in the car and was given a clear indication that the car wasn’t worth fixing and should be junked.

Porsche does not stand behind the quality of its products, although it claims to be a maker of high-end, high-quality vehicles. I had planned to keep my car for many more years. I would never have purchased it if I had known the engine contained a ticking time bomb that is essentially, a defect. This is a $40,000 car that is built to expire at 70,000 miles and become an instant candidate for the junkyard. The dealership itself acknowledged this fact. On one visit, I asked the service manager and another service employee at what point they would advise I sell the car. They both said 70,000 miles. My engine blew up at 74,000 miles.

I think what I'd take away from your conversation is that dealers want to sell new cars and will take every opportunity they can to try to get you to dump the old one. Also, never take advice from the dealer, their motivation probably doesn't align with yours.

[derf]

Originally Posted by blue2000s

I think what I'd take away from your conversation is that dealers want to sell new cars and will take every opportunity they can to try to get you to dump the old one. Also, never take advice from the dealer, their motivation probably doesn't align with yours.

When thinking of the thousands of dollars the dealership made from my warranty repairs, (some of which the car did not need). Now that the intermediate shaft went, the dealership tells me -- junk the car.

I've never lost an engine or the depreciation on any of my cars as I have on the 2003 Porsche Boxster witn tiptronic.

Unforgivable

Cars I’ve owned

1959 Jaguar XK 150 Drop Head Coup
1964 Jaguare XKE
Triumph TR3, TR4, Spitfire
Porsche 928
1988 BMW M5, 1997 BMW M3, 1980 BMW 323, 1991 BMW 325i,
1996 Toyota Tacoma
2009 VW TDI

And many more.

[J Tinsby]

Originally Posted by derf

When thinking of the thousands of dollars the dealership made from my warranty repairs, (some of which the car did not need). Now that the intermediate shaft went, the dealership tells me -- junk the car.

It's easy to see why you are upset, any right thinking person would feel the same way. I totally agree that you have every right to expect something exceptional from Porsche not substandard in it's design. It doesn't matter the frequency of the failures in the entire world, you are the the latest one to experience it and yours is the only opinion that matters.

There was a time when I bemoaned selling my 2004 550 Boxster Spyder Anniversary Edition, until I was made aware of the IMS trouble. Now I'm glad it's gone, someone got a beautiful car but they also got the IMS with it.

Between the "D" Chunk cylinder problem and the IMS it makes me wonder how Boxsters are so prevalent.

I have never experienced a catastrophic engine failure on any of the 40 cars I have previously owned. Granted they weren't all Porsches but still and all never a failure in even the most lowly of them, right up to the most expensive.

Just goes to show you don't always "get what you paid for."

I wish you well and maybe you can find a cheap solution to get out of the pit of despair you find yourself in currently.

Whoever at Porsche thought that sealing grease in a bearing and then immersing it in hot engine oil and expecting the grease to stay IN needs to seek help. Too bad no class action suit was ever started when the problem first appeared.

Good luck with it all

[Bobiam]

J. Tinsby said...."Whoever at Porsche thought that sealing grease in a bearing and then immersing it in hot engine oil and expecting the grease to stay IN needs to seek help. Too bad no class action suit was ever started when the problem first appeared."

Does sort of make me loose faith in their vast engineering knowledge and big R&D budget. Think about it.....They put a bearing inside of an engine that could easily deliver continuous lubrication to it, but choose to put seals on it and give it a few drops of grease to last it the car's lifetime. Yeah, ya can do this with a water pump.....but not an intermediate shaft that handles the timing chain!!!!!! The warrantee on this item should have been extended to 100,000 miles. Not all of their customers can afford to throw away a car worth $10,000-30,000. Porsche couldn't even create the fix that aftermarket shops did! But that would require admitting that they designed a time bomb defect into the motor.

[buckstr]

I don't know the cause yet, but my engine died last week after a bit over 25K miles of routine, occasionally sporty driving. The only warning was a loud ticking sound about 2 miles before it shut down entirely. It turned over once or twice after shutting down but never fired. I'm now also facing the "Do I replace the engine?" question. All of the comments on this forum don't give me a warm feeling about buying a remanufactured engine that's worth as much as the car.

[bcuster]

I bought the 02 S with 45,000 miles...perfectly maintained...all records at local Porsche dealer. Last week I hear some slight "ticks" coming from the engine compartment. A few miles later a bit louder...call dealership to schedule coming in the next day...on the way home a little louder and power drops. Stop car and call the tow wagon....every bit of oil put in by dealership the previous week during 10K oil change runs down the tow bed as it heads to the dealership. IMS failure..thank God for the warranty..will let everyone know how this story ends :
:ah:

[Paul]

Originally Posted by buckstr

I don't know the cause yet, but my engine died last week after a bit over 25K miles of routine, occasionally sporty driving. The only warning was a loud ticking sound about 2 miles before it shut down entirely. It turned over once or twice after shutting down but never fired. I'm now also facing the "Do I replace the engine?" question. All of the comments on this forum don't give me a warm feeling about buying a remanufactured engine that's worth as much as the car.

Having gone with this personally and with others, my advice, don't spend another penny on it. Immediately auction it the way it is. Consider it totaled and run away.

Even a used motor will result in costs higher than the value of most Boxsters.