Speeding Ticket - The Fight Begins

[Grizzly]

Originally Posted by dbth

Have to disagree again on this strategy.
What difference does it make that the driver knew he was speeding , the onus is on the government to prove it.
Your constitutional rights allow you to defend yourself and the burden of proof is on the prosecutor.If you or your counsel don't think they can meet the burden of proof , dont give in.
If pleading guilty and paying the fine is in YOUR OWN BEST INTEREST (financially and/or emotionally), go ahead.

Otherwise , you are innocent until they can prove you guilty.

It amazes me that those who are so vehement about the 2nd amendment , will reliquish the 5 & 6 amendment so quickly.

Never give up your rights.

I agree that the onus is on the Government to prove its case, but remember that whether done in writing or in person on the stand, David will swear under penalty of perjury, to tell the truth about the incident. Several posts in this thread have complained that law enforcement doesn't play fairly in its highway enforcement or during the adjudication process. Somehow, however, we think it's O.K. for David to not play by the rules. David has already told us that he was speeding. We know that to be the truth because he told us it was. In the 986 forum's version of court, the Highway Patrol must come to court, tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, and accused gets to lie his ass off? Then the onus is on the Government to prove its case? Is that how it works? Apparently I must have slept through some of my classes.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by Grizzly

I agree that the onus is on the Government to prove its case, but remember that whether done in writing or in person on the stand, David will swear under penalty of perjury, to tell the truth about the incident. Several posts in this thread have complained that law enforcement doesn't play fairly in its highway enforcement or during the adjudication process. Somehow, however, we think it's O.K. for David to not play by the rules. David has already told us that he was speeding. We know that to be the truth because he told us it was. In the 986 forum's version of court, the Highway Patrol must come to court, tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, and accused gets to lie his ass off? Then the onus is on the Government to prove its case? Is that how it works? Apparently I must have slept through some of my classes.

Very well said, Griz!

My last speeding ticket was in 1971. I was speeding, I knew it and deserved the ticket. It never ocurred to me that I should fight it, in that I KNEW I was guilty!

It did not even ocur to me that I could beat the rap because MAYBE the cop wasn't PERFECT in the way that he caught me. He caught me AND I was speeding. I paid the ticket and moved on.

Candidly, had I decided to fight that ticket, I would have been a hypocrite. If you believe in the rule of law, don't cry if it bites you in the butt.

Human's are fascinating, they can rationalize anything if it is what they want to believe.

Frankly, I am so tired of these ticket threads.

My advice, if you were speeding, don't post here asking for information about how to beat the ticket. I waill simply delete the thread.

Now, if you were NOT speeding (and you know who you are!) then, ask for help in proving your case. That is an ethical and principled way to act.

To you others, hire a shark lawyer, pay the fees and leave us alone.

[Brucelee]

Oh, one last point.

Well, you see there was this pedophile who had raped and murdered a young child.

He frequented a Porche forum and he posted, stated that he DID commit the crime but he was pretty sure the cops did not do his arrest in just the pefect/legal way.

He was asking the readers of the forum for some help in how to beat this rap. After all, his RIGHTS maybe had been violated and he thought the readers of the forum would all gather around and help him fight the good fight.



Well, .................................................?

[B&TRepair]

Originally Posted by Brucelee

Oh, one last point.

Well, you see there was this pedophile who had raped and murdered a young child.

He frequented a Porche forum and he posted, stated that he DID commit the crime but he was pretty sure the cops did not do his arrest in just the pefect/legal way.

He was asking the readers of the forum for some help in how to beat this rap. After all, his RIGHTS maybe had been violated and he thought the readers of the forum would all gather around and help him fight the good fight.



Well, .................................................?

The crimes are truly unequal so the comparison is moot. Of the same officers who wrote citations that day, some went home at warp nine with a few belts in them to boot. It's the unspoken job perk known as the brass pass. The best move is to either hire a lawyer or go to court, be very polite and don't lie. Chances are good it may be slightly reduced, especially if your record shows no chronic behavior.

[Grizzly]

Originally Posted by dbth

#1-You cannot commit perjury unless you testify.
The 5th amendment protects oneself from self incrimination.
The accused does not have to testify , only plead not guilty.
If the state can't prove the charge , he is not guilty.

O.K., let me get this straight. You're saying that David should go to traffic court, allow the prosecution to put on the Government's case, and then sit there like a mushroom so that he doesn't perjure himself?

Yeah, David, do that. Let me know how it works out for you.

Or better yet, actually plead the fifth in traffic court. Classic.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by Grizzly

O.K., let me get this straight. You're saying that David should go to traffic court, allow the prosecution to put on the Government's case, and then sit there like a mushroom so that he doesn't perjure himself?

Yeah, David, do that. Let me know how it works out for you.

Or better yet, actually plead the fifth in traffic court. Classic.

Perhaps David should hire DB to represent him in his case.

Then, perhaps JUSTICE will be served.

[David N.]

Let's be civil everyone, this is only a discussion. I'm accused of breaking one rule in a set of rules. Another rule exists on how broken rules are properly detected, I believe that rule was broken as well by the cop. It just so happens an additional rule in this set of rules allows me to fight my penalty because of something like that. I think the outcome of this fight would be informative to people here, that's why I posted this topic.

I'm not claiming innocence, I'm claiming due process. I'm not trying to absolve myself of the murder of a child, I'm trying to get out of paying my insurance company excess cash for being accused of a moving violation without enough evidence. That and that alone.

A spade is just a spade.

-David

[GmanMD]

David,

You do have a rather large problem here because your ticket is for doing 90 in a 65 mph zone. That is 25 mph over the limit and a rather hefty fine and points on the your license, and possibly license suspension in some states. Now, I don't want to get into the whole fight vs. fess-up argument, but often if you go to court you may have your fine and/or citation reduced where the impact on your insurance is much less. The state is happy as they still get their money and you're somewhat happy that your liability is reduced. It may even be worth it to get a lawyer on this one.

[trube78]

not to commit felonies. I see a basic problem with being responsible and understanding that acting irresponsibly will result in someone holding you accountable. In fact, I see many parents do not teach their children about responsible behavior. (I work at a University)

I hate these speeding posts and wish they would be removed. If you decide to speed and get caught. Man up and be responsible for your behavior. You were speeding and he caught you. I guess it is easier for some folks to look at their faults in the mirror than others.

[Brucelee]

Originally Posted by dbth

I give up.
Surrender your rights.

But keep your GUN and 2nd ammendment.

Peace out.

You of course, fail to see the point.

This guy has legal rights and he is free to exercise them.

He can ask for help from us to dodge what he did.

We are free to advise him to suck it up and do the time.

This has nothing to do with second amendment rights.

If you think so, well, you are free to do that to.